Go Back   The Ford Barn > General Discussion > Late V8 (1954+)

Sponsored Links (Register now to hide all advertisements)

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 09-29-2020, 08:37 AM   #1
Eledu
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2020
Posts: 15
Default Help Quick Fuel SL450SV & Y Block 292

Dear .. I have a 1982 f100 (Argentina) with a Ford V8 292 Phase 2 engine (similar to the Y block, only the cylinder caps change) and I installed a quick fuel SL450SV carburetor with a single plane intake. The engine is stock .. electronic ignition and headers.
Originally the carburetor came with 56 primary jets and 60 secondary jets ... I put 55 primaries and improved a lot, the problem rises when regulating the secondary ones. When they open, bog is created instantaneously, the only configuration that works is opening the secondaries very little and almost at the end of the rpm (3500 of 4500). I don't know if the bog is caused by lean condition or rich. What do you suggest?
Attached images of the spark plug, the engine and the opening of the secondaries...

Greetings from Argentina!
PD: This website describes the differences between the American Y block and the Argentine phase 2
http://www.fordv8argentina.com.ar/di...sentref1f2.htm

Last edited by Eledu; 09-29-2020 at 08:50 AM.
Eledu is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-29-2020, 10:49 AM   #2
scicala
Senior Member
 
scicala's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: Detroit suburb, MI
Posts: 3,058
Default Re: Help Quick Fuel SL450SV & Y Block 292

The bog or hesitation could be caused by too light of a spring on the secondary diaphragm. Also, the straight slotted screw in the picture of the diaphragm housing I believe is for adjusting the amount of suction on the diaphragm on the Quick Fuel carbs. You can play with that to see if there is an improvement. I'm doubtful changing from a 56 to 55 primary jet really made a difference.
Also, are you sure the choke is opening up all the way ? I see the ground wire for the heated thermostat cap is not connected.

Sal
scicala is offline   Reply With Quote
Sponsored Links (Register now to hide all advertisements)
Old 09-29-2020, 11:17 AM   #3
55blacktie
Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2020
Posts: 85
Default Re: Help Quick Fuel SL450SV & Y Block 292

That single-plane intake manifold probably is contributing to your problems. A single-plane manifold and 465 cfm carburetor is an unusual combination.
55blacktie is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-29-2020, 11:45 AM   #4
Eledu
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2020
Posts: 15
Default Re: Help Quick Fuel SL450SV & Y Block 292

Quote:
Originally Posted by scicala View Post
The bog or hesitation could be caused by too light of a spring on the secondary diaphragm. Also, the straight slotted screw in the picture of the diaphragm housing I believe is for adjusting the amount of suction on the diaphragm on the Quick Fuel carbs. You can play with that to see if there is an improvement. I'm doubtful changing from a 56 to 55 primary jet really made a difference.
Also, are you sure the choke is opening up all the way ? I see the ground wire for the heated thermostat cap is not connected.

Sal

Precisely what I was telling you is that as soon as I give more opening to the secondaries, with the regulation screw, the bog is produced immediately. I checked it out with the bread twist ..
In the image you can see what you can open without bog.
As for the choke ... it opens completely and the ground is connected to the carburetor as it comes by default.
The change between the two jets was important, the engine became more responsive .. it was kind of slow with the 56.
Greetings.
Eledu is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-29-2020, 11:53 AM   #5
Eledu
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2020
Posts: 15
Default Re: Help Quick Fuel SL450SV & Y Block 292

Quote:
Originally Posted by 55blacktie View Post
That single-plane intake manifold probably is contributing to your problems. A single-plane manifold and 465 cfm carburetor is an unusual combination.
Possibly lose vacuum very quickly with the single plane intake ..?
The bog can be produced because it is very rich in the secondary ones?
As I mentioned, with the 56 jets in the primaries the engine was slow ... in fact, a flat spot was produced between 1500 and 2000 rpm in WOT.
Although with the 55 jets it is produced, it is much less and improves a lot.
Greetings.

Last edited by Eledu; 09-29-2020 at 12:03 PM.
Eledu is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-29-2020, 06:44 PM   #6
Ole Don
Senior Member
 
Ole Don's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: St. Michael, Minnesota
Posts: 1,618
Default Re: Help Quick Fuel SL450SV & Y Block 292

Sponsored Links (Register now to hide all advertisements)
First, set the ignition timing with a vacuum gauge. More advance may help the flat spot. Then keep slowing the secondaries. In the US, we use a spring kit from Holley. It has a half dozen colored springs you can try.
Ole Don is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-29-2020, 07:57 PM   #7
Eledu
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2020
Posts: 15
Default Re: Help Quick Fuel SL450SV & Y Block 292

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ole Don View Post
First, set the ignition timing with a vacuum gauge. More advance may help the flat spot. Then keep slowing the secondaries. In the US, we use a spring kit from Holley. It has a half dozen colored springs you can try.

The timing is configured with the vacuum gauge and the idle mixture. The diaphragm of my carburetor is adjustable, but as soon as I open it a little, it bogs.
Could it be that the engine does not need the secondary ones?
Is the carburetor too big for the standard engine?
Or by reducing the jets of the secondary schools could they open more?
My secondary jets are 60.
Greetings!
Eledu is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-07-2020, 12:21 PM   #8
KULTULZ
Senior Member
 
KULTULZ's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: W(BY GOD)V
Posts: 2,855
Question Re: Help Quick Fuel SL450SV & Y Block 292

Quote:
Originally Posted by Eledu View Post

.. I have a 1982 f100 (Argentina) with a Ford V8 292 Phase 2 engine and I installed a quick fuel SL450SV carburetor with a single plane intake.
What made you decide on a SINGLE PLANE INTAKE on a carburetor street engine?

Way too lean -


Last edited by KULTULZ; 10-07-2020 at 12:29 PM.
KULTULZ is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-07-2020, 01:04 PM   #9
55blacktie
Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2020
Posts: 85
Default Re: Help Quick Fuel SL450SV & Y Block 292

Your carburetor is not too big.
55blacktie is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-07-2020, 01:50 PM   #10
Eledu
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2020
Posts: 15
Default Re: Help Quick Fuel SL450SV & Y Block 292

Quote:
Originally Posted by KULTULZ View Post
What made you decide on a SINGLE PLANE INTAKE on a carburetor street engine?

Way too lean -

As I mentioned, with one more measure of jets, the engine gets sluggish in the middle regimes.
I decided on that intake thinking that in the future change the cam and increase the compression ... but I do not know when that can happen.
With the single plane from 3000 rpm he gets furious.
In my country a wideband is quite expensive, you will already know the economic problems of Argentina.
In the future I will try to acquire one to see what is happening.
Greetings!
Eledu is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-07-2020, 01:57 PM   #11
Eledu
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2020
Posts: 15
Default Re: Help Quick Fuel SL450SV & Y Block 292

Quote:
Originally Posted by 55blacktie View Post
Your carburetor is not too big.
When I decided to buy it I read a lot, and many said that 465cfm is adequate. I also saw that the 57 312ci had that carburetor originally with jets of 55 in the primaries and 48 in the secondary ones. I know my carb is not the same as that 465cfm but the 60 jets in the secondaries won't be too much and is that why this happens?
Greetings!
Eledu is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-07-2020, 03:57 PM   #12
dmsfrr
Senior Member
 
dmsfrr's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: Abq, NM
Posts: 2,654
Default Re: Help Quick Fuel SL450SV & Y Block 292

Quote:
Originally Posted by Eledu View Post
When I decided to buy it I read a lot, and many said that 465cfm is adequate. I also saw that the 57 312ci had that carburetor originally with jets of 55 in the primaries and 48 in the secondary ones. I know my carb is not the same as that 465cfm but the 60 jets in the secondaries won't be too much and is that why this happens?
Greetings!
A 400 to maybe 500 cfm 4 barrel carburetor with a vacuum operated secondary is not too big for a 292.

I agree, the color of the center of that spark plug indicates a 'lean' fuel /air mixture.

I may be assuming too much about your comment above but...
because of all the internal construction & operational differences, the jets in one brand and size of carburetor cannot be compared to the primary and secondary jet size in a different brand or model of carburetor.
They may be similar, but it is just as likely they are not.

A jet size that works well in one carburetor on an engine can be completely wrong in another brand or model carburetor on the same engine. The correct jetting in a particular carburetor is specific to the engine / carburetor combination and the altitude & other conditions in which the car is driven.
.

Last edited by dmsfrr; 10-07-2020 at 04:26 PM.
dmsfrr is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 10-07-2020, 04:32 PM   #13
KULTULZ
Senior Member
 
KULTULZ's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: W(BY GOD)V
Posts: 2,855
Post Re: Help Quick Fuel SL450SV & Y Block 292

Quote:
Originally Posted by Eledu View Post

I decided on that intake thinking that in the future change the cam and increase the compression ... but I do not know when that can happen.

With the single plane from 3000 rpm he gets furious.
Your main problem is the intake type. It is generally used for track. There is very little low-end. It can be used for street but the engine has to be modified with a low rear. Do you still have the OEM dual plane 4V intake and/or was one offered for the PHASE 2?

Read this for theory -

https://www.enginelabs.com/engine-te...or-dual-plane/
KULTULZ is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-07-2020, 04:36 PM   #14
Eledu
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2020
Posts: 15
Default Re: Help Quick Fuel SL450SV & Y Block 292

Quote:
Originally Posted by dmsfrr View Post
A 400 to maybe 500 cfm 4 barrel carburetor with a vacuum operated secondary is not too big for a 292.

I agree, the color of the center of that spark plug indicates a 'lean' fuel /air mixture.

I may be assuming too much about your comment above but...
because of all the internal construction & operational differences, the jets in one brand and size of carburetor cannot be compared to the primary and secondary jet size in a different brand or model of carburetor.
They may be similar, but it is just as likely they are not.

A jet size that works well in one carburetor on an engine can be completely wrong in another brand or model carburetor on the same engine. The correct jetting in a particular carburetor is specific to the engine / carburetor combination and the altitude & other conditions in which the car is driven.
.
dmsfrr Thank you very much for your reply.
What he tells me is correct, I will try when I can make time to place bigger jets in the secondary ones and smaller ones to see which of the two configurations allows me to regulate the opening before. Greetings.
Eledu is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-07-2020, 04:43 PM   #15
Eledu
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2020
Posts: 15
Default Re: Help Quick Fuel SL450SV & Y Block 292

Quote:
Originally Posted by KULTULZ View Post
Your main problem is the intake type. It is generally used for track. There is very little low-end. It can be used for street but the engine has to be modified with a low rear. Do you still have the OEM dual plane 4V intake and/or was one offered for the PHASE 2?

Read this for theory -

https://www.enginelabs.com/engine-te...or-dual-plane/

The original intake is 2bbl, it was never manufactured for 4bbl, some machines transform it into 4bbl. As a last alternative, you could modify the original. Thanks for the article that you shared with me. Greetings.
Eledu is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-07-2020, 06:54 PM   #16
55blacktie
Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2020
Posts: 85
Default Re: Help Quick Fuel SL450SV & Y Block 292

Was the engine running with the 2-barrel carburetor and intake manifold in place? The easiest and cheapest thing to do would be to put the 2-barrel intake manifold and carburetor back on the engine. Rebuild the 2-barrel carburetor if necessary. Your stating that the "cylinder caps" are different, I'm assuming that you mean that the intake ports are not stacked, one on top of another, but are inline, side-by-side. This could limit your intake manifold choices, but I don't know what's available in Argentina for your application. If you are determined to use the four-barrel carburetor, you will need to find a dual-plane, four-barrel intake manifold that has the same intake ports as your cylinder heads ("caps"). In the meantime, you might want to look for internet articles that explain the differences between dual-plane and single-plane intake manifolds and how or when they should be used.
55blacktie is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-08-2020, 04:44 AM   #17
KULTULZ
Senior Member
 
KULTULZ's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: W(BY GOD)V
Posts: 2,855
Post Re: Help Quick Fuel SL450SV & Y Block 292

Quote:
ford argentina call the engines fhase 1 for the 292 like the original from EEUU and fhase 2 for the new modification since 1972 to 1992. In brazil the 292 was manufacturing to 1980 but they engine was not modified, they are bulid the same engine from EEUU.

SOURCE - http://forums.y-blocksforever.com/Topic41341-1.aspx
KULTULZ is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-08-2020, 08:57 AM   #18
Eledu
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2020
Posts: 15
Default Re: Help Quick Fuel SL450SV & Y Block 292

Quote:
Originally Posted by KULTULZ View Post
Yes, it is basically the same block with some improvements, such as the cylinder heads (similar to 302 engine), a water pump with two circulation channels. Except for the cilinder heads and the camshaft, the rest of the parts are 100% compatible with the Y block, that's why I made my query in this forum. In Argentina it was manufactured in some f100s until 1990 and in the Argentine ford fairline (same as the 1969 ford torino 4 doors) until 1982. https://es.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ford_Fairlane_(Argentina) My father had one (Fairline) and I could never forget the sound of that engine, that's why I bought this f100! Greetings!

Last edited by Eledu; 10-08-2020 at 09:03 AM.
Eledu is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-13-2020, 11:18 AM   #19
Eledu
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2020
Posts: 15
Default Re: Help Quick Fuel SL450SV & Y Block 292

Quote:
Originally Posted by 55blacktie View Post
Was the engine running with the 2-barrel carburetor and intake manifold in place? The easiest and cheapest thing to do would be to put the 2-barrel intake manifold and carburetor back on the engine. Rebuild the 2-barrel carburetor if necessary. Your stating that the "cylinder caps" are different, I'm assuming that you mean that the intake ports are not stacked, one on top of another, but are inline, side-by-side. This could limit your intake manifold choices, but I don't know what's available in Argentina for your application. If you are determined to use the four-barrel carburetor, you will need to find a dual-plane, four-barrel intake manifold that has the same intake ports as your cylinder heads ("caps"). In the meantime, you might want to look for internet articles that explain the differences between dual-plane and single-plane intake manifolds and how or when they should be used.

This is finding out if it is possible to machine the original intake to make it 4bbl ... if so, possibly it will. Thank you all very much for your suggestions! Greetings!
Eledu is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-13-2020, 02:06 PM   #20
dmsfrr
Senior Member
 
dmsfrr's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: Abq, NM
Posts: 2,654
Default Re: Help Quick Fuel SL450SV & Y Block 292

Quote:
Originally Posted by Eledu View Post
This is finding out if it is possible to machine the original intake to make it 4bbl ... if so, possibly it will. Thank you all very much for your suggestions! Greetings!
A 4bbl to 2bbl adapter flange would be much easier. See the example at this link.
Although probably not as original looking.

https://www.amazon.com/Mr-Gasket-2-B.../dp/B00068OS2W

.

Last edited by dmsfrr; 10-13-2020 at 02:46 PM.
dmsfrr is online now   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump

Sponsored Links (Register now to hide all advertisements)


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 09:52 PM.