A Few Model A Seatbelt Comments

[Mike V. Florida]

Originally Posted by fiftyv8

Some of you on here may have know Dick Mace from southern OR.
http://www.mailtribune.com/article/2...NEWS/906210335
Dick was involved in a head on accident in his 29 Model A Phaeton a good number of years ago now.
Dick was a front seat passenger and all involved survived.
I have known Dick for a good 10+ years as a Model A'er and knew he had two minds with regards to seat belts, but was swayed eventually to install them into his Model A because he would take his grand children with him in the car often.
Dick was a very serious Model A restorer, but after that accident he became some what of an advocate for using seat belts in old cars.
After having his beloved model A repaired and back on the road, Dick was once again hit by a guy who ran a stop sign I believe and again seat belts must have played a part in his survival.
In his first accident he recited the fact that they would have been thrown out upon impact without seatbelts and possibly the only other thing that did protect them from the head on impact damage was the fixed nature of the engine block drive line and torque tube to the frame.

I personally think seatbelts are worth having...

Do we know how his were attached, seat belts that is?

[harleynut]

Bill.... most people would have froze....you didn't.....that's saying something

[fiftyv8]

Originally Posted by Mike V. Florida

Do we know how his were attached, seat belts that is?

Sorry, I did not ever see the attachments, but guessing it was a kit.
Sadly, Dick passed away a couple of years back.
He survived two pretty serious accidents only to die on the operating table for what was considered simple surgery.

You just don't know when your number will come up.
Again just can not factor an event like that in.

[Mike V. Florida]

Originally Posted by fiftyv8

Sorry, I did not ever see the attachments, but guessing it was a kit.
Sadly, Dick passed away a couple of years back.
He survived two pretty serious accidents only to die on the operating table for what was considered simple surgery.

You just don't know when your number will come up.
Again just can not factor an event like that in.

I ask because there have been several methods spoken about here and it would have been nice to know about a method that worked in a crash as severe as that one was.

[fiftyv8]

Good point, I actually keep in touch with one of his friends who may know so I will ask and see what he can recall.
Sure worked and saved their lives that was a bad crash.
Trouble with many old and cars say upto the 1970's was they did not crumble and absorb impact so a shock wave for want of a better expression goes thru you and the car which my guess does a lot of soft tissue damage and maybe other stuff.

Pete maybe able to confirm his experience with crashes when racing as to what equipment is helpful.
Many folks die of head injuries, yet we are not all wearing helmets and I figure airbags probably help with head protection if they don't kill you when they activate...

[Lona]

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Seat belts alone are not enough in a Model A or in most vintage cars for that matter. In a frontal accident in a car with seat belts, your upper body will hinge forward and your head will hit the steering wheel or the windshield. Lap/shoulder belt installations are much safer and can be installed either fixed or retractable. There are several posts on the forum regarding these types of installations in coupes, roadsters and sedans. When you are installing laps only, you have the seats out and everything exposed for the job so why not go the extra bit and install shoulder belts too? Pickups pose a problem with where to locate the shoulder anchor points but it is doable. I recall one post a year or so ago from someone who did it.

Glen

[Barry B./ Ma.]

I put them in my 30 roadster and it was real simple. I mounted a 3/8"x 4" steel plate the full length under the rumble seat foot riser with the belt anchors up through the rumble floor mat and belts between the cushion and backrest seats. Knowing how flimsy those doors were, I just wanted to stay inside, won't help in a rollover though.

[BILL WILLIAMSON]

I was working @ Chrysler-Plymouth when seat belts became a mandatory Retro-Fit in California, just for the front at first. We attended training classes & had EXPLICIT instructions on how to install them in that PARTICULAR model. Most used a LARGE, 3 or 4 inch flat washer, under the floor. I don't remember if any anchored to frame parts??? It was sometime later, when they were required for the rear seats.
Seemed like 1/2 of the crew were doing SEAT BELTS! Sometime later, it was REALLY a RIOT, when Retro-Fit PCV systems were required, as they often caused cars NOT to IDLE well.
Bill Retro-Fit

[BILL WILLIAMSON]

Originally Posted by harleynut

Bill.... most people would have froze....you didn't.....that's saying something

I was glad I always carried a SHARP Pocket Knife, they come in handy OFTEN. The driver was an ATTORNEY & we became CLOSE Friends & I had "FOREVER" FREE, Legal Help!
Bill W.

[Indiana A. Lover]

Thank you Bill for saveing the man in the Dodge truck. I hope you are around if I no if but when I have a stupid spell. You are a good man!!! Don in Ice box Indiana. Yes we were told to bring in our Brass Monkeys Tonite

[henry's 31]

I sure appreciate this posting. I have seat belts in my Roadster. Will put them in my Roadster Pickup and my Tudor.

If anyone has placed them in a Roadster Pickup (1931) please let me know how you did it.

[BILL WILLIAMSON]

Originally Posted by Indiana A. Lover

Thank you Bill for saveing the man in the Dodge truck. I hope you are around if I no if but when I have a stupid spell. You are a good man!!! Don in Ice box Indiana. Yes we were told to bring in our Brass Monkeys Tonite

"BRASS MONKEYS" thet's FUNNY Buster T. can't figger out thet one????
A Brass Monkey would have been an appropriate "HERO" Badge
Strangely enough, when it happened, my Brain??? didn't even "think" about it, I just felt like a Puppet, in a Daze & did it. It didn't even get in the paper or on TV, but I gained a NEW Friend.
Bill W.

[J Witt]

Originally Posted by Barry B./ Ma.

I put them in my 30 roadster and it was real simple. I mounted a 3/8"x 4" steel plate the full length under the rumble seat foot riser with the belt anchors up through the rumble floor mat and belts between the cushion and backrest seats. Knowing how flimsy those doors were, I just wanted to stay inside, won't help in a rollover though.

That's just about what I did in my roadster also. It works out well and isn't hard to do once you see the relative locations of the sheet metal panels. The big thing is to keep the anchors from keyholing, or tearing out the sheet metal where they are attached. Round all the edges and corners, very important!

John

[Bruce of MN]

Here are pix of the seatbelt attachments on my '31 coupe.

[BILL WILLIAMSON]

How I miss the War Surplus Stores, where we used to buy HEAVY DUTY, Aircraft Seat Belts & Bomber Seats & "SNOOPY" hats & Flight Suits, for COLD OPEN CARS!
Bill W.