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Old 08-23-2010, 03:06 PM   #1
kenparker
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Default Model A Fords and Ford 2.0 and 2.3 engines

I am off on a new wild hair. The adapting a 2.3 liter engine (Ford Ranger Pickup) engine into a Model A. I have read and heard that the 2.0 Pinto engine is an easy adapt and the 2.3 is not a good choice due to fit or some other problem. Can someone shed some light on the goood and bads of putting a 2.3 liter engine in a Model A? i have two of the 2.3 liter engines and want something to do with them.
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Old 08-23-2010, 03:42 PM   #2
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Default Re: Model A Fords and Ford 2.0 and 2.3 engines

They go in Pintos, don't they?

I think this would be a good question for the HAMB.

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Old 08-23-2010, 03:46 PM   #3
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Default Re: Model A Fords and Ford 2.0 and 2.3 engines

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Originally Posted by kenparker View Post
I am off on a new wild hair. The adapting a 2.3 liter engine (Ford Ranger Pickup) engine into a Model A. I have read and heard that the 2.0 Pinto engine is an easy adapt and the 2.3 is not a good choice due to fit or some other problem. Can someone shed some light on the goood and bads of putting a 2.3 liter engine in a Model A? i have two of the 2.3 liter engines and want something to do with them.
You're kidding.... right?
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Old 08-23-2010, 03:46 PM   #4
marc hildebrant
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Default Re: Model A Fords and Ford 2.0 and 2.3 engines

Ken,

Does the car have a Model A engine now ? If so, why change it ?

Marc
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Old 08-23-2010, 04:02 PM   #5
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Default Re: Model A Fords and Ford 2.0 and 2.3 engines

A bad choice! Some research will point out the the gearing on a Model A will allow the engine to spin at about 2300 or so at 50 mph. A Pinto engine is not developing much horsepower at that speed and little torque. They make a neat little around town car a pain to drive IMHO. I have owned one and that was my take.

Spend what it takes to make the A or B engine run correctly and these cars are a joy.
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Old 08-23-2010, 04:54 PM   #6
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Default Re: Model A Fords and Ford 2.0 and 2.3 engines

The good would be you would spend some money and help the economy some. The bad would be the car really wouldn't be a Model A Ford any longer.
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Old 08-23-2010, 05:12 PM   #7
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Default Re: Model A Fords and Ford 2.0 and 2.3 engines

Why put this kind of garbage on this forum; most of us like to keep our A's with a 4 cylinder A or B engine.

Sorry thats how I feel !!!!!

Ron
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Old 08-23-2010, 05:25 PM   #8
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Default Re: Model A Fords and Ford 2.0 and 2.3 engines

Ron, I couldn't agree more. What's wrong with a Model A engine? If some wants to have more power, then go to another car that would satisfy him. Just my 2 cents.
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Old 08-23-2010, 05:27 PM   #9
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Default Re: Model A Fords and Ford 2.0 and 2.3 engines

OK.....I'm just finishing up a build on a 1.8 sohc Courier engine. Domed .040 pistons, Offy Dual Port manifold, Weber carb, Crower cam, balanced crank, lightened flywheel and a 4 speed ZF transmission. It's going in a '29 huckster with a 3:78 gears and an open driveshaft. Did my homework and with the gearing and a cam set for max torque at 3000 to 4000 RPM, these should be a great runnerToo bad these guys are bad mouthing those of us with creative juices! The stock A rear end, drive shaft with a BorgWarnert O'drive is being passed on FREE to a guy with a 31 ccpu. It will join my fleet of award winning model A powered hot rods with period correct speed equipment.
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Old 08-23-2010, 06:00 PM   #10
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Default Re: Model A Fords and Ford 2.0 and 2.3 engines

Ken, are you not the fellow who built (still building) the slant window with the pinto engine, or do I have U mixed up with someone else?
Paul in CT
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Old 08-23-2010, 06:07 PM   #11
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Default Re: Model A Fords and Ford 2.0 and 2.3 engines

Denis, I don't think that folks here are necessarily bad mouthing y'all with creative juices but asking it on this type of forum is kinda like publicly asking for advice on starting a 'House of Ill Repute' to attendees at the Republican National Party fund raiser!

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Old 08-23-2010, 06:20 PM   #12
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Default Re: Model A Fords and Ford 2.0 and 2.3 engines

There was a guy named Dick Sparks who had a 2.3 motor in one of his cars. I tried doing the same thing in my coupe and ran into a few problems. One is if you plan to make it fit in like the Model A motor does you need to grind the oil filter boss off the block to make the Model A starter clear, also the Model A starter needs to have some grinding on it to make it fit also. Once you grind this oil filter boss off you run into the problem of hitting the water jacket in the 2.3 motor which then would need to be fixed if you get to close like I did.

Another thing you will also need to have an adapter made to make it bolt up to the Model A flywheel housing, you will also need to have a round spacer made to extend the 2.3 crank to allow you to run the Model A or 39 transmission. It can be done but the 2.3 I think only puts out 90hp stock and you can come close to that with a good Model B with some bolt on goodies.

I think I still have some info on the 2.3 I can find if you want more info.
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Old 08-23-2010, 06:30 PM   #13
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Default Re: Model A Fords and Ford 2.0 and 2.3 engines

There are many new street rod frames and repro bodies out there. Put your 2.3's in something like that and leave the stock Model A's stock.
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Old 08-23-2010, 06:34 PM   #14
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Default Re: Model A Fords and Ford 2.0 and 2.3 engines

a 2.3 does not belong in a model a.........duh
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Old 08-23-2010, 06:40 PM   #15
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Default Re: Model A Fords and Ford 2.0 and 2.3 engines

Call Dick Sparks in Tyler, Tx at 903-360-7116. He put one his slant windshield sedan
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Old 08-23-2010, 07:33 PM   #16
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Default My 2 cents ?

It's his car! He wasn't asking for a opinon on
installing it ,Only if we had any fit advise!!!
If you guys want to save them all. Start buying all you can find. Then do with them what you please because you then own them.
My self i'am almost a purest , But belive that if it's yours you can do what you want. If i can help you solve a problem i will. But with hold
criticizing you on your choices!
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Old 08-23-2010, 08:41 PM   #17
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Default Re: Model A Fords and Ford 2.0 and 2.3 engines

05-24-2010, 12:19 AM #5 Ryan
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Re: Non HAMB rod sections
The ford barn will focus on restoration... And stock fords. We might have a side bar here and there, but restoration will remain the focus.

Once the novelty wears off the new format, we will start pointing more in that direction.
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so i take this as if you want to put a 2.0,2.3, or a 7.3 diesel in your model A it belongs on another forum.....
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Old 08-23-2010, 09:07 PM   #18
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Default Re: Model A Fords and Ford 2.0 and 2.3 engines

Look if your going to do the Pinto 4 cylinder inline and live with this engine that was designed with a higher rev limit might as well go for broke and find a
FORD V-4. They are around. Ford sold them to SAAB and SAAB used them in their SAAB Sonnet. These ran as smooth as a Mazda Rotary. Dad and I cut the 40 hp Johnson 2 cycle O/B off the back of one of his houseboats and hung this Ford V-4 IB/OB unit on the transom. Sweet motor. Nice and short, not too wide.

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Old 08-23-2010, 09:11 PM   #19
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Default Re: Model A Fords and Ford 2.0 and 2.3 engines

Brent....it's way to easy to twist tails on the Fordbarn! That said, I will swear on a stack of Bibles to never post hot rod stuff here if there are no pix of 16" wheels, tips on installing inserts, showing how to install a '39 transmission or instructions on installing a third brake light on a ccpu.

I appreciate the work that goes into the restoration of a Model A. By the same token, there was plenty of speed equipment available for T's and A's in the twenties and thirties. Finally, every single one of my hot rod A's was manufactured from bits and pieces and every single piece that was usable was sold for pennies on the dollar or given away. So, perhaps the purists should get a sense of humor.
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Old 08-23-2010, 09:42 PM   #20
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Default Re: Model A Fords and Ford 2.0 and 2.3 engines

Quote:
Originally Posted by denis4x4 View Post
brent....it's way to easy to twist tails on the fordbarn! That said, i will swear on a stack of bibles to never post hot rod stuff here if there are no pix of 16" wheels, tips on installing inserts, showing how to install a '39 transmission or instructions on installing a third brake light on a ccpu.

I appreciate the work that goes into the restoration of a model a. By the same token, there was plenty of speed equipment available for t's and a's in the twenties and thirties. Finally, every single one of my hot rod a's was manufactured from bits and pieces and every single piece that was usable was sold for pennies on the dollar or given away. So, perhaps the purists should get a sense of humor.
^amen
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Old 08-23-2010, 11:29 PM   #21
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Default Re: Model A Fords and Ford 2.0 and 2.3 engines

You bring up some good points Denis. I have a Hot Rod 31 A-V8 roadster, and a STOCK 30 Tudor. Personally, I don't want to mix the two. I like this forum for talk on the stock, not modified A's, although it does get kind of murky sometimes with alternators, overdrives, and electronic stuff, etc.
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Old 08-24-2010, 12:03 AM   #22
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Default Re: Model A Fords and Ford 2.0 and 2.3 engines

Quote:
Originally Posted by denis4x4 View Post
Too bad these guys are bad mouthing those of us with creative juices!
I think it's more a matter of the fact that there are MANY places to go on the web for Hot Rods and severe mods for a car. The same cannot be said for stock or near stock Model A's.

The "bad mouthing" of those with "creative juices" comes from the wanting to protect one of the very few places where stock questions can be asked and answered.

The best answers for questions is to go where there are the most people of the same mind set. I can ask guys about cars as the escort their wifes to a quilting show, but I'm more likley to get better answers at a car show!!
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Old 08-24-2010, 03:07 AM   #23
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Default Re: Model A Fords and Ford 2.0 and 2.3 engines

I see it from this perspective. This forum, and the early V8 forum, are about making our As and V8s better. Installing a Pinto in a Model A is not making it better, it's a retrograde step. The Pinto might have more hp, but it doesn't have enough low end torque to pull the skin off a rice pudding.
Someone in this part of the world briefly made full fendered glass A roadsters with Pinto running gear (or our local equivalent) and they were awful.
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Old 08-24-2010, 03:49 AM   #24
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Default Re: Model A Fords and Ford 2.0 and 2.3 engines

Gidday Bassman. Who made those? I'm assuming that if we're talking Pinto down here it would have been the 2.0 litre Cortina motor.

One of the neighbours in my sub division had a fibreglass, Roadster rod, but its an 8 cyl. Looks good for what it is, but I'm glad he hadn't done it to an original Roadster

Cheers
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Old 08-24-2010, 07:38 AM   #25
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Default Re: Model A Fords and Ford 2.0 and 2.3 engines

BTW, gang. The Model A chassi followed me home two weeks ago. It was the leftovers from a hotrodder who is using the body for something else. I am/was looking for alternatives to getting a motor for the chassi so I could drive it up and down the street and chase dogs . Eventually it will have some kind of Model A body on it or maybe I can build anothe speedster from scratch. I have plenty of Model A blocks for future motor rebuilds, but, over $3000 to have a motor rebuilt is not in the cards right now.

But for you purist I have an all stock 28 pickup I cna play with, an almost stock 31 coupe and am almost finished with the 31 S/W, plus the 1928 speedster.

And thank you denis4x4 for your comments. You are absolutely correct.
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Old 08-24-2010, 07:50 AM   #26
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Default Re: Model A Fords and Ford 2.0 and 2.3 engines

Ken and others shouldn't be asking purist how to hot rod their model A's. They should just go to the H.A.M.B site. Hot rodders would love to tell you how to rod the A's. In my opinion, this site is for tech help....
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Old 08-24-2010, 07:52 AM   #27
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Default Re: Model A Fords and Ford 2.0 and 2.3 engines

More fuel, if your chassis is bare I would consider swapping eng AND trans and convert ORIGINAL r/end to o/drive (kit is avail=speedway motors). JMO
Paul in CT Body would still mount w/full hood. Could leave e/thing else "original"
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Old 08-24-2010, 08:11 AM   #28
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Default Re: Model A Fords and Ford 2.0 and 2.3 engines

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mitch//pa View Post
05-24-2010, 12:19 AM #5 Ryan
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Re: Non HAMB rod sections
The ford barn will focus on restoration... And stock fords. We might have a side bar here and there, but restoration will remain the focus.

Once the novelty wears off the new format, we will start pointing more in that direction.
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.....

Denis & Jordan, ...if you go back and look, I did not condemn anyone or offer any opinion regarding installing a Pinto engine in a Model A. All I did was offer a slightly humorous point of view (note the big smiley face) regarding why Ken likely received the scorns that he did.

I WILL say that Ryan has made it 'crystal clear' what purpose this forum is intended for. If you feel those who defended this purpose are being unfair, ...consider taking it up privately with Ryan since he is the owner but please don't condem those who are making a stand for what they feel is right and are just following the rules.

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Old 08-24-2010, 09:10 AM   #29
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Smile Re: Model A Fords and Ford 2.0 and 2.3 engines

Gents, The man asked a simple question and was seeking an answer to something that had been discussed on the old Barn. If you don't have positive input or an answer to his question please resist the temptation to post snide remarks.
If this forum is strictly for stock model A's then don't discuss 12 volt batteries, alternators, V8 clutches, A/C, hydraulic brakes, turn signals, halogen light bulbs, down draft carburetors, synchronized transmissions, insert bearings etc.

Just my $.02
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Old 08-24-2010, 10:01 AM   #30
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Default Re: Model A Fords and Ford 2.0 and 2.3 engines

Quote:
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Gents, The man asked a simple question and was seeking an answer to something that had been discussed on the old Barn. If you don't have positive input or an answer to his question please resist the temptation to post snide remarks.
If this forum is strictly for stock model A's then don't discuss 12 volt batteries, alternators, V8 clutches, A/C, hydraulic brakes, turn signals, halogen light bulbs, down draft carburetors, synchronized transmissions, insert bearings etc.

Just my $.02

I did not mean to imply that I disapproved of the proposed modification. But I think it was made pretty clear when the board changed hands that modifications outside of the period correct (i.e. Cragar head, speedster building) or "touring" (insert bearings, hydraulic brakes) realm now belong on the HAMB. Not everyone heard that, so I just provided the gentleman a link.

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Old 08-24-2010, 10:08 AM   #31
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Question Re: Model A Fords and Ford 2.0 and 2.3 engines



Hi guy's,



Pinto engine in a Model A ,,Yes we've seem a few..Doe's anybody remember the Pinto with the A or B engine in it ?. I remember it was at one of the swap meet's in Long Beach ( Cal ) back in the 80's



Now that's insanity !!

Greg way out west
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Old 08-24-2010, 10:08 AM   #32
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Default Re: Model A Fords and Ford 2.0 and 2.3 engines

But a Burtz mill, A/C, and tube shocks are OK?

As my Dad's last words, "un-believable"

GW
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Old 08-24-2010, 10:15 AM   #33
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Default Re: Model A Fords and Ford 2.0 and 2.3 engines

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Originally Posted by Ron in Quincy View Post
Why put this kind of garbage on this forum; most of us like to keep our A's with a 4 cylinder A or B engine.

Sorry thats how I feel !!!!!

Ron
Take your question to a forum that doesn't restore Model A's
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Old 08-24-2010, 11:28 AM   #34
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Default Re: Model A Fords and Ford 2.0 and 2.3 engines

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Hi guy's,



Pinto engine in a Model A ,,Yes we've seem a few..Doe's anybody remember the Pinto with the A or B engine in it ?. I remember it was at one of the swap meet's in Long Beach ( Cal ) back in the 80's



Now that's insanity !!

Greg way out west
This Pinto was featured in one of the car magazines back then.
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Old 08-24-2010, 01:57 PM   #35
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Default Re: Model A Fords and Ford 2.0 and 2.3 engines

Ok boys time to lay off a little. If the pinto engine isnt for your car, then why does it matter what Ken is putting in his? He's paying for it isnt it. And by all yalls replies it isnt going to make this thread go away any faster, it will only keep going to the top.

As for me i dont care if he puts a pinto in his car. It really is a good alternative engine swap. Ken-you can use your 2.3 L, but in reality i would only use one to pull an auto-matic tranny. If you can find a 2.0 L and go with that. They seem to fit better inside the engine compartment, and pull a '39 tranny quite well. Now for this set up you should get a 4.11 rear end or put some 16 inch wheels on the car. 14-15 inch work better with a stock rear end, but for era accesory wheels, its hard to find the 14-15 inch sizes. Call up Dick Sparks he can give you some info on where he got all his parts and conversion peices from, and i beleive he is in your neck of the woods. Fella's you have to remember its not like he's putting a chevy 350 in the car. He could take a pinto engine back out, and within hours have the model a engine back in. theres is no alternations needed to be done to the frame, unless an automatic tranny is used. You can still use stock engine mounts.
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Old 08-24-2010, 02:19 PM   #36
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Default Re: Model A Fords and Ford 2.0 and 2.3 engines

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.

Ok boys time to lay off a little.

.

Wow Logan, I need to offer my sincere apologies to you and the others as I must confess that did not realize you were an appointed Fordbarn Moderator. In your official capacity, would offer your opinion on what Ryan meant when he gave this directive please? Thank you.

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Old 08-24-2010, 02:58 PM   #37
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Default Re: Model A Fords and Ford 2.0 and 2.3 engines

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Wow Logan, I need to offer my sincere apologies to you and the others as I must confess that did not realize you were an appointed Fordbarn Moderator. In your official capacity, would offer your opinion on what Ryan meant when he gave this directive please? Thank you.

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maybe logan is vice president?
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Old 08-24-2010, 03:06 PM   #38
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Wow Logan, I need to offer my sincere apologies to you and the others as I must confess that did not realize you were an appointed Fordbarn Moderator. In your official capacity, would offer your opinion on what Ryan meant when he gave this directive please? Thank you.

.
I probably got the position the same time you were given it, when you decided the thread needed to be shut down the other day....btw brent not everything i say is directed towards you.
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Old 08-24-2010, 03:21 PM   #39
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Default Re: Model A Fords and Ford 2.0 and 2.3 engines

he he he he he he
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Old 08-24-2010, 03:23 PM   #40
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Default Re: Model A Fords and Ford 2.0 and 2.3 engines

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Originally Posted by Mike Mc View Post
Gidday Bassman. Who made those? I'm assuming that if we're talking Pinto down here it would have been the 2.0 litre Cortina motor.

One of the neighbours in my sub division had a fibreglass, Roadster rod, but its an 8 cyl. Looks good for what it is, but I'm glad he hadn't done it to an original Roadster

Cheers
Mike.
Mike.... I dont know who made them, but there was one for sale here a few months back. Your assumption would be correct.
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Old 08-24-2010, 04:18 PM   #41
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^amen
I'll second that AMEN
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Old 08-24-2010, 07:51 PM   #42
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i'll second that amen
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Old 08-24-2010, 08:28 PM   #43
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The problem is that people like Logan don't really have a home on the HAMB either, since pinto engines and weber carbs are totally unwelcome there also.

I think Logan should just use the DMAFC site to host his pinto discussions and keep it off Fordbarn.

amen
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Old 08-24-2010, 08:44 PM   #44
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Default Re: Model A Fords and Ford 2.0 and 2.3 engines

And don't forget to take the seat belts and safety glass out too! And I guess the guy making the new model A motor should be shot.
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Old 08-24-2010, 08:59 PM   #45
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Default Re: Model A Fords and Ford 2.0 and 2.3 engines

I would really like to see this thread get back to the original purpose and questions that were asked. Instead of playing the "original" "not original" game. The question was not asked why shouldn't i do it, it was how do i do it.
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Old 08-24-2010, 10:36 PM   #46
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The problem is that people like Logan don't really have a home on the HAMB either, since pinto engines and weber carbs are totally unwelcome there also.

I think Logan should just use the DMAFC site to host his pinto discussions and keep it off Fordbarn.
Dont you run electronic ignition, high comp head, generator regulator??? Did not know electronic ignition, snyders head, and regulators were era accesory. Pot calling kettle black if you ask me. Incase you hadnt noticed this is not my thread. I was awnsering what was posted. And who are you to decide where my home is at??? I fall into the Modifed A class, not street rod, you should atleast know they even have a judging class for cars like mine. The type of cars people can get in and they are set up to drive cross country, with a reliable car. Yes stock cars can do it, but I like having reliability. Ive driven 9,000 miles in two years. Thats not a lot to some, but to others its more than what theyve driven in 20 years. Ive been to 20+ meets all around texas and the country. So sorry if i dont drive a bone stock model a, but atleast i drive it . We've been through this before, and i asked you never to talk to me or about me again. I thought we had understood that. Give me a break dude im only 17 geez. But your starting it again....
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Old 08-25-2010, 05:12 AM   #47
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Default Re: Model A Fords and Ford 2.0 and 2.3 engines

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The problem is that people like Logan don't really have a home on the HAMB either, since pinto engines and weber carbs are totally unwelcome there also.

I think Logan should just use the DMAFC site to host his pinto discussions and keep it off Fordbarn.
Have you ever been on the HAMB? There are plenty of late-model four discussions. The Iron Duke, Mercruiser/Chevy II, and Quad 4 engines seem to have an edge over the Pinto, yes, but the Ford engines get some play for sure. And I've never seen a Weber shunned either.

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Old 08-25-2010, 07:18 AM   #48
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Default Re: Model A Fords and Ford 2.0 and 2.3 engines

OK, thanks for the oppertunity to jump in. I try to be a pureist for the sake of the Model A --"do no harm to original parts". but I have a B/F head (hilly country) electronic ignition, and an alternator. I want to use a generator but I keep needing to go back to the alternator when the gen. stops. I have a few questions that I didn't want to ask like; I haven't found a reasonable 31 rad. shell for my roadster project but, I have a perfect 31 commercial shell -- what would that look like painted body color until I can find a really good one that I can aford? A friend has a "B" engine for sale what is a reasonable offer for an engine that hasn't been opened for inspection? and, do they lend themselves to easily inserted mains -- I can babbitt Model A's but I don't have B stuff. Regards, E LaBrash
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Old 08-25-2010, 07:53 AM   #49
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Default Re: Model A Fords and Ford 2.0 and 2.3 engines

Maybe it IS good to get all of this controversy out in the open. Although we know that Ryan's intent for this forum is to be devoted to restoring Model A's, what exactly constitutes "too far" or "not original"? Since Logan brought up the subject about "Modified Class", --and since most of us recognize the two national clubs (MARC/MAFCA) as the organizations we belong to and use their "standards" as what we discuss here, ...then what does MARC/MAFCA say about this?

If you read the judging criteria for Touring Class (or Modified) is clearly defines what is acceptable:
ENTRY CRITERIA

Model A type four cylinder engine
Model A front axle and suspension
Model A rear axle and suspension
Model A frame
Model A production type body and custom commercial bodies using Model A hood, cowl, andfenders
Model A production type fenders without alterations
No modifications such as chopped top or other body alterations
Must complete the mandatory tour
Must complete an equipment functional check
Owners are required to assist in judging activities (unless judging in Fine Point Judging going on at the same time)
Vehicle must not be entered in Fine Point Judging during the same meet
.


You will notice it specifically states a Model A type engine. Now 'one might argue a Pinto engine looks very similar to an A/B engine and can be installed without modifications. This question was posed to the club and here is there response. ..

Criterion 1 states, "Model "A" Type Four Cylinder engine". What is meant by the word "type"? With regard to the word "type" as it specifically applies to Entry Criterion #1. Criterion #1 is intended to exclude Pinto, V8, 6, and 4 cylinder engines not of the Model A "type". Model A "type" was intended to include Model "B" engines, since from a visual aspect there is very little difference between the Model A and Model B engine. Model B engines are installed in some long distance drivers. Area 2 of the TC score sheets checks for the engine number. The use of a Model B engine would result in the lost of 5 points for the engine number but would not disqualify the vehicle from participation in Touring Class Judging. If other "B" parts are used on the engine such as carburetor, distributor, manifolds, etc., additional points would be lost but the car would not be excluded from Touring Class Judging.
.
I think that clearly defines the intent of what both National clubs. Having an engine other than an A or B engine and you would be excluded from participating. (Maybe this is why many here have posted their feelings strongly opposing discussions on this topic?)

Also, some are offering an opinion about the new Burtz engine, or adding seat belts, hydraulic brakes, etc. If you notice, there is no mention of prohibiting an owner from participating if their vehicle has an overdrive transmission, or hydraulic brakes, alternators, electronic ignition, 'forklift' carburetors, etc.


So in reality, exactly "what" causes this to be such a controversy? Is it a lack of respect for one another? Is it territorial encroachment? Is it perceived "ethics"? Is it the manner in which it is presented? WHY??

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Old 08-25-2010, 08:46 AM   #50
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Default Re: Model A Fords and Ford 2.0 and 2.3 engines

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So in reality, exactly "what" causes this to be such a controversy? Is it a lack of respect for one another? Is it territorial encroachment? Is it perceived "ethics"? Is it the manner in which it is presented? WHY??

.
It is a matter of respect in my opinion, As I mentioned before there are tons of places to get help with things like engine swaps and other major modifications. I can think of only 3 places that you can get help with stock Model A questions and this one seems to have the most "experts" with the quickest answers.

Specifically, Logan and Jordan are young pups. While, to me, they do have more Model A knowledge then perhaps 1/2 of those on this board, they still are head strong youth that have to realize that there are other opinions other then their own and this forum is not, by design, for heavily modified Model A's and yes a engine swap IS a major change.

I try to answer questions on modifications with the question why. There are many people that think changes have to be done to get a Model A to run and stop. The real truth is 90% of the mods to stock setup that are put into the car are not needed! Let me say that again "90% of mods to stock setup that are put into the car are not needed" There were no turn signals so how can you modify them? There were no seat belts, so how can you modify them? Get where I'm going?

If you want them just because you want them is one thing but if you think it makes things better I will attempt to explain why your thinking is flawed.

Ryan has said on several occasions here and on HAMB what this site was designed to be. He already has a modified site so this has to be different or it will be lost.

Guys don't get me wrong I have no problem with what you do to your cars. You fall into the "because I want to" group. But don't expect us to support major mods on this board.
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Old 08-25-2010, 09:07 AM   #51
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Default Re: Model A Fords and Ford 2.0 and 2.3 engines

I usually read with interest, but don't participate in threads that go off subject when there is a "Joe vs. Dave" commentary. I find that I end up picking a side, and I am all for a person's right to express their opinion; so I just leave the thread alone.

With that said, I am a purist when it comes to any old or classic car. To me there is some thing about owning and operating a vehicle as it came from the factory. I gain knowledge and perspective of what a new car purchaser must have went through during those years. I also gain historical knowledge of that era, and the people making it possible. When the car is not original; I lose that perspective of history. What I see then is a person's work to build that hot rod or modified, and can appreciate it just for that. I also find it to be a challenge because with time, new technology makes things better and user friendly. So there is a mightly temptation to change in the names of ease, availability, cost, and safety.

A properly restored and maintained Model A is a good car. It will do what it was designed for (driving), and continue to do it without fail (the car has been doing that for 80-years). Hydraulic brakes, electronic ignitions, pinto engines, alternators, etc are not required to enjoy the Model A. However, I am not going to deny anyone from doing the above changes, and certain changes are no-brainers; take safety glass for instance.

I will admit I would try and discourage using an authentic Model A for a pinto engine installation; just for the fact I want to see as many original parts to stay original parts. But I can see the challenge and convenience; less vibration, fewer or no leaks, etc. Let's face it, the Model A is a challenge whether it is original or modified, and I AM NOT THE OWNER. That person can do what he wants, and in no way deserves any backlash for doing so. That statement I will defend.

I have found that each Model A owner has their own perspective on how their A should look and operate. I am no different; I use a diode instead of a cut-out, standard radiator hose clamps instead of original type (for some reason I can't get the originals to stop leaking), and a leakless seal on the water pump. My wheels are painted orange; even though I know they came from the factory black. I just decided since the car is black too, black wheels were just too much. Again, my own perspective.

I can't answer the orginal poster's question how and what is required to install a Pinto engine, but I do know there is information for him to do so (their are other forums that would probably produce more deatiled information), and if I were to tackle such a challenge; would ask the same question, but would be offended if the answers were of what has been replied in this thread. I respect the question being asked, and as my grandfather stated, "Don't say something that will get you a nasty answer unless you are prepared to accept it."

The above is just my humble opinion.
Thanks,
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Old 08-25-2010, 05:19 PM   #52
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But don't expect us to support major mods on this board.
Dont expect you to support it, (not towards you mike) just dont drag my name threw the mud because i dont do it the way "henry did it".
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Old 08-25-2010, 05:51 PM   #53
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Default Re: Model A Fords and Ford 2.0 and 2.3 engines

Don't know if he was a Model A owner, but the words of Rodney King are worth noting here, "Can't we all just get along".
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Old 08-25-2010, 06:55 PM   #54
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Dont expect you to support it, (not towards you mike) just dont drag my name threw the mud because i dont do it the way "henry did it".
That's the point! The owner of the site has stated that how henry did it is what this board is for. It has nothing to do with what you or others do. As a matter of fact my lottery car (when I win the lottery) is a 1950's style hot rod with a Flat head V8. When I win the lottery I won't be asking questions on how to build on this site.
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Old 08-25-2010, 07:09 PM   #55
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That's the point! The owner of the site has stated that how henry did it is what this board is for. It has nothing to do with what you or others do. As a matter of fact my lottery car (when I win the lottery) is a 1950's style hot rod with a Flat head V8. When I win the lottery I won't be asking questions on how to build on this site.
I'm not using v8, v6's, pintos, or even B engines. I use a bone stock A block, with babbit, with weber carb (just added 2 weeks ago), and electronics. I know its not "suppose" to be on this website, but lots of people on here use these modern, and era speed parts. I dont post a lot of threads because i know these types of threads are frowned upon. But when someone else asks a question, i going to awnser it. Was it my idea to post about a pinto engine? nope. But some how i get blamed for it in a way. I dont even own a pinto engine and i get criticized for something I dont even have. I just know about them, and the conversions because a lot of our friends use them down here. to be honest my dream engine has an era correct craigar OHV head, on an A block, with 3/4 race cam, counterbalanced, stromberg 81 carb, and a '39 tranny.
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Old 08-25-2010, 07:10 PM   #56
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Default Re: Model A Fords and Ford 2.0 and 2.3 engines

Putting a Model A engine in a Pinto sounds like a better idea than putting a Pinto engine in a Model A. Maybe then you would see more Pinto's on the road.
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Old 08-25-2010, 07:20 PM   #57
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Default Re: Model A Fords and Ford 2.0 and 2.3 engines

remember Johnny Cash's song about the Cadillac?
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Old 08-25-2010, 07:32 PM   #58
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remember Johnny Cash's song about the Cadillac?
Classic
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Old 08-25-2010, 07:55 PM   #59
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Default Re: Model A Fords and Ford 2.0 and 2.3 engines

You're going to need a 411 rear end to keep the RPMs up and take advantage of all that power. A friend in my club put a toyota 4 banger in his Model A and seems happy with it.
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Old 08-25-2010, 09:37 PM   #60
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Default Re: Model A Fords and Ford 2.0 and 2.3 engines

like the man said "it's mine and i'll haul coal in it if I want to"
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Old 08-25-2010, 11:09 PM   #61
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Default Re: Model A Fords and Ford 2.0 and 2.3 engines

The years after '67 all SAAB cars had the V4. Including the 2 door sedans and station wagons.
I put a Pinto 2 liter motor, 4 speed trans and sedan rear end (about 3.78) in a '29 Nah. It is about like a model A 4 door sedan. Like the heaviest ones.
I mostly run in 3rd gear and after 50 the wind resistance really bogs it down when in 4th.
You need a 4.11 rear end in a light model A like a coupe or roadster to make it drive well.
I also have a hard time getting going from a stop on hills, it's just too fast in first gear because of the rear end. I have 5.50X18 tires too.
I have run it that way 24 years, I would not do it again.
The modern engines take the fun out of driving old cars.
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Old 08-26-2010, 12:17 AM   #62
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Default Re: Model A Fords and Ford 2.0 and 2.3 engines

The thought of a Ford Pinto engine makes my skin crawl, however, the thought of a Ford Cosworth 4 banger makes my blood boil. If I had a Cosworth (keep dreaming!) I would love to put it in a very stock appearing A, but I wouldn't put Cosworth questions 'up' on Fordbarn, and would never sacrifice one of my relatively stock A's.
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Old 08-26-2010, 01:00 AM   #63
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Default Re: Model A Fords and Ford 2.0 and 2.3 engines

I have given though to a toyota 22r 4 cylinder with 5 speed for my coupe.
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Old 08-26-2010, 08:51 AM   #64
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Default Re: Model A Fords and Ford 2.0 and 2.3 engines

Skip,

I thought that wind force is a cubed function ?

Marc
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Old 08-26-2010, 12:54 PM   #65
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Default Re: Model A Fords and Ford 2.0 and 2.3 engines

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The thought of a Ford Pinto engine makes my skin crawl, however, the thought of a Ford Cosworth 4 banger makes my blood boil. If I had a Cosworth (keep dreaming!) I would love to put it in a very stock appearing A, but I wouldn't put Cosworth questions 'up' on Fordbarn, and would never sacrifice one of my relatively stock A's.
I guess you know it's already been done.........https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iFSGS...layer_embedded
a bit of hyperbole in the title though.
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Old 08-26-2010, 02:05 PM   #66
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I guess you know it's already been done.........https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iFSGS...layer_embedded
a bit of hyperbole in the title though.
Uncle Bob,
Thanks for sharing! Yeah, everytime I get the 'itch' to do an 'upgrade' on my banger 30 roadster...I watch this exhilerating video! Then I calm down and put on my leather gloves and take the roadster for a demanding run! So, this video has, thus far kept me from substituting the cosworth for the B!
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Old 08-26-2010, 03:54 PM   #67
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Default Re: Model A Fords and Ford 2.0 and 2.3 engines

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I guess you know it's already been done.........https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iFSGS...layer_embedded
a bit of hyperbole in the title though.
Uncle Bob, that is sooooo freakin' cool! Great looking car, great video. Makes me want to "haul wood!"

Thanks for posting the link! FUN, FUN, FUN.
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Old 08-26-2010, 04:13 PM   #68
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Default Re: Model A Fords and Ford 2.0 and 2.3 engines

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I guess you know it's already been done.........https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iFSGS...layer_embedded
a bit of hyperbole in the title though.
Thanks uncle Bob, Thats cool as HAIL!!!
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Old 10-11-2012, 04:13 PM   #69
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Default Re: Model A Fords and Ford 2.0 and 2.3 engines

I have a 1928 model A coupe. Can someone show me a photo of what to look for on replacing rod shims. I have a connecting rod knocking under power. Does not knock until i step on the gas. Just starting happening when the car wormed up.

Also, My 2nd gear in the tranny is load, where can get a rebuild kit fairly Low Cost, as a retired person on a fixed income, you know money is hard to come by.

thank you in advance for your help.
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Old 10-11-2012, 04:15 PM   #70
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Is there a repair documentation free on shimming the rod ?
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Old 10-11-2012, 05:45 PM   #71
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Default Re: Model A Fords and Ford 2.0 and 2.3 engines

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I guess you know it's already been done.........https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iFSGS...layer_embedded
a bit of hyperbole in the title though.

here are the sequence photos of construction

http://www.mat.fi/n_index.php?nav=ga...rdmodel-a&g=13
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Old 10-11-2012, 06:19 PM   #72
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Default Re: Model A Fords and Ford 2.0 and 2.3 engines

I vote to keep the forum limited to stock Model A's. That's why I joined. So... No Pintos. No Rangers. No anachronisms.
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Old 10-11-2012, 07:22 PM   #73
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Denis, I don't think that folks here are necessarily bad mouthing y'all with creative juices but asking it on this type of forum is kinda like publicly asking for advice on starting a 'House of Ill Repute' to attendees at the Republican National Party fund raiser!

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Brent, I think the Secret Service already did that on a presidential trip to Columbia.
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Old 10-11-2012, 08:35 PM   #74
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Default Re: Model A Fords and Ford 2.0 and 2.3 engines

All,
A few comments: A friend built a beautiful OC PICKUP, using mostly repro body parts including a slightly stretched cab so he could fit in it comfortably. He bought several old Model A engines, searching for a good block, finally found one. He was determined to have a stock drive train! Beautiful truck, easily mistaken for a 100% Model A. My hat's off to him for his detemination to build a really great Model A replica! I've heared that some Pinto's have to use a Mitchell overdrive, installed backwards to have an underdrive to get up the hills. I've also heard that some stock Model A's out do them in the mountains as they have cubic inch advantage & low compression lugging power. I'll find out soon when my bone stock '29 is ready for some REAL mountains. Billl W.
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Old 10-11-2012, 09:59 PM   #75
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Default Re: Model A Fords and Ford 2.0 and 2.3 engines

Both my A,s would be banned from Touring Class judging as they both have modified 40 & 46 Columbia OD,s.Done properly,they look like they belong there,yet a Mitchell or Volvo OD is OK? Doesnt matter to me as I prefer to drive my cars rather than show them. Those that think that you cant put 10,000+ miles a year on your car without breaking down have obviously never driven a good car.
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Old 10-11-2012, 10:19 PM   #76
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Default Re: Model A Fords and Ford 2.0 and 2.3 engines

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Originally Posted by kenparker View Post
I am off on a new wild hair. The adapting a 2.3 liter engine (Ford Ranger Pickup) engine into a Model A. I have read and heard that the 2.0 Pinto engine is an easy adapt and the 2.3 is not a good choice due to fit or some other problem. Can someone shed some light on the goood and bads of putting a 2.3 liter engine in a Model A? i have two of the 2.3 liter engines and want something to do with them.
Back to the original question. If I remember correctly the oil filter on the 2.3 interfered with the steering box (or something like that). I think a Chevy II/Mercruiser Marine is a much better choice of engine for several reasons and if you post the question on HAMB (they deal with this kind of thing) you will get a better answer. Of course the best answer is to leave the original engine in there and maybe add a small amount of speed equipment (and that is what I would tell you if posted on HAMB but with a little more detail). Be sure to drive one with a Pinto and talk with the owners, the owner I talked with wasn't very happy plus in my opinion it looked like weird under the hood. On the positive side nothing is cut and you can replace the engine with the correct engine later when you come to your senses.

Charlie Stephens

Last edited by Charlie Stephens; 10-12-2012 at 02:28 PM.
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Old 10-11-2012, 10:20 PM   #77
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Default Re: Model A Fords and Ford 2.0 and 2.3 engines

Buy a Shay Replica and save the Model "A".
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Old 10-12-2012, 12:21 AM   #78
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Default Re: Model A Fords and Ford 2.0 and 2.3 engines

I say do what you want with it. It seems there are a few people with some info. Pm them and see what they got to say about it. If I knew anything about the pinto engine I would let you know.
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Old 10-12-2012, 11:04 AM   #79
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Default Re: Model A Fords and Ford 2.0 and 2.3 engines

I didn't like the Pinto engine --- in a Pinto
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Old 02-10-2013, 11:39 AM   #80
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Default Re: Model A Fords and Ford 2.0 and 2.3 engines

Quote:
Originally Posted by 160B View Post
here are the sequence photos of construction

http://www.mat.fi/n_index.php?nav=ga...rdmodel-a&g=13
That build is awesome. I love it.
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Old 02-10-2013, 12:59 PM   #81
31 Victoria
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Default Re: Model A Fords and Ford 2.0 and 2.3 engines

I think people are being unfair to Ken Parker here. I have communicated with him by email on another topic and he is really deovted to sustaining the Model A, in every regard.
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Old 02-10-2013, 01:00 PM   #82
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Default Re: Model A Fords and Ford 2.0 and 2.3 engines

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That build is awesome. I love it.
Wow what a beautiful car!
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Old 02-12-2013, 12:33 PM   #83
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Default Re: Model A Fords and Ford 2.0 and 2.3 engines

Brent said "So in reality, exactly "what" causes this to be such a controversy? Is it a lack of respect for one another? Is it territorial encroachment? Is it perceived "ethics"? Is it the manner in which it is presented? WHY??"

I think it starts with the question "Why?".
A better post would be a nicely worded reply suggesting that another specific forum would provide better answers.
"Why?" is irrelevant to the original poster's question and only serves to start the ping pong match and the ball goes out of control.

Don't ask WHY, Just let it DIE.
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