Oil filters on flatheads

[[email protected]]

I have two flathead vehicles. I have removed the oil filters from both of them. Are there many of you out there that run flatheads without oil filters? I change the oil at least once a year or every thousand miles, which ever comes first.

I never felt that the bi-pass filters were very effective. Maybe I am wrong. I think that today's modern high detergent oils do a great job of keeping the engine clean. I've still got the original Ford filters, cans, lines , etc. Should I consider putting them back on? Curious about what thoughts are out there.

Thanks!

Bill

[tubman]

In my opinion, you are wrong in your thinking. On the odd chance that something gets ingested into your engine that would harm it, you have no protection at all. But, given the way most of these cars are driven these days, the chance of something getting into the engine are remote.

But then, I have always been a "Belt and Suspenders" type of guy when it comes to engines. What I don't understand is why someone would remove any type engine protection; I kinda bitched about the cost of filters before, but they just make a lot of sense.

[cas3]

it has been a never ending discussion here. some folks run without em and some folks say you need em. you are correct, we have better oils today, and most take better care of the car than when it was in service years ago. so, take your pick to filter or not!

[Glenn Thoreson]

The crank case ventilation system on these things is wide open to the atmosphere. That means that fine abrasive dirt particles can, and will get in the oil. Poo-poo the bypass filters all you want. All the oil gets filtered quicker than you would think and any filtration is better than none. If filter availability and cost is a concern, use a remote filter adapter that takes a modern Ford or GM screw on filter that costs less than half what the stock filter costs.

[pooch]

Probably the newer oils with detergent and no oil filter is the worst thing for an engine.

Detergent oil keeps junk and debris in suspension so they can continue to chew out the innards every trip around.

You need an oil fliter to filter out the particles, funny thing is, a full flow filter only filters particles out of a size bigger than about .001 inch.

I read that a flathead crank clearance can be as low as .000 inch.

[Bored&Stroked]

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I guess there is another way of thinking to add . . . what could the oil filter possibly hurt? There are many different types of bypass filters that do a great job of filtering the oil, but not necessarily protecting the bearings from something getting into them (as they are bypass). I happen to believe in 100% full-flow type filters - but I realize they are NOT a standard item on a flathead and they are not easy to retro-fit (pretty much impossible if the engine is in the car). If I had a running engine, I'd put on a bypass filter - if I'm rebuilding an engine from scratch, then I'll put the extra time, $$$ into a full-flow system.

[40cpe]

If the filter media in a full flow filter can't handle the output of the oil pump (and I doubt it can), you have unfiltered oil going into the engine through the by pass valve. True, it all gets filtered, just not every cycle through the engine.

[Ronnieroadster]

Originally Posted by 40cpe

If the filter media in a full flow filter can't handle the output of the oil pump (and I doubt it can), you have unfiltered oil going into the engine through the by pass valve. True, it all gets filtered, just not every cycle through the engine.

The Flathead factory filter is always a bypass just a very little flow is being directed to that large canister filter from the main oil passage in the block. The brass fitting located on the outside of the housing has a very small hole so the actual pressure loss caused by this system is low to match the actual filtering its doing which is also very low. Eliminating that filter bypass system increases actual oil pressure and delivery to the engine.

[JSeery]

Originally Posted by 40cpe

If the filter media in a full flow filter can't handle the output of the oil pump (and I doubt it can), you have unfiltered oil going into the engine through the by pass valve. True, it all gets filtered, just not every cycle through the engine.

Why would a flathead be in different than a modern engine is this regard. Oil flow rate out of the oil pump should be comparable. A good spin on type filter should not be by-passing oil with proper change intervals.

[40cpe]

I put a gauge of both sides of my 95% filter and it read 10# lower on the out put side. It takes ~ 10# to open the bypass. The Wix filter shows a flow rate of 7-9 gpm, I don't know what the output of a flathead oil pump is. There is no difference in a modern engine, I think they all bypass some. No proof, just an opinion.

[pooch]

I wonder what a modern oil filter bypass sprung ball is set at ?

Obviously it would be higher than the main oil relief valve, or it would be open all the time, but how much more.

[Lawrie]

Pooch the bypass valve in the oil filter only measures the differential pressure ,that is the difference between the oil going in and the oil coming out of the filter,that is called the pressure drop over the filter.
On my A it is about 3.5 psi hot at 40mph.
I use the oil filter from a 6cyl falcon on my v8,s as they have the bypass valve in them,
the valve is there to still allow oil to get to the engine if the filter is not changed and becomes clogged or the engine is reved up with cold oil.
Lawrie

[Ol' Ron]

I lost a crank here recently because I had the filter lines reversed. and thus the bearings got no oil. I post this because, I, we, sometimes can't think right. The filter had been ttempoarly been mounted on the engine. I moved it down on the fram out of the way, and easy to change when drainibg the oil. And the lines got reversed.

[supereal]

If you believe that the bypass filter isn't effective, just forget to tighten the cap when you change the element and observe the oil shower! Don't ask me how I know that! I buy the elements at a local NAPA store where they still stock them for the Ford tractor owners Old Henry Ford didn't believe in filters. That is why the intake of the Model A carb points toward the rear of the vehicle. He thought that the plentiful dust and dirt on the old roads wouldn't enter the carb as long as the car was moving forward!

[19Fordy]

I don't run a filter, but I do think the OEM filter is a good idea.

[Y-Blockhead]

Originally Posted by supereal

Old Henry Ford didn't believe in filters. That is why the intake of the Model A carb points toward the rear of the vehicle. He thought that the plentiful dust and dirt on the old roads wouldn't enter the carb as long as the car was moving forward!

Plus it has to travel up...

[Andy]

I run a modern FL1A Ford filter and a PCV valve. The engine stays clean and so does the oil. Also I sleep better.

[NealinCA]

Does anyone have a great trick to mounting a stock type oil filter on aftermarket finned aluminum heads?

[Brian]

Does anyone have a great trick to mounting a stock type oil filter on aftermarket finned aluminum heads?

If you're running studs, replace the appropriate head nuts with longer nuts, so you can use 7/16 UNF bolts into the topside of the longer nuts to attach your filter. Use the longer nuts to clear the fins.

[Bubsyouruncle]

I managed to screw up the internal threads on the brass block T-fitting for my factory-installed bypass filter on a '47 v-8 engine.

Can anyone help me? I would like to start using it again.

[tubman]

Originally Posted by Bubsyouruncle

I managed to screw up the internal threads on the brass block T-fitting for my factory-installed bypass filter on a '47 v-8 engine.

Can anyone help me? I would like to start using it again.

While it doesn't state a definitive source for that part, this thread may be of help : https://www.fordbarn.com/forum/showt...filter+fitting

[[email protected]]

I'm the guy who posted the original thread. Wow! Lots of good thoughts and very interesting-

Thanks!

Bill::

[tubman]

Originally Posted by NealinCA

Does anyone have a great trick to mounting a stock type oil filter on aftermarket finned aluminum heads?

Offenhauser used to make a part just for this. It was made of aluminum and bolted to the head bolts, the other side had three tapped holes that picked up the mounting points of a standard 8BA filter. I had one I picked up at the Chickashaw swap meet about 20 years ago. Unfortunately, I sold it several years ago. You might want to go to the "Exeter Speed Shop" web site where they have the entire Offenhauser catalog in pdf format. I think there is a picture of one there which may help in find one or perhaps making an analog.

[flatheadmurre]

Another trick is long nuts (coupling nuts) used as spacers and a std filter that fits to the headbolts.
They come in stainless if you want it nice and shiny.

[40 Deluxe]

Originally Posted by supereal

If you believe that the bypass filter isn't effective, just forget to tighten the cap when you change the element and observe the oil shower! Don't ask me how I know that! I buy the elements at a local NAPA store where they still stock them for the Ford tractor owners Old Henry Ford didn't believe in filters. That is why the intake of the Model A carb points toward the rear of the vehicle. He thought that the plentiful dust and dirt on the old roads wouldn't enter the carb as long as the car was moving forward!

That Henry Ford "quote" sounds bogus! Do you have a reliable source for it?

[40 Deluxe]

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On Ford's (the company) view of bypass filters, the original manual for my 1940 states to change the oil every 2,000 miles if the engine does not have a filter. On filter equipped engines a 5,000 mile change interval is recommended, and the filter element changed every 10,000 miles.

[[email protected]]

I wrote the original post. I think I am convinced. This winter I will be re-installing the Ford bi-pass filter on my one flathead that does not have one. Many thanks for all of the comments and ideas. There is lots of wisdom and knowledge at the Ford Barn - great group!

Bill in Conn.

[JSeery]

One thing to keep in mind is that a by-pass filter can filter to a much smaller micron size compared to a full-flow filter. A lot of modern diesels use by-pass filters for that reason.

[34PKUP]

Originally Posted by JSeery

One thing to keep in mind is that a by-pass filter can filter to a much smaller micron size compared to a full-flow filter. A lot of modern diesels use by-pass filters for that reason.

Also keep in mind that the by-pass filters used on diesels are capable of a smaller micron size than the commonly used Ford replacement by-pass filters.

[JSeery]

What is the filtration size on the flathead filters?

Is the Wix 51006/NAPA 1006 a good number? It is rated at 32 micron.

[ford38v8]

Bypass filters, by their nature, are able to slow down the flow of oil as the filters load up, without affecting oil flow to the bearings. Modern filters must pass oil without a major drop in pressure/volume, so the finer particles are passed, and as they load up, their safety valves open to pass without filtration at all. The bypass filters not only screen out finer particles, but they require only 10 miles of driving for about 95% of all the oil to pass through the filter at least once. A feature that all oil filters share is the added total volume of oil in the system, which is helpful in keeping the engine cool, as well as preventing the oil itself from breaking down from excess heat. All cars today need a filter of some kind, due to the modern detergent oil suspending particles rather than allowing them to drop out overnight, becoming sludge in valve galleys and oil pans.

[51 MERC-CT]

Originally Posted by JSeery

What is the filtration size on the flathead filters?

Is the Wix 51006/NAPA 1006 a good number? It is rated at 32 micron.

Those are the normally installed replacement filters. Don't know what the micron rating is but have heard from 10 to 25 micron.
I am running an Amsoil by-pass filter rated in the 2-3 micron range, same rating as the ones used on the diesels.
In a measured test at idle speed the filter passed 5 Qts. of oil in 11 minutes.

[ford38v8]

[QUOTE=51 MERC-CT;1690436]Those are the normally installed replacement filters. Don't know what the micron rating is but have heard from 10 to 25 micron.
I am running an Amsoil by-pass filter rated in the 2-3 micron range, same rating as the ones used on the diesels.
In a measured test at idle speed the filter passed 5 Qts. of oil in 11 minutes.

so, at cruising speed, about 4+ times the volume? That sounds roughly equivalent to 20+ qts filtered to attain the 95% in 10 miles of cruising. This is sounding so good, I wonder what advantage there could be to use 100% filtered on modern cars?

[51 MERC-CT]

[QUOTE=ford38v8;1690494]

Originally Posted by 51 MERC-CT

Those are the normally installed replacement filters. Don't know what the micron rating is but have heard from 10 to 25 micron.
I am running an Amsoil by-pass filter rated in the 2-3 micron range, same rating as the ones used on the diesels.
In a measured test at idle speed the filter passed 5 Qts. of oil in 11 minutes.

so, at cruising speed, about 4+ times the volume? That sounds roughly equivalent to 20+ qts filtered to attain the 95% in 10 miles of cruising. This is sounding so good, I wonder what advantage there could be to use 100% filtered on modern cars?

The test was done with the engine idling with oil pressure at appox. 20#.
The .060 dia. restriction hole determines how much volume is delivered at what oil pressure.
At a higher oil pressure there may be an increased percentage of volume, but not by a factor of 4 as you speculate.

[ford38v8]

[QUOTE=51 MERC-CT;1690511]

Originally Posted by ford38v8

The test was done with the engine idling with oil pressure at appox. 20#.
The .060 dia. restriction hole determines how much volume is delivered at what oil pressure.
At a higher oil pressure there may be an increased percentage of volume, but not by a factor of 4 as you speculate.

What was I thinking?

[JM 35 Sedan]

The debate to use an oil filter, or not, on a flathead engine will probably never end. Regardless of what Henry Ford did in the early days of his Flathead powered vehicles, in my way of thinking, how many modern gas or diesel engine vehicles are being produced today without an oil filter? It just makes good sense to me, if I'm working on one of my Flathead engines, and have the ability to add an oil filtering system, I'm going to do it.

[Drbrown]

For what its worth, my '47 never had a filter. It was rebuilt I don't know how many years age, now has 35,000 on rebuild, doesn't leak or burn oil, 70 lbs at cold idle/20 at hot idle, use 10w-30 and change every 1,000 miles.

[tubman]

I'm with "JM" on this. I have just finished my 258' rebuild and I am going to look into one of those Amsoil filters for it. They look to me to be the ideal filter for these engines with the finer filter and the volume "51 MERC-CT" has posted, especially the way these cars are used. I will keep the present stock setup on my '51 Ford.

[dumb person]

Legend has it modern oils do not break down with heat nearly as fast as old oil does.
The important part is to keep your oil clean, you could reduce the changes to 20-50,000 miles and only replace the filter, if you could filter it finely enough! (Change the filter on a modern car every 1,000 KMs and see how long the oil lasts.) A bypass filter would be a great asset to modern engines.

I'll let you guy figure out how to do that.

[tubman]

Originally Posted by dumb person

Legend has it modern oils do not break down with heat nearly as fast as old oil does.
The important part is to keep your oil clean, you could reduce the changes to 20-50,000 miles and only replace the filter, if you could filter it finely enough! (Change the filter on a modern car every 1,000 KMs and see how long the oil lasts.) A bypass filter would be a great asset to modern engines.

I'll let you guy figure out how to do that.

One way to do it is with a Frantz or similar type add-on filter. My dad sold them in the fifties and sixties and always added one to each new Oldsmobile he bought. Each one came with two tags. The first was like a regular old style "oil change tag" you used to stick on the door jamb. The second was the same format, but made of blotting paper and was divided up into several segments. You were to touch your dipstick into the corresponding spot every 200 miles after installing the Frantz filter. The oil would be absorbed by the blotting paper, and would show how "dirty" it was. It was amazing to watch the spots get lighter and lighter with each 200 miles that passed. It made me a believer.

[51 MERC-CT]

Originally Posted by tubman

One way to do it is with a Frantz or similar type add-on filter. My dad sold them in the fifties and sixties and always added one to each new Oldsmobile he bought. Each one came with two tags. The first was like a regular old style "oil change tag" you used to stick on the door jamb. The second was the same format, but made of blotting paper and was divided up into several segments. You were to touch your dipstick into the corresponding spot every 200 miles after installing the Frantz filter. The oil would be absorbed by the blotting paper, and would show how "dirty" it was. It was amazing to watch the spots get lighter and lighter with each 200 miles that passed. It made me a believer.

If I didn't want something that would fit inside the original canister (out of sight), I would probably have gone with the Frantz system.
The toilet paper replacement filters are much cheaper.

[davids2toys]

Hi,
I am new to the flat-head world and have already learned a ton. I have a 36 Ford with a 49-53 Merc Flathead V8 with no oil filter. I would like to put on a filter and then maybe start running conventional oil instead of straight 30W. I have seen a couple of filters for sale lately, and from what I am understanding so far I would want to run it as a partial system, Can anybody tell me how this would hook up to my engine? I know it mounts to the head bolts but have no idea how the oil gets to the filter and then back to the pan. Any help would be appreciated.
Thanks...Dave

[tubman]

I would suggest that you find a stock 8BA setup. (It will bolt directly to the head unless you have an early '49 engine.) The "Partial Full Flow" system will require drilling and tapping of the block that is difficult and risky on an engine in a car. There should be a port with a 1/8" pipe plug on the right rear of the engine that is the outlet to the filter. There should also be a return port on the oil pan with a similar plug. I would expect that someone has removed the stock filter from your engine at some earlier time.

My considered opinion is that, for the way these cars are currently used, the stock Ford bypass filter system is superior to a full flow conversion. Typically, these cars are used sparingly on paved roads and have frequent oil changes. The stock bypass filter will remove much smaller particles than a full flow unit and provide better overall cleaning of the oil. If you are going to do several thousand miles a month on dirt roads, then you should probably consider pulling the engine and converting to a complete full flow system.

One last thing. I would not use non-detergent oil under any circumstances. If the engine has been run with non-detergent oil, the sludge is probably so built up that the detergent oil won't break anything loose. But at least it won't build up any more sludge.

[paul2748]

Have you checked with NAPA or any other well stocked parts store?

Originally Posted by Bubsyouruncle

I managed to screw up the internal threads on the brass block T-fitting for my factory-installed bypass filter on a '47 v-8 engine.

Can anyone help me? I would like to start using it again.

[51 MERC-CT]

Originally Posted by davids2toys

Hi,
I am new to the flat-head world and have already learned a ton. I have a 36 Ford with a 49-53 Merc Flathead V8 with no oil filter. I would like to put on a filter and then maybe start running conventional oil instead of straight 30W. I have seen a couple of filters for sale lately, and from what I am understanding so far I would want to run it as a partial system, Can anybody tell me how this would hook up to my engine? I know it mounts to the head bolts but have no idea how the oil gets to the filter and then back to the pan. Any help would be appreciated.
Thanks...Dave

As stated, look for a stock setup for '50- '53 Ford/Mercury along with the necessary oil restrictor fitting.
They come up on EBAY from time to time and can sometimes be found at the Southbury swap meet as well as others.
This is an example of the components needed minus the tubing and fittings that are readily available locally.
Look at post #32 in this string to see a basic example of how it is mounted.

[davids2toys]

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As far as I have learned, I understand the oil filter was an accessory, not standard equipment. I do understand how the partial is the better way to go for my usage. I also do not want to be modifying the engine or oil pump to do this mod. I see the restrictor in the pic, can you tell me where these parts go and what needs to get modded.

[davids2toys]

that whole Southbury thing has been done for a few years now

[davids2toys]

Originally Posted by tubman

I would suggest that you find a stock 8BA setup. (It will bolt directly to the head unless you have an early '49 engine.) The "Partial Full Flow" system will require drilling and tapping of the block that is difficult and risky on an engine in a car. There should be a port with a 1/8" pipe plug on the right rear of the engine that is the outlet to the filter. There should also be a return port on the oil pan with a similar plug. I would expect that someone has removed the stock filter from your engine at some earlier time.

My considered opinion is that, for the way these cars are currently used, the stock Ford bypass filter system is superior to a full flow conversion. Typically, these cars are used sparingly on paved roads and have frequent oil changes. The stock bypass filter will remove much smaller particles than a full flow unit and provide better overall cleaning of the oil. If you are going to do several thousand miles a month on dirt roads, then you should probably consider pulling the engine and converting to a complete full flow system.

One last thing. I would not use non-detergent oil under any circumstances. If the engine has been run with non-detergent oil, the sludge is probably so built up that the detergent oil won't break anything loose. But at least it won't build up any more sludge.

So if there is an OUT and an IN, why am I drilling the block?

[51 MERC-CT]

Originally Posted by davids2toys

As far as I have learned, I understand the oil filter was an accessory, not standard equipment. I do understand how the partial is the better way to go for my usage. I also do not want to be modifying the engine or oil pump to do this mod. I see the restrictor in the pic, can you tell me where these parts go and what needs to get modded.

Originally Posted by davids2toys

that whole Southbury thing has been done for a few years now

Shows the last time I went to Southbury. that was one of the better shows/swap meets.
As I stated, look at post #32 to see where the Tubing connects to the input side at the rear of the block. the return goes into an existing hole along the pan rail.
There is NO drilling or modifying required.

[tubman]

The drilling I referred to was for a semi-full system, NOT a stock bypass system.

[davids2toys]

WOW, I totally missed that post! Showing my age again,LOL
OK, I see it. This is on the drivers side then, one of the posters said it was on the right side so I assumed passenger side. just went and looked at what I have. The upper hole in the rear has got a sender screwed into it and the lower one is there right above the oil pan. If I don't have to any modifying, that is the route I would rather take. I saw a cartridge for sale with 2 filters for 45.00. So all I would need is the 2 lines with fittings and this restrictor? I am assuming the restrictor goes into the cartridge somewhere?

[davids2toys]

Is this oil restrictor something that an auto parts store might have? I ust went on ebay and found nothing. What is the purpose on the restrictor?

[JSeery]

The original type part is old stock only as far as I know. If you want to build up something similar modern turbo oil restrictor come in a similar size.

[davids2toys]

OK, did some research and understand the purpose of the restrictor. It is confusing where it goes though. Some say it goes into a tee in the back of the block and the pressure sender goes into this tee also, and then some say it needs to go to the side of the filter. I don't see that it would matter as long as it is restricting the oil coming into the filter


i just found the ad. "1949-53 Ford oil filters and canister $45". So will this Ford filter work on the Merc engine? If the restrictor needs to screw into the filter, is the ford different than the Merc?

[51 MERC-CT]

Originally Posted by davids2toys

OK, did some research and understand the purpose of the restrictor. It is confusing where it goes though. Some say it goes into a tee in the back of the block and the pressure sender goes into this tee also, and then some say it needs to go to the side of the filter. I don't see that it would matter as long as it is restricting the oil coming into the filter


i just found the ad. "1949-53 Ford oil filters and canister $45". So will this Ford filter work on the Merc engine? If the restrictor needs to screw into the filter, is the ford different than the Merc?

The restictor can go anywhere in the line that feeds the filter, so long as it does not interfere with the operation of the pressure sender.
Suggest you re- read my post #45 You are looking for '50- '53 Ford or Mercury, they are interchangeable.
The '49 filters used a different mounting system. (head bolts )
So if you have '53 heads as you say, you don't want a '49 setup.

[davids2toys]

Thank you, that is what I was thinking also about the restrictor.


I wonder why the seller is stating 49-53? I will have to ask him when we talk. So I would think you can buy different filter inserts for this. I would think for this type of partial filter you would run a real good filter(filter out the tiniest debris) for it. I see your is called a bypass filter, I assume this is what I am talking about. That Amsoil looks like a spin on? Are you running a spin on set up the same way you are telling me to hook up this cartridge setup?

[flatheadmurre]

All filters are the same size...only difference is stacked or folded filtermedia.
I buy them bulk in plastic bags from one of my heavy parts supplier intended for industrial engines half price for a good quality filter...best value for my money so far.

[tubman]

Just a bit of information. There is a slight difference between Ford and Mercury restrictors. I found this out when I put the '51 Merc engine in my '51 Ford. The "rounded" one pictured in Post 45 is the same as on my Mercury engine. The one on the Ford was completely square, with no rounded edges at all. They are functionally the same, but the lines attach slightly differently and you would be better served keeping the lines with filter/restrictor they came on as they are quite difficult to bend correctly.

[davids2toys]

Hi Tubman,
Not really understanding what you are trying to explain to me here.



Dave

[JSeery]

If you want it to be 100% correct it matters, if you just want it to be functional it doesn't matter.

[TomT/Williamsburg]

My avatar has never had a filter - I use cheap Walmart brand 20w-50 oil w/zinc additive that I add - 5 qts per change - and I run the hell out of my car as you all know.I change the oil frequently though except for long road trips like to the LA Roadster show from Virginia when I changed it on my way back having gone 3500 miles at that point. Am I right or am I lucky? You decide - but it has worked for well over 50k mikes and at 85 mph at times. I personally think that me running those long distance runs with a 50 lb oil pressure spring is much better for it than all local runs. I even drop my rear end fluid every year and use whatever brand and viscosity is on sale just no synthetic stuff. It works for me .... the more you run them the better they run imho .....

[51 MERC-CT]

Originally Posted by davids2toys

Is this oil restrictor something that an auto parts store might have? I ust went on ebay and found nothing. What is the purpose on the restrictor?

A restrictor fitting can be made using various fittings and a (NAPA WH 1512)
restrictor.
This is just one way it can be done.

[tubman]

I'm just saying there is a slight difference between the Mercury and Ford restrictor fittings and that if you are going to buy a filter assembly, try to get the whole thing, lines and all. Because the restrictor fittings are slightly different, mixing and matching lines will cause some problems. Maybe some of you guys can bend them easily, but I tried to use the Mercury lines with the Ford oil filter and restrictor, and found it much easier to use the Ford lines rather than trying to make bends to the (rather hard) Mercury lines.

[davids2toys]

Originally Posted by JSeery

If you want it to be 100% correct it matters, if you just want it to be functional it doesn't matter.

I just want it to work! It is the wrong motor anyway so kind of a bastard child! i just want no issues hooking it up and want it to function as it should

[Ritzy1]

I used aluminum spacers from McMaster-Carr and longer ARP bolts to space the original filter above the finned aluminum heads. Used 51 Merc-CT's suggestion to source the restrictor fitting after finding mine had stripped threads. Fabbed my own supply/return lines using 1/4" line. Found out how important it was to have the the right gasket on the filter cover when I first fired the motor . . . plenty of pressure going through that filter!

[MGG]

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I used 1/4" nickel/copper brake lines from NAPA for my 47 oil filter plumbing. It is easy to make nice bends with that material and I am not that much concerned with originality.

[davids2toys]

WOW, great info. I am buying that setup for sale. Sending the $ Monday. love the sketch in Post 62. The nickel copper brake line is a great idea also. One more project to do. I have a bunch of jobs before I get to this one unfortunately./ Any recommendations on a fine micron filter for this setup? here is a pic of what I'm buying.

[51 MERC-CT]

Originally Posted by davids2toys

WOW, great info. I am buying that setup for sale. Sending the $ Monday. love the sketch in Post 62. The nickel copper brake line is a great idea also. One more project to do. I have a bunch of jobs before I get to this one unfortunately./ Any recommendations on a fine micron filter for this setup? here is a pic of what I'm buying.

'CAUTION'

That setup is not meant to bolt in the stock position on your '53 head.
It is meant to fit '49 and earlier engines using the head bolts.
Have never heard of any fine micron filter that fits any of the canister filters. ( NAPA 1006 or equivalent is what is normally used )
This is what the mounting base should look like.

[davids2toys]

Ok, now back to being confused! I thought they all (Canister) mounted to the head bolts. To clarify: So is his just wrong for my engine because of the bolt pattern only? Do I still need one that mounts to the head-bolts, only for a 50-53 using a different bolt pattern?I thought I understood they were all the same from 49-53 and from 48 back they were different.



What is that pic that you posted using the Amsoil bypass filter. Can you explain that pic to me. what does the word bypass mean? Is that another word for 100% full filter system?
Thanks...Dave

[JSeery]

Starting with by-pass, a by-pass filter bleeds off a small part of the oil (the reason for the restrictor) by-passing the main oil flow to the engine. Over time all of the oil passes through the filter, but only a small % at a given time.

In a 100% filtration system all of the oil passes through the filter before it goes to the rest of the engine.

The head bolt pattern is the same for all 24 stud/bolt engines (starting in mid 1938 up to the last flathead). The difference in the oil filters is how they mount. Up to 48/49 they mounted on the studs. With the switch to bolts the later 8ba heads had special oil filter mounting places cast into the heads.

If you are using heads without the special mounts cast in it is not going to matter. You will have to install special bolts or studs for the three locations where the filter is going to be mounted.

See the three extra mounting locations on the aft end of the 8ba head?

[51 MERC-CT]

Originally Posted by davids2toys

Ok, now back to being confused! I thought they all (Canister) mounted to the head bolts. To clarify: So is his just wrong for my engine because of the bolt pattern only? Do I still need one that mounts to the head-bolts, only for a 50-53 using a different bolt pattern?I thought I understood they were all the same from 49-53 and from 48 back they were different.



What is that pic that you posted using the Amsoil bypass filter. Can you explain that pic to me. what does the word bypass mean? Is that another word for 100% full filter system?
Thanks...Dave

This is the way '50-'53 mounted, to dedicated threaded holes in the head.
Head bolts are what hold the heads on.
My Amsoil filter conversion is mounted to a much modified original canister housing bolted in its original location on the head.
Suggest you google 'bypass filter' to possibly gain further information on how the system works.

[34PKUP]

Originally Posted by JSeery

Starting with by-pass, a by-pass filter bleeds off a small part of the oil (the reason for the restrictor) by-passing the main oil flow to the engine. Over time all of the oil passes through the filter, but only a small % at a given time.

In a 100% filtration system all of the oil passes through the filter before it goes to the rest of the engine.

The head bolt pattern is the same for all 24 stud/bolt engines (starting in mid 1938 up to the last flathead). The difference in the oil filters is how they mount. Up to 48/49 they mounted on the studs. With the switch to bolts the later 8ba heads had special oil filter mounting places cast into the heads.

If you are using heads without the special mounts cast in it is not going to matter. You will have to install special bolts or studs for the three locations where the filter is going to be mounted.

See the three extra mounting locations on the aft end of the 8ba head?

Now Im' confused

[JSeery]

Originally Posted by 34PKUP

Now Im' confused

About what? Give me a hint!

If it about a by-pass filter, it does what it says in it's name, it by-passes the main oil flow in the engine. The restrictor allows a small percentage of the oil to by-pass the main oil flow and is diverted to a filter and then returned to the oil pan.

[davids2toys]

Very confusing indeed. So these holes are not on the left side of the head, they are on the right side. I full understand what and how the bypass system works. It just gets confusing when people are calling it different things and then it gets further confusing with pics that are also different. I just took a few pics of mine and it looks like i have the heads with the mounting holes. So you are sure that the filter I was buying will not work with these heads? How will I know when i am looking art one that I can use? It seems like both have a similar bolt pattern. Thank you though, you just saved me 60.00. I will have to contact him and cancel the purchase

[34PKUP]

Originally Posted by JSeery

About what? Give me a hint!

If it about a by-pass filter, it does what it says in it's name, it by-passes the main oil flow in the engine. The restrictor allows a small percentage of the oil to by-pass the main oil flow and is diverted to a filter and then returned to the oil pan.

Sorry, wrong quote, should have been post #69

[JSeery]

Originally Posted by davids2toys

Very confusing indeed. So these holes are not on the left side of the head, they are on the right side.

You are looking at different years and different filters that mounted in different places. The returns are also different on different years. It shouldn't be confusing, you just have to get the filter you want for the engine you are using it on and the mounting method you are wanting to use. A lot of the early filters were aftermarket add-on's, different manufactures arranged them differently and Ford changed their setup with the different years.

The main difference is going to be the bolt hole spacing, the 8ba spacing has to match the pattern cast into the late heads.

[51 MERC-CT]

Originally Posted by davids2toys

Very confusing indeed. So these holes are not on the left side of the head, they are on the right side. I full understand what and how the bypass system works. It just gets confusing when people are calling it different things and then it gets further confusing with pics that are also different. I just took a few pics of mine and it looks like i have the heads with the mounting holes. So you are sure that the filter I was buying will not work with these heads? How will I know when i am looking art one that I can use? It seems like both have a similar bolt pattern. Thank you though, you just saved me 60.00. I will have to contact him and cancel the purchase

Perhaps you can see the difference here--
You can, if you choose to,remove the necessary head bolts and mount it there.
Or you could buy an original one here---
http://shoebox-central.com/1950-1951...nister-housing

[tubman]

BTW, those are '52-'53 Mercury heads in the picture and the LEFT head (drivers side in the US) does have the special oil filter mounting holes.

You may have gotten lucky and have a '52-53 Mercury engine there with a 4" stroke and 125HP from the factory.

[davids2toys]

OK, I definitely see a difference in the shape of bolt pattern. Thank you for the link. I wonder if that comes with the necessary seals? I will pass on this one i was going to buy because i don't want to make it harder or more complicated than it has to be, Thank you guys for all the help.I think i will wait until a nice used piece comes up for sale because i am in no rush and have a ton going on with the car already

[davids2toys]

Originally Posted by tubman

BTW, those are '52-'53 Mercury heads in the picture and the LEFT head (drivers side in the US) does have the special oil filter mounting holes.

You may have gotten lucky and have a '52-53 Mercury engine there with a 4" stroke and 125HP from the factory.

Never even heard of that motor! i have a feeling it is not only because of the way it performs, definitely not a high winder. the motor is revving pretty high at 50mph and running out of power, at 60 mph it feels like it is going to blow up! It feels like it is geared super low and needs another gear.

[Ronnie]

https://www.google.com/search?client...3Afordbarn.com


R

[JSeery]

Originally Posted by davids2toys

Never even heard of that motor! i have a feeling it is not only because of the way it performs, definitely not a high winder. the motor is revving pretty high at 50mph and running out of power, at 60 mph it feels like it is going to blow up! It feels like it is geared super low and needs another gear.

That's just flatheads, it's not turning near the rpm you might think it is. Check the gear ratio and see what you have in it, but I would guess it's not that low of a rear end.

The rear axle should be marked as to the original gear ratio. If not, it is fairly easy to check.

[davids2toys]

Originally Posted by Ronnie

https://www.google.com/search?client...3Afordbarn.com


R

Great link, thanks. I have actually read most of these links!

[davids2toys]

Originally Posted by JSeery

That's just flatheads, it's not turning near the rpm you might think it is. Check the gear ratio and see what you have in it, but I would guess it's not that low of a rear end.

The rear axle should be marked as to the original gear ratio. If not, it is fairly easy to check.

My car is a 36 with no exposed driveshaft. I know how to check it on a normal car where you can mark the driveshaft and count the turns vs the tire turns to get the ratio. How do i do it on this car? I did not see anything marked on the rear, but wan't really looking for it

[JSeery]

Under the center section just behind where the axle tube connects. There will be two number stamped into the casting. The upper left photo in the post.

Some info here as well. https://www.fordbarn.com/forum/showt...ght=axle+ratio

[davids2toys]

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I scrubbed it with break-clean and worked on it for a while with rags and plastic scrapers ans I do not see any numbers at all. I only did the bottom, because you pretty sure that is where it is. No chance it could be on the top side on that same rib?
So what is the second easy way to figure it out?

[JSeery]

Fords stamped number are often difficult to see! I had a link in post #85.

[Drbrown]

My 59AB apparently never had a filter. Still doesn't. Has 35,000 on its rebuild and still has good oil pressure. I think key is frequency of oil changes and to a lessor degree, maybe the quality/kind of oil you use. Mine used common Penn HD 10w-30 year round.

[davids2toys]

Yes, I saw the pic upper top left as you said.That pic could easily be the top or the bottom, but you said bottom so that is all I did. I did miss the link. So now looked at that thread. My plug is already out of the tranny and rear because I have drained all the fluid in both and will be replacing with new fluid from MAC. I have put 2 1/2pints back in the tranny but have not filled the rear yet, so now would be an ideal time to count the ring gear teeth!I also purchased magnetic plugs for both drain and fill for tranny and rear. They wre cheap enough and I figured that fluid is so thick the chips will float rather than sink to the bottom, cheap insurance even if I am wrong! The level is confusing because I have read everything from and inch below the fill to all the way up until it runs out of the hole. i will probably compromise and go 1/2 inch below. The owners manual says capacity 2 1/2 pints for both until it runs out of the fill

[aussie merc]

lets get back to the question do i need an oil filter my answer is hell yeh ive spent 45 years working on anything from a chain saw to a V16 mine truck and simply if you havent got a filter of some sort you've got no hope of catching any contaminant

[davids2toys]

Originally Posted by aussie merc

lets get back to the question do i need an oil filter my answer is hell yeh ive spent 45 years working on anything from a chain saw to a V16 mine truck and simply if you haven't got a filter of some sort you've got no hope of catching any contaminant

You got my vote on this!