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Old 03-16-2018, 09:12 PM   #1
M2M
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Default Need help in Fayetteville, AR with my 1st A

Okay; I've decided put my dream of buying a Soviet made GAZ A or AA, ( the Holy Grail of the Model A hobby as I'm sure you'd all agree ), on hold for the moment and purchase a 1931 Tudor on the spur of the moment.

Car seems to be a barely used older restoration; the old boy who owned it passed away last year. His son and I managed to start the car and I drove it onto my trailer and then off my trailer and into my garage.

I think I did something wrong or something happened with the pop-out ignition switch as the car now has no electrical power so I cannot start it.

Are there any guys located in NW AR who can drop by and give a Model A dummy a hand in figuring out what's happened?

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Old 03-17-2018, 11:28 AM   #2
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Default Re: Need help in Fayetteville, AR with my 1st A

If you have a smart phone that we can do video chat over, I can help you figure it out from here.

email me at tech@mafca.com with a phone number I can talk to you at.

Should be pretty easy. I recently helped a new Model A owner with a similar situation and it was a blown fuse from a bad brake light switch. Easy to trouble shoot.

.
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Old 03-18-2018, 05:51 PM   #3
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Default Re: Need help in Fayetteville, AR with my 1st A

Great looking car! Jeff
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Old 03-18-2018, 06:40 PM   #4
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Default Re: Need help in Fayetteville, AR with my 1st A

Jim, thanks for the offer for help via phone video, much appreciated. I found out that the local Model A club has their monthly meeting tomorrow night so I'll go along to that to join and also ask whether anyone has time to visit me and have a look at the car.

I pulled the 6v battery out yesterday to charge it with my cheap auto-select 6v/12v charger but the charger warning light for having the cables connected to the wrong terminals comes on. The charger works fine with a 12v battery. Will take the battery and charger to someone to see what's going on. I'm not really a fan of 6v so I might adopt Purdy Swoft's ideology of running a completely stock original model A generator on 12 volts

Jeff, thanks; the car does look quite good. I also hoping some of the local Model A guys can take a good look at the car to give me an idea of the quality of the restoration including the engine rebuild. When you buy a classic car you hope for the best but prepare for the worst.

My plan is to get the car running and start using it then decide what to change or add to it. Have this vague crazy idea of having a Model A with 4x4 by adding a banjo front axle, GAZ B block and transmission off a Russian GAZ 67b jeep...I wonder what Purdy thinks of that??? Here's a reminder of the GAZ 67b:

https://fordbarn.com/forum/showthread.php?t=236909
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Old 03-18-2018, 07:24 PM   #5
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Default Re: Need help in Fayetteville, AR with my 1st A

I'm glad you found a local club to talk to and get help from. And soon go out driving with. That's what I really enjoy.

Don't let a malfunctioning battery charger push you into converting to 12 volts. That's kind of the tail wagging the dog. Just get a charger that works. Get the car running and see what it needs first. Bond with the car. Modify slowly.

Most of all, have fun!!!
.
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Old 03-18-2018, 07:42 PM   #6
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Originally Posted by Jim/TX/GA View Post
I'm glad you found a local club to talk to and get help from. And soon go out driving with. That's what I really enjoy.

Don't let a malfunctioning battery charger push you into converting to 12 volts. That's kind of the tail wagging the dog. Just get a charger that works. Get the car running and see what it needs first. Bond with the car. Modify slowly.

Most of all, have fun!!!
.
Here's a thought did you pay attention of how the battery came out of it if your charger will not accept it it sounds like it has been charged up backwards

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Old 03-18-2018, 09:47 PM   #7
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Default Re: Need help in Fayetteville, AR with my 1st A

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Here's a thought did you pay attention of how the battery came out of it if your charger will not accept it it sounds like it has been charged up backwards

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That's not uncommon. When someone who doesn't know what they are doing installs a battery, they often assume it can only go in with negative earth.
When you were here, we spoke about you finding a local club. Glad you did and I think you will be too.
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Old 03-19-2018, 07:21 AM   #8
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Default Re: Need help in Fayetteville, AR with my 1st A

I hope Russian built Model As were better than some of Russias' own BRAND CARS.
It's GREAT Fun to study them! They even copied some American Body Styling!
Bill W.
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Old 03-19-2018, 10:57 AM   #9
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Talking Re: Need help in Fayetteville, AR with my 1st A

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I hope Russian built Model As were better than some of Russias' own BRAND CARS.
It's GREAT Fun to study them! They even copied some American Body Styling!
Bill W.
Bill, according to the GAZ supervisory official responsible for the political education (ideology) of the workers, the Soviet made Model As were much better made than the capitalist Model As made in the USA, Australia, etc.

USA Ford workers also had to bow to an ideology, not the one preached by Lenin, Marx and Engels but rather Henry Ford, see:


https://jalopnik.com/when-henry-ford...-wo-1549625731

https://www.entrepreneur.com/article/197524
Quote:
"To ensure his workers put in a full day's work, Ford created the Service Department, a foreman and a group of supervisors, many of whom were ex-cons and boxers, who ruled the plant through fear and coercion."
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Old 03-19-2018, 12:32 PM   #10
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Default Re: Need help in Fayetteville, AR with my 1st A

For even more interesting things about Henry Ford, search FORDLANDIA!
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Old 03-19-2018, 01:48 PM   #11
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Here's a thought did you pay attention of how the battery came out of it if your charger will not accept it it sounds like it has been charged up backwards
You were correct, as was my cheap battery charger! I took the battery to an auto electrician and that's what he found. He said to get the battery down to near zero (it's at 3.5V now) then recharge the correct way.
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Old 03-19-2018, 04:26 PM   #12
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Default Re: Need help in Fayetteville, AR with my 1st A

The battery very likely won't recover full capacity but its always worth trying to rescue it. Put a load on it, any light bulb will work, let it sit until stone dead, then use a trickle charger to bring it back up to voltage. Let it trickle charge for a few days. Most of the automatic chargers won't charge a completely dead battery. Make sure the car hasn't been converted to negative ground, then install it back into the car, making sure to ground the positive side of the battery. You'll then need to start the car, take a jumper wire and quickly short across the cutout on the generator to polarize the generator.
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Old 03-20-2018, 12:31 PM   #13
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Question Re: Need help in Fayetteville, AR with my 1st A

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The battery very likely won't recover full capacity but its always worth trying to rescue it. Put a load on it, any light bulb will work, let it sit until stone dead, then use a trickle charger to bring it back up to voltage. Let it trickle charge for a few days. Most of the automatic chargers won't charge a completely dead battery. Make sure the car hasn't been converted to negative ground, then install it back into the car, making sure to ground the positive side of the battery. You'll then need to start the car, take a jumper wire and quickly short across the cutout on the generator to polarize the generator.
Thanks for your reply. How can I check if the car has been converted to negative ground? Why would someone do that?

So I know my 6v battery has been charged backwards and that the "+" terminal on the battery was connected to the chassis...which leads to the question; was my car running negative ground since the "+" terminal is not actually positive?

Can a car not converted to negative ground still start and run when it has been negative ground? What damage could this cause?
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Old 03-20-2018, 06:14 PM   #14
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Thanks for your reply. How can I check if the car has been converted to negative ground? Why would someone do that?


Because some people can't understand electricity, and think it needs to be changed. Back in the day 6 volts positive ground was more common than negative ground.

So I know my 6v battery has been charged backwards and that the "+" terminal on the battery was connected to the chassis...which leads to the question; was my car running negative ground since the "+" terminal is not actually positive?



The larger post is the positive one and should have been ground. Test the posts with your volt meter to verify which is now reading positive. Drain the charge and recharge if need be.


Can a car not converted to negative ground still start and run when it has been negative ground? What damage could this cause?

Yes, it will start and run, but the ammeter should show opposite of what is normal, unless someone swapped the wires on the rear of it.
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Old 03-21-2018, 10:30 AM   #15
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Default Re: Need help in Fayetteville, AR with my 1st A

It is tempting to fiddle with your new toy as soon as you get it. I’m guilty of that myself. But since this is your first A, slow down and take some time to learn the basics of the car before you start changing things out. The Model A has several unique features that you will want to learn about and preserve if you are truly interested in owning and driving an antique vehicle. There are several books you should read first, and joining a club is a good idea.

But if you ‘’Have this vague crazy idea of having a Model A with 4x4 by adding a banjo front axle, GAZ B block and transmission off a Russian GAZ 67b jeep.’’, forget any advice here; you bought the wrong car.
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Old 03-21-2018, 02:34 PM   #16
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But if you ‘’Have this vague crazy idea of having a Model A with 4x4 by adding a banjo front axle, GAZ B block and transmission off a Russian GAZ 67b jeep.’’, forget any advice here; you bought the wrong car.
That's a bit harsh isn't it? Were there not Snowbird conversion kits for Model As? Also, Livingwood who made 4x4 kits for Model Ts I've read did work on a 4x4 kit for Model As...but actually, I'm unlikely to try to convert this car to 4x4 because it's just too nice to take apart. If I had a car needing restoration I think trying to convert it to 4x4 with a pre-war design would be great fun and no less good for the hobby than hi-comp heads, Mitchell o/d, etc.

Tom, thanks for the info.
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Old 03-21-2018, 07:07 PM   #17
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That's a bit harsh isn't it? Were there not Snowbird conversion kits for Model As? Also, Livingwood who made 4x4 kits for Model Ts I've read did work on a 4x4 kit for Model As...but actually, I'm unlikely to try to convert this car to 4x4 because it's just too nice to take apart. If I had a car needing restoration I think trying to convert it to 4x4 with a pre-war design would be great fun and no less good for the hobby than hi-comp heads, Mitchell o/d, etc.

Tom, thanks for the info.
Yeah, rereading my comment, that part was a little harsh. I apologize for the offense. But I stand by the first part.
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Old 03-22-2018, 09:44 AM   #18
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Default Re: Need help in Fayetteville, AR with my 1st A

If still need help, I am in Springdale just south of the walmart on Elm
springs road. tim
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Old 03-22-2018, 08:31 PM   #19
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Yeah, rereading my comment, that part was a little harsh. I apologize for the offense. But I stand by the first part.
No problem, no offense taken. I agree totally with the first part you wrote about not rushing into making changes or "upgrades".

Tim, thanks for your message. Will send you a PM.
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Old 04-12-2018, 01:21 AM   #20
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Default Re: Need help in Fayetteville, AR with my 1st A

No visits yet from any local A guys so I did some looking and research and think I found the source of my problems. My pop-out ignition key says Made in Spain. I did a search and it seems these are junk, see:

https://fordbarn.com/forum/showthrea...ht=FS+ignition

What are parts made in Dictator Generalissimo Franco's Spain doing on my A???

Whether the switch is pushed in or popped out, I can activate the starter so that's maybe what drained my reverse charged battery down.

I don't want to spend $200 on an original rebuilt pop-out so can someone suggest a good quality switch to buy and install? Is installation of a new switch straightforward? Thanks.
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