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Old 11-15-2019, 02:31 PM   #1
Forddan
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Default I am so happy......With my 1500W gear oil...

Hi all

I wanted to share my happiness.

As you many have read, I had a couple of postings at the start of the summer season concerning Gear Oil and STP. After all the suggestions, I finally decided not to use STP for my gears. Instead I got Merola 1500W. Kind of similar in density as the STP, but a real oil, as many of you called the STP not an oil. :-)

Part of the discussion was that these high density oils will make shifting difficult in winter.

Well, "I am so happy" to report that after 3 days of night temperatures around 18F and daily temperatures around 35-45 F I was able to drive the car without double clutching.

This is my first year with a model A and as a newbie, double clutching learning curve was not fast. It improved when I moved from 600W to the 1500W. But it wasn't a WOW.

Today, at noon with 46F I started the car. Started right away after 3 weeks in the non-heated barn. Moving the Gears where harder than in summer. But not an issue at all. Took it out, let him warm a little and started my 10 + miles trip around the town.

I am....so happy... It was shifting like a charm. I did not have to do double clutching. From first to second was smooth as cutting butter with a knife. Same from 2nd to 3er. Moreover, I was able to do my firsts downshiftings without any grinding.

I can't be more happy.

Lesson learned : An oil like Molasse consistency worked marvels, at least for me. I wish I could keep this "low temp density " in summer. Unfortunately I couldn't find anything higher than the 1500W. But I am happy, very happy with my decision.

I hope this posting helps others, but, every car, and every driver is a different world.

Cheers to all and thank you very much for all the teaching !!!

Daniel
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Old 11-15-2019, 02:49 PM   #2
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Default Re: I am so happy......With my 1500W gear oil...

Neat! Thank you for the report
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Old 11-15-2019, 04:28 PM   #3
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Default Re: I am so happy......With my 1500W gear oil...

im not finding the oil when trying to search. where do you get it?
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Old 11-15-2019, 04:46 PM   #4
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Default Re: I am so happy......With my 1500W gear oil...

I think he meant to type Meropa
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Old 11-15-2019, 05:38 PM   #5
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Default Re: I am so happy......With my 1500W gear oil...

Quote:
Originally Posted by alexiskai View Post
I think he meant to type Meropa
YES !!! I am so sorry. Is Meropa.
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Old 11-15-2019, 05:39 PM   #6
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Default Re: I am so happy......With my 1500W gear oil...

Quote:
Originally Posted by mike657894 View Post
im not finding the oil when trying to search. where do you get it?
Here you go:

https://www.restorationstuff.com/eco...oducts_id=1088
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Old 11-15-2019, 09:20 PM   #7
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Default Re: I am so happy......With my 1500W gear oil...

Sounds like what I need for my Warford in the Model T. Thanks for the heads up.
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Old 11-16-2019, 09:41 AM   #8
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Default Re: I am so happy......With my 1500W gear oil...

Lucas Oil Stabilizer stays thick in the summer.
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Old 11-16-2019, 10:19 AM   #9
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Default Re: I am so happy......With my 1500W gear oil...

Chevron Meropa is an ISO-1500 grade which is equivalent to SAE-250 grade lubricant. This stuff has extreme pressure additives in it so it wouldn't be kind to any phosphor bronze bushings such as the reverse idler. Most old transmissions use the lubes with no EP additives like GL1. Restoration Supply touts that it is good with yellow metals but I wonder where that information came from. Chevron's info even states it has the heavy smell of EP additives.

There are other ISO 1500 lubricant available that have no additives.
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Old 11-16-2019, 12:53 PM   #10
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Default Re: I am so happy......With my 1500W gear oil...

Quote:
Originally Posted by eagle View Post
Lucas Oil Stabilizer stays thick in the summer.
Well, being "synthetic" possibly the original synthetic oil, STP will be more "consistent" in its viscosity relative to temperature.

As to EP additives in STP, the modern oils are (added to). New old stock found on Ebay IS NOT.

So I picked up the equivalent of a tranny full.

But the 1500W oil is nice to know.

Joe
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Old 11-16-2019, 03:14 PM   #11
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Default Re: I am so happy......With my 1500W gear oil...

Quote:
Originally Posted by rotorwrench View Post
Chevron Meropa is an ISO-1500 grade which is equivalent to SAE-250 grade lubricant. This stuff has extreme pressure additives in it so it wouldn't be kind to any phosphor bronze bushings such as the reverse idler. Most old transmissions use the lubes with no EP additives like GL1. Restoration Supply touts that it is good with yellow metals but I wonder where that information came from. Chevron's info even states it has the heavy smell of EP additives.

There are other ISO 1500 lubricant available that have no additives.
Please, provide info of those others and link to vendors. Just remember not all of us can by per gallon.

Thank you !!!
Daniel
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Old 11-16-2019, 10:53 PM   #12
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Default Re: I am so happy......With my 1500W gear oil...

Back, many years ago, I worked in a company named Sesco/Bay machine and we made vibration dampers for heliocopters. It was a simple device consisting of a " barrel " and a shaft with vanes on it. Much like a model A shock. We used in different models, a 1500 and a 2000 wgt oil. This oil was clear as water and poured alike cement. We had to fill them at night and let the bubbles float to the surface over night. Then refill them in the morning. I believe this was real 1500 weight oil and would cancel a lot of HP as the gears plowed through it. However, it would have done a great job of slowing the gears in the trans down and probably not leaked any of it out. Who makes it? It was a long time ago and I don't recall the refiner. But it is something to remember, that this stuff is made.
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Old 11-17-2019, 08:17 AM   #13
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Default Re: I am so happy......With my 1500W gear oil...

Quote:
Originally Posted by rotorwrench View Post
....Restoration Supply touts that it is good with yellow metals but I wonder where that information came from. Chevron's info even states it has the heavy smell of EP additives.
CHEVRON Meropa info states that the copper corrosion test is 1B.

I searched online what 1B means. I found this video and pasted the below section:

https://youtu.be/WfDRmMXUTy4


....The technician will report the results as a number followed by a letter according to the ASTM ranges. These ranges include freshly polished, slightly tarnished (1a to 1b), moderately tarnished (2a to 2e), dark tarnish (3a to 3b), and corrosion (4a to 4c).

This test is often performed for automotive companies to determine how suitable a lubricant is for lubricating parts such as bearings that contain copper or copper alloys because corrosion can cause premature bearing failures. While this test does not measure the ability of the grease to inhibit copper corrosion caused by factors other than the grease itself nor does it measure the stability of the grease in the presence of copper, it does ensure that a grease will protect the metal surface it comes in contact with over time......

Link to Chevron Meropa info file:

https://cglapps.chevron.com/msdspds/...&docFormat=PDF

Could be, that Restoration Supplies states "Does not affect yellow metals " because the copper corrosion test is 1B on all of these Meropa gear oils ?

Daniel

Last edited by Forddan; 11-17-2019 at 08:28 AM.
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Old 11-17-2019, 10:22 AM   #14
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Default Re: I am so happy......With my 1500W gear oil...

If you notice the description of Chevron Meropa, it is listed as an industrial gear lubricant and as such was not blended with automotive use in mind.

Lubriplate SPO gear lube is still available in SAE 250 and it is a straight mineral.
https://www.lubriplate.com/Products/...O-299/SPO-299/

The presence of sulfuric and phosphoric acid is always marked by the smell. If it is in low quantities such as GL3/4 then it would be considered mild EP and not extreme. Since it is industrial grade, it doesn't have to be rated for automotive use. The industrial EP ratings can be misleading when comparing them to the normal API automotive grading system. Any tarnish of copper is a sign of extreme EP and heat & moisture just make it worse. The stuff might work fine with no detrimental effects but it's good to know the risks. Modern industrial uses likely have no yellow metals to worry about. Most have huge ball or roller bearings. Phosphor bronze has copper but it also has tin and phosphorus so the copper test only tells part of the story.

https://www.nyelubricants.com/lubric...pper-corrosion


Older helicopters had hydraulic dampers but none do now days. I still work on the old Bell 47 helicopters and they used to have the who-die dampers for the stabilizer bar but they only used Mill-H-5606 hydraulic oil in those. They had so many problems with the stabilizer bars that most folks operating them install a N0 Bar kit and did away with them. It certainly cut down on maintenance times but it made the flight controls a lot more sensitive.

Last edited by rotorwrench; 11-17-2019 at 11:26 AM.
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Old 11-17-2019, 01:51 PM   #15
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Default Re: I am so happy......With my 1500W gear oil...

Rotorwrench... thank you for your answer and teaching me.

If I understand correctly, the Lubriplate gear oil SAE250 will be of the same "Molasse Density Type" as the Meropa 1500W. Is this correct ?

Thanks
Daniel

Last edited by Forddan; 11-17-2019 at 02:44 PM.
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Old 11-18-2019, 11:59 AM   #16
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Default Re: I am so happy......With my 1500W gear oil...

It not ISO-1500 so it's not as viscous but it is ISO-1000 so it's still pretty thick stuff. Lincoln used to use SAE-250 for the gearbox & axle assemblies so it's not unheard of. You can run GL5 in the transmissions for a while without eating any bearings up but its the long game that can cause problems eventually. If the ISO-1500 is working then use it up unless you bought a 55 gallon drum of the stuff.

I am still using up and old pail of Texaco Thuban SAE-140 that I use for build up oil in aircraft engine overhauls and that stuff is pretty thick. It's definitely noticeably thicker than SAE-85W/140 multi vis that I use in the helicopter gearboxes. SAE-250 is too thick for my old Mercury overdrive transmissions. I use the Stay-Lube 85W/90 GL-4 for them. It's a mild EP but those transmissions have a one way sprag free wheel unit in them due to the overdrive. They can't take high EP at all. Sometimes I just use SAE-50 grade 100 aircraft motor oil in them but it has to be the oil with no TCP lycoming additive in it. The TCP is worse than the sulfur/phosphate EP additives in gear oil. SAE 50 motor oil is the same viscosity as SAE-90 gear lube since they are graded differently.

Last edited by rotorwrench; 11-18-2019 at 12:05 PM.
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Old 11-18-2019, 12:52 PM   #17
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Default Re: I am so happy......With my 1500W gear oil...

Forddan Im thinking of following your lead here. I have a few questions. Did you have good 600w from the suppliers before the 1500? I just put macs 600 in trans and rear. less than 100 miles yet. I can get some silent shifts if I hit my double shift well enough. In your original post you make it sound like your trans now shifts like a syncro unit because of this oil. Is it that good? Im leery as I put standard modern rear end oil in my axle when I got it and developed a slight low speed noise back there.
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Old 11-18-2019, 01:53 PM   #18
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Default Re: I am so happy......With my 1500W gear oil...

I believe Macs 600w is just SAE140 gear oil. I have that and 600W from Brattons. The stuff from Brattons is darker, thicker and has no gear oil smell to it. I used the Macs in the rear end and switched to Brattons in the transmission, it shifts smoother now.
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Old 11-18-2019, 02:08 PM   #19
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Default Re: I am so happy......With my 1500W gear oil...

I have the stuff from Mike's in my tranny, diff, and steering column. Seems fine, silent shifts when I have the RPMs right and reasonably forgiving when I don't.
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Old 11-18-2019, 04:42 PM   #20
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Default Re: I am so happy......With my 1500W gear oil...

Quote:
Originally Posted by alexiskai View Post
I have the stuff from Mike's in my tranny, diff, and steering column. Seems fine, silent shifts when I have the RPMs right and reasonably forgiving when I don't.
Really? I tried the GL1500 in my trans and it was really hard to shift in the morning. And it doesn't get that cold it Southern California.

Once it warmed up it shifted OK but nothing spectacular. I went back to 600W.

I see no reason to put 1500W in the rear end or steering. I use Penrite in the steering box.
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