Bring a Trailer Auction results 1928 Sport Coupe

[Fairview]

Looks like a good result for a decent Model A:

https://bringatrailer.com/listing/1928-ford-model-a-7/

[Oldbluoval]

Good result for buyer or seller?
Add buyers premium and looks really good for seller and auction house
Way below restoration cost but seems expensive for a 28 coupe

[1931 flamingo]

Obviously somebody wanted it and stepped up.
Paul in CT

[Oldbluoval]

Yep an auction is the absolute determination of value
Willing buyer/ willing seller

[RUNNERBUN]

That car is worth exactly $26750. That is what someone was prepared to pay for it. And don't forget that there was a second bidder that pushed the price up to where it finished at.

[Oldbluoval]

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+10% !

[Jim/GA]

Originally Posted by Oldbluoval

+10% !

No, on Bring-a-Trailer, the buyer pays +5%.

Not too bad.

[37 Coupe]

Originally Posted by Jim/TX/GA

No, on Bring-a-Trailer, the buyer pays +5%.

Not too bad.

At a local auction last August ,well actually it was Lloyd Young's estate auction,some of you may know his name as an installer for years of overdrives. At the auction I think at least three Model A's sold one a '29 roadster that was I think $26,000,but the reason I even went to the auction was the red '31 pickup. Lloyd did not restore the pickup but another local guy did and I was very interested in it.I didn't think it would go as high as it did,think it was close to $20,000 but the auctioneer added a 10% so I had to keep reminding myself of that and I dropped out of the bidding. I never understand a premium added especially when the auction is an onsite one not on auctioneers premises.I think sales tax was added also at 6 1/2% but may be wrong on that. A local old car club guy was standing next to me and told me he had looked at the pickup 10 years ago,same condition mayby less the overdrive but he regretfully thought the asking price of $8,500.00 was a bit too high. He was in shock.

[ronn]

well kept coupe for such an old restoration.

Pricey, maybe, but try and restore one for that today. wont happen.

[Fairview]

Originally Posted by ronn

well kept coupe for such an old restoration.

Pricey, maybe, but try and restore one for that today. wont happen.

That is for sure. It is not just limited to Model As. I can’t think of many cars that financially justify a complete and competent restoration, at least in the short term. If you can restore a desirable car, then wait for the market to catch up while you enjoy owning it, then it starts to make sense.

I’ve seen several nicely restored or preserved Model As struggle to be sold in the last few years. That is why it is heartening to see the Model A sold on Bring A Trailer fetch a good price and get favorable reviews on a platform that seems better suited to more recent and exotic cars.

There are some exceptions to the restoration costs are more than the market value, but don’t you agree there are very few?

[old Tom]

I have a 28 sport coupe and my spare is in the rear. Did they make different types for 28?

[Jim/GA]

Originally Posted by old Tom

I have a 28 sport coupe and my spare is in the rear. Did they make different types for 28?

Yes, they were sold both ways. Rear mounted more common.

[BRENT in 10-uh-C]

Originally Posted by 37 Coupe

. I didn't think it would go as high as it did,think it was close to $20,000 but the auctioneer added a 10% so I had to keep reminding myself of that and I dropped out of the bidding. I never understand a premium added especially when the auction is an onsite one not on auctioneers premises.I think sales tax was added also at 6 1/2% but may be wrong on that.

I keep saying this over & over but labor have become too expensive in this country. The amount of labor it takes to mobilize parts, cars, & items for an auction has become too expensive. Someone must pay to have it done. Most auction companies know their #1 job is to extract as much money as possible for their client (the Seller). If two auction companies appraise the contents of the estate and both a privately thinking they need 35% of the proceeds to have a successful sale, when they approach the Seller and one company says they will do it for 35% of the hammer price, --and the other says they will do it for 25% of the hammer price and will collect 10% from the Buyer, ...who do you think the Seller is going to sign with??

Originally Posted by ronn

Pricey, maybe, but try and restore one for that today. wont happen.

Exactly, -and unfortunately it is Model-A hobbyists themselves who are the worst at "armchair appraising" what someone else's Model-A is worth on the market. Generally speaking they want to keep the market prices low, ….except when they want to sell their own Model-A.


.

[30 Closed Cab PU]

Originally Posted by BRENT in 10-uh-C

I keep saying this over & over but labor have become too expensive in this country. The amount of labor it takes to mobilize parts, cars, & items for an auction has become too expensive. Someone must pay to have it done. Most auction companies know their #1 job is to extract as much money as possible for their client (the Seller). If two auction companies appraise the contents of the estate and both a privately thinking they need 35% of the proceeds to have a successful sale, when they approach the Seller and one company says they will do it for 35% of the hammer price, --and the other says they will do it for 25% of the hammer price and will collect 10% from the Buyer, ...who do you think the Seller is going to sign with??

Exactly, -and unfortunately it is Model-A hobbyists themselves who are the worst at "armchair appraising" what someone else's Model-A is worth on the market. Generally speaking they want to keep the market prices low, ….except when they want to sell their own Model-A.


.

Do Auto Auctioning/Listings with a buyer's premium affect final proceeds to the Seller much? In other words, do Buyers have a tendency to spend more, or do they figure total cost and stick to the max they want to spend?


My father used to pretty much shun buying things at Farm Auctions that had Buyer's premiums unless there was something he really wanted/needed. We knew of some farmers that would not even go to any auctions with Buyer's premiums.

[barry022]

Just because an auction site states a car sold for a certain price, that doesn't mean the car sold for that price or in realty even sold at all.


Happens all the time.

[ronn]

Happens all the time.

very good point Barry. Auction cos like to look successful for future clients.

[old Tom]

Originally Posted by Jim/TX/GA

Yes, they were sold both ways. Rear mounted more common.

Thank You

[BRENT in 10-uh-C]

Originally Posted by 30 Closed Cab PU

Do Auto Auctioning/Listings with a buyer's premium affect final proceeds to the Seller much? In other words, do Buyers have a tendency to spend more, or do they figure total cost and stick to the max they want to spend?


My father used to pretty much shun buying things at Farm Auctions that had Buyer's premiums unless there was something he really wanted/needed. We knew of some farmers that would not even go to any auctions with Buyer's premiums.

While I have no scientific basis for my answer, my instinct is that a premium does not. Most people do not know the real value of something, -and while they might choose an arbitrary number ahead of time at a sale or even an eBay listing, so often the auction bids blow right past what someone valued it at. That, and the mindset that you were the top bidder but you are outbid however one more $10 bid might get it bought also plays in your mind.


For me, I would rather pay the premium as to get caught in the 'Bidder's Choice' triangle. If you are unfamiliar with this technique, the auctioneer groups items and lets the high bidder choose. A great example might be a group of 10 fenders in the lot which might consist of a mint R/F 1930 fender, a pair of nice factory welled 1931 fenders, a pair of 1932 fenders, and maybe a NOS 1937 fender and several other unidentifiable fenders. Everyone is gathered around and the bidding is moving fast. You have your eye on that 1930 fender and have hoped to buy it for less than $500 (-because you need it). You are bidding against 6 or 7 others but you have no idea whether they are bidding to pick that same R/F fender you are wanting, -or whether they are after the 37 fender or those '31 fenders. Generally speaking, no one is willing to take a chance on losing out on the fender they want, so in this type auction, the first 2 or 3 items go for way more money than they are worth. Knowledgeable Auctioneers are aware of this and will tell you that the entire lot will bring more money this way than individually selling the items. Ironically, to save time the auctioneer will allow the highest bidder to take as many items from the lot for the same money. So if the hammer fell at $750 for an item, the high bidder has the choice to take two items from that lot for $1500. Then they will ask the back-up bidder if he wants an item at his bid. If he bid $740 and wants the '37 fender, then he gets that and they start the lot auction over again. I have even seen where they will add the next lot of items beside the one you were just bidding on to keep the price up. Maybe you were holding out for those '32 fenders and now we have new items added to the lot which likely is drawing new bidders that you do not know what they are bidding on. Oh, and then factor in an auction that is simultaneously running an internet auction too on these items you are bidding on, and it really makes getting a bargain tough.

[old31]

Originally Posted by barry022

Just because an auction site states a car sold for a certain price, that doesn't mean the car sold for that price or in realty even sold at all.


Happens all the time.

I dont understand, I am not saying it is not true but I dont understand. Why the auction sites would say that.

[30 Closed Cab PU]

Brent - thanks for your insights, seems auctioneers know all the tricks, as a seller that is what you want. As a buyer trying to get deal sounds like it is frustrating., have to be careful or you quickly can overpay.

[BRENT in 10-uh-C]

Originally Posted by old31

I dont understand, I am not saying it is not true but I dont understand. Why the auction sites would say that.

Let's look at it from a different perspective. Auction sites need Sellers. When a prospective Seller is searching for a place to market their vehicle, it is easy for the Auction site to say check our previous sales. If it appears a similar vehicle has recently sold for a decent price (-maybe higher than average), it is a great sales tool to help convince a prospective Seller. If you are a Buyer, generally you don't tell everyone how much you paid for it, but if your friends see that on the 'net, it looks impressive that it appears that you paid that much. It also looks impressive to the Seller's peers too.

Originally Posted by 30 Closed Cab PU

Brent - thanks for your insights, seems auctioneers know all the tricks, as a seller that is what you want. As a buyer trying to get deal sounds like it is frustrating., have to be careful or you quickly can overpay.

Well a strong argument is made looking at this from both directions. By theory every sale of any item should be fair for both sides. In other words, the Seller should be compensated for the exact worth of an item. Let's call that Fair Market Value. The Buyer is also expected to pay exactly what something is worth or FMV. The Auctioneer is there to represent the Seller to try to obtain the full worth or FMV of each item.


It really is not "tricks" per se' unless the Auctioneer is being dishonest (-like shill bidding by a trash can or a person in the audience). I guess their attitude is the Buyer should start the bidding out at exactly the fair market value price so that they are playing fair with the Seller. Since most potential Buyers are unwilling to play the game that way, then it only seems fair that the Auctioneer will then equally play to the Seller's advantage in the sale. Therefore the best way to do that is to let each person tell the Auctioneer exactly what they will pay for it. The last one that tells the Auctioneer what they will give is generally called the 'high bidder'.

[30 Closed Cab PU]

Brent I agree with all of the above, my definition of "tricks " was not including dishonesty, but the best honest methods to maximize the winning bid.

[Ernie Vitucci]

Good Morning all...In my humble opinion...it is better to skip the auctions and purchase an 'A' from a private party who is a Model 'A' club member. The price is generally more reasonable and one can drive the car and see how it runs for a half hour or so...can't do that at an auction...more likely to obtain a pig in a poke at an auction...price can also depend to how many adult beverages the bidders have consumed...Ernie in Arizona

[Jeff/Illinois]

I prefer Ernie's way of thinking on this.

I've wasted a lot of time and energy attending auctions where the auctioneer was a complete arse as they say overseas.

I've seen plenty of shill bidding, calling out a 'bidder' in the back that didn't exist, and an auctioneer who would close the bidding immediately after the first call and announce 'well, Bill takes another one' and when people would complain that auctioneer would scold you and tell you they didn't see you bidding and 'get your hand in the air' boys if you want to bid (I was standing in front of him that day almost hitting him with my GD hand) after he sold a NOS McClintock radiator for a '28 Ford still in the box for 5 bucks. Bill 'got that one too' along with a lot of preemo sheetmetal and bare blocks. They went for 2 bucks a pop.

Me thinks perhaps 'Bill' was the auctioneer cleaning up on Model A parts for himself or his brother-in-law or some close friend. Bill also got a very nice '30 Dlx Roadster for a very small sum too.

Turns out the owner was in the nursing home with Alzheimer's and had no relation left. There was nobody to contest what was happening.

Never will go to or did go to one of THAT guy's auctions again.

[Jeff/Illinois]

Originally Posted by Fairview

Looks like a good result for a decent Model A:

https://bringatrailer.com/listing/1928-ford-model-a-7/

I agree, looking at the photos the car was well worth that price. Nice car.

[BRENT in 10-uh-C]

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Originally Posted by Jeff/Illinois

I prefer Ernie's way of thinking on this.

Then again, from my personal experiences, some of the most poorly restored Model-As was work done by MARC/MAFCA members. The same can be said for "professional restorations" too. Let the condition of the vehicle speak for itself and do not let the other sway opinions on how the condition should be.

[CHuDWah]

Originally Posted by old Tom

I have a 28 sport coupe and my spare is in the rear. Did they make different types for 28?

Originally Posted by Jim/TX/GA

Yes, they were sold both ways. Rear mounted more common.

True as far as it goes. Rear mount was standard (and therefore more common) - one or two fender mount(s) was extra-cost option, factory-installed on special order or dealer-installed.

[stillwater]

For an all original A in that condition, if I had the money I'd make the purchase.
You don't see such a nice original like that everyday. Awesome A.

[F.M.]

Originally Posted by stillwater

For an all original A in that condition, if I had the money I'd make the purchase.
You don't see such a nice original like that everyday. Awesome A.

That is a Big problem, It is "NO WHERE" Close to being "AN ALL ORIGINAL A"

[oliverguy]

I think the buyers are more educated now. We have the judging standards and these forums where ideas and pitfalls are shared. You can email a picture at an auction to a friend and get instant feedback. None of that was available to the buyer years ago.

The low priced cars are crappy old restorations and there are fewer and fewer original cars out there. Someday the only fodder for restoration will be fixing crappy restorations done 50 years ago.

Model a's are still the cheapest thing to restore.