tranny compatibility

[1937sedandelivery]

hello,
I know nothing about transmissions, but I am needing one for my 37. I recently bought a tranny from a guy who wasn't sure of the year. I cracked it open today and disassembled it. The cluster gear assembly has the gear teeth of: 28-24-18-15. From the green bible, it appears to be pn: 48-7113-A, for 1932-1935. My question: will this work for my 37? I am trying to keep things as original as possible. What am I missing in going to a 35 tranny as opposed to a 37 tranny?
Thanks,
gregg

[V8COOPMAN]

Originally Posted by 1937sedandelivery

hello,
I know nothing about transmissions, but I am needing one for my 37. I recently bought a tranny from a guy who wasn't sure of the year. I cracked it open today and disassembled it. The cluster gear assembly has the gear teeth of: 28-24-18-15. From the green bible, it appears to be pn: 48-7113-A, for 1932-1935. My question: will this work for my 37? I am trying to keep things as original as possible. What am I missing in going to a 35 tranny as opposed to a 37 tranny?
Thanks,
gregg

Hey Gregg....Below is a link to a really GREAT page on Mac VanPelt's very informative site. Besides explaining the basic differences between the early Ford transmissions, you'll also see pictures of what your trans should look like internally. Mac VanPelt is one of your "go-to" sources for early trans parts and information. The other would be 3rd Gen in McMinnville, Tenn. DD

http://www.vanpeltsales.com/FH_web/f...peed-gears.htm

........

[1937sedandelivery]

Thanks V8coopman. I will check it out.
gregg

[JM 35 Sedan]

Gregg, check to see if there's a serial number stamped on the flat area above the sheet metal clutch inspection plate, held in place by two fasteners, on the bell housing of the transmission case. This number will give you the month and year that transmission was used in production, based on the serial number listing on Mac VP's website. There is also a number cast into the back of the transmission gear case that will tell you which series, and year/manufacture case you have.... 18-xxxx, 48-xxxx, or 78-xxxx.
Also, if you could post some pics of the gear assembly and shifter top assembly of your transmission we might be able to provide further information or advice.

[skidmarks]

If you plan on driving it, build yourself a good transmission. Start with a good 78 case which is correct for your 37

[1937sedandelivery]

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Mystery solved (I think).
The number stamped above the inspection opening is: *I8-1634764*, which according to Mac's decoder, is for a 1935.
The number stamped on the rear of the case is: 48-7006, which also denotes a 1935 year.
The cluster gear assembly teeth number also indicate 1935.

So, everything points to 1935. The guy I bought it from wasn't sure of the year.
In any case, I will hold off and try to find a 37 case.

Thanks folks,
gregg

[skidmarks]

You also need the 37 38 clutch arm and a 37 to 40 rear mount

If your doing juice brakes and 39 pedals, you need the 39 clutch arm

[alanwoodieman]

crazy question why not rebuild yours? number on case may match your cars serial number and you can get the book/parts from van pelts and build it yourself!

[1937sedandelivery]

Not sure I want to rebuild a 35 case and put it in my 37. Am trying to stay all original.

Good point on the clutch arm and rear mount. It came with a rear mount but most likely is for a 35 and won't fit in my 37. Another reason to look for a 37 tranny.

Right now, everything is wide open, just have the body sitting on the frame. I will try a dry fit with the rear tranny mount it came with.

gregg

[skidmarks]

35 mount had a rubber center, 37 to 40 is cast solid and uses the same biscut mounts as the engine.

[1937sedandelivery]

I just checked it out. Mine is a rubber center, be it quite deteriorated. Definitely a 35, darn. Do you know if it will correctly mount up to my 37?
gregg

[38 coupe]

You need the parts mentioned earlier in this thread. Basically you need all the parts that bolt onto the transmission case to be correct for 1937. If you purchase each of those individually it will probably cost more than a 37 transmission. Don't junk the one you have, but do get a more correct unit.

[1937sedandelivery]

Bingo, right on 38 coupe. If I am going to spend the dollars, might as well get an original unit.....done. I will soon be posting a 35 tranny for sale, needing a bearing, cluster gear assembly and second gear.
Thanks,
gregg

[rotorwrench]

The 78 case was developed in 1937 but the pre-1939 units had the early synchonizer set up. The guts out of a 1939 or later transmission will fit the earlier cases depending on the main shaft type but there is the mater of the shift tower and the 91A type shift fork that has to be observed for use of the late type synchro. The double detent shift tower was the better of the top shift transmissions up though 1951 or so.

The pickups after 1941 were open drive so they have a slip yoke type main shaft and some truck like gears but the cases are good to go. The side shift car transmissions after 1939 had the wrong case but they had gears that will fit. The rear bearing retainers just bolt on so they can be traded from one type to the other depending on application. The early shift towers are tricky if a person wants to put late gears in one of the 1932 to 1935 cars that have that type of shift tower. A 91A shift fork is not a direct fit to them.

Mac VanPelt's book is invaluable for overhaul of the old Ford light duty 3-speeds. What ever questions a person has that the book doesn't cover are only a phone call away.

Even though my early 1951 Mercury cars have the overdrive version of the light duty 3-speed, there are still a lot of interchangeable parts between them all.

[JSeery]

Or you could consider having VanPelt build you up one the way you want it! No idea on the cases, but he may well have one and might be interested in your 35 case. I would give him a call.

[1937sedandelivery]

Good point. I have no use for the 35 case. I will give him a ring come Monday.
Thanks,
gregg

[VeryTangled]

Aren't trans cases one of the more available items?

[JM 35 Sedan]

Originally Posted by rotorwrench

The 78 case was developed in 1937 but the pre-1939 units had the early synchonizer set up. The guts out of a 1939 or later transmission will fit the earlier cases depending on the main shaft type but there is the mater of the shift tower and the 91A type shift fork that has to be observed for use of the late type synchro. The double detent shift tower was the better of the top shift transmissions up though 1951 or so.

The pickups after 1941 were open drive so they have a slip yoke type main shaft and some truck like gears but the cases are good to go. The side shift car transmissions after 1939 had the wrong case but they had gears that will fit. The rear bearing retainers just bolt on so they can be traded from one type to the other depending on application. The early shift towers are tricky if a person wants to put late gears in one of the 1932 to 1935 cars that have that type of shift tower. A 91A shift fork is not a direct fit to them.

Mac VanPelt's book is invaluable for overhaul of the old Ford light duty 3-speeds. What ever questions a person has that the book doesn't cover are only a phone call away.

Even though my early 1951 Mercury cars have the overdrive version of the light duty 3-speed, there are still a lot of interchangeable parts between them all.

rotorwrench, I've underlined two of your above statements that at one time I would have totally agreed with, but........
Last year I rebuilt the transmission and rear in my mostly original '35 fordor slant back sedan before driving this car to Auburn Indiana for the EFV-8 Club's Central National Meet. The transmission didn't really need rebuilding, but I've always wanted to upgrade to the later style '39-'48 synchronizers, and change the 1st & 2nd gear ratios to give better acceleration with 3.54:1 rear gears when starting off from a from a dead stop. To accomplish this I used a 29 tooth cluster gear and 15 tooth input gear in my original 48-7006, '35-'36 transmission case. Now instead of using a '39 shifter top with the 3" wide, 91A, 2nd/3rd shift fork, I decided to use a special set of shift forks, made for me by a friend who is very clever at design engineering and making things to upgrade these early Fords. These specially made forks fit into the stock '35 shifter top and will shift the later style synchronized gears perfectly,....thus keeping the interior appearance of the shifter top, shift lever, and sheet metal transmission cover looking totally stock. I've driven this car approximately 2,000 miles since making this change and the transmission shifts so much better now than it did previously....plus it completely eliminated the problem of jumping out of second gear, and no more "raking or grinding" of gears when shifting from 2nd to 3rd.

[rotorwrench]

It's not an impossible task for sure but not every one has a talented engineer friend around with the necessary skill set & tooling. That's why I refer to it as "tricky". If properly modified, the older transmissions can be just as good as the later ones. One problem folks have to be aware of is that some of the early cases won't fit the 15/29 input gear set due to the larger diameter of the front cluster gear. These started to show up around 1939. The 15/29 gear set I have came from a 1940 or 41 Mercury.

[JM 35 Sedan]

Originally Posted by rotorwrench

It's not an impossible task for sure but not every one has a talented engineer friend around with the necessary skill set & tooling. That's why I refer to it as "tricky". If properly modified, the older transmissions can be just as good as the later ones. One problem folks have to be aware of is that some of the early cases won't fit the 15/29 input gear set due to the larger diameter of the front cluster gear. These started to show up around 1939. The 15/29 gear set I have came from a 1940 or 41 Mercury.

My main purpose for posting this was what I consider the myth, or old wives tale, implying you must having a '39 style shifter top, with a 3" wide 91A fork, and preferably a 78-7006 series case to build a clone of the elusive '39 style top loading transmission, and this is just not true.... as we had once been lead to believe, in the not so distant past. Some folks pay big bucks to build, or have these transmissions built for them, and it's really not necessary.