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Old 04-25-2014, 08:48 PM   #1
karasmer
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Default MN title issues (Nada values)

Well I transferred a title on my 29 tudor a bit back and today I get a letter from the state not believing I paid so little, apparently they go off of Nada value guild lines which list a driver quality 29 tudor at $11,150 (the lowest on their list). So now they want me to pay sales tax on $11,150 not the $10 flat fee I paid already paid for (cars under $3000). So now I have to provide an affidavit along with evidence such as photos, should be a no brainer once they see the rust holes and such. This just baffles me to no end.
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Old 04-25-2014, 09:20 PM   #2
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Default Re: MN title issues (Nada values)

Ain't Minn. great? "Fair market value". Try the DMV in Grand Ave. They're way easier to deal with than the state offices...

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Old 04-25-2014, 09:25 PM   #3
Kevin in NJ
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Default Re: MN title issues (Nada values)

In NJ I bought a 2000 Ford van with 120,000 miles a couple of years ago private party.

Sent in the signed receipt for the $4000 I paid.

A month or so later I get a letter from the state that the van should be worth $9000 wheres our money. They give you a form that you have to have the seller fill out!!! Of course you can have a mechanic sign off on doing a bunch of work, great but what about those who can do their own work. FWIW, the van needed the rear rebuilt and brakes all around. At Hershey the rear brake line blew a rust hole too. So it needed some $$$ in work.

The $9000 book value is for a low mile van sold by a dealer with a warranty which clearly does not apply to a private party sale.

In NJ it appears to be more of a scare tactic. I have talk to a few people that just ignored the paper and nothing happened. It is just a simple way to make more money as many people will just send in the money. I doubt it would hold up in court as I am sure a good lawyer would be quick to argue the dealer value does not apply to a private party sale.

Please let us know what happens. The community needs to keep abreast of these issues to hope to combat them in the future.
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Old 04-25-2014, 09:38 PM   #4
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Default Re: MN title issues (Nada values)

The title transfer took place two weeks ago and went perfectly smooth, just got the letter from the state today. I have a butt chewing letter, 45photos, and a copy of the craigslist ad showing the price I paid in an envelope ready to be sent out. I also sent an email to NADA chewing them out on their out of touch value guild. If anybody goes on their site give them an earful. Thanks
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Old 04-25-2014, 10:25 PM   #5
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Default Re: MN title issues (Nada values)

Minnesota is a high tax state.
When I transfered the title on my Model A I thought the clerk told me it was a flat rate for all antique cars, but that was at least 10 years ago. I'm sure they found a new way to squeeze more money from the working people.
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Old 04-25-2014, 10:27 PM   #6
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Default Re: MN title issues (Nada values)

I would think a notorized "Bill of Sale" would fix that. Rod
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Old 04-25-2014, 11:19 PM   #7
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Default Re: MN title issues (Nada values)

With all due respect I would hesitate to send a " butt chewing letter" to a state official. They ultimately make the decision and it may well influence them to rule against you, It is kind of like bad mouthing a policeman when he is trying to decide whether or not to
give you a ticket. A sharp tongue will usually work against you ! Discretion is the better part of velour ! IMHO
Wayne
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Old 04-26-2014, 05:39 AM   #8
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Default Re: MN title issues (Nada values)

In Massachusetts, the DOR, (Dept of Revenue) goes by the average NADA value. NADA, according to DOR has no condition factor. I bought an original, unrestored '31 deluxe roadster that had set in a barn since 1955. Paid the widow a very fair price. DOR claimed NADA average price was $19,250., which was 175% more than I paid for the car. The NADA used all restored car sales to determine value. I had all the documentation, notarized bill of sale, photos, appraisals, and average selling price of unrestored cars researched by Hemming Motor News. I took my case to tax court, and lost, because the state said I failed to prove that NADA was wrong. Hemmings Motor News has tried to get NADA to adjust their values according to condition. It is not going to happen because everyone profits from the inflated values except the tax payer. Bureaucracy at work for you.
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Old 04-26-2014, 06:13 AM   #9
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Default Re: MN title issues (Nada values)

Guys, its all about the "money", states are hurting for cash to spend. Let's face it, how many have bought a vehicle for X amount and had a lower amount put on the bill of sale. Of course, if a "Dealer" form is used the number entered is absolutely correct... no unethical dealers in any states!!!!!! It's going to get worse as money tightens even further.....LouB.
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Old 04-26-2014, 06:16 AM   #10
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Default Re: MN title issues (Nada values)

Before you do title work in these states you might be better off having the car appraised. Appraisals can cost from $25 to $500 depending on what you ask for and it's purpose. Used car dealerships can be hit or miss since some of them go by the dreaded NADA values (been there with a project car that MI tried to hit me up for $23K value!). I don't want to get political but we do have to fight this extension of legal extortion and there's a midterm election this year. Make no mistake, it really does amount to extortion. Fight it or just bend over, the choice is yours. No offense intended to anyone or the forum.
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Old 04-26-2014, 06:27 AM   #11
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Default Re: MN title issues (Nada values)

as Ford46 says-it's all about the income stream.
Know somebody in NJ who only puts "gift" on his titles, pays no tax and has never gone any further.....
states don't have time to follow through for a few dollars- now a Ferrari-that might be different.
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Old 04-26-2014, 06:28 AM   #12
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Default Re: MN title issues (Nada values)

Always get a bill of sale, signed by all parties involved in the sale and dated, may not be perfect but will go a long way wth dmv's
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Old 04-26-2014, 07:11 AM   #13
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Default Re: MN title issues (Nada values)

Nevada uses the MSRP, which was something like $475. To register my car was $84 for the year. Usually I get clobbered at the DMV,but not with my Tudor.
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Old 04-26-2014, 08:41 AM   #14
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Default Re: MN title issues (Nada values)

FYI Tax burden:

http://taxfoundation.org/sites/taxfo...NS%20MAP_0.png
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Old 04-26-2014, 09:23 AM   #15
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Default Re: MN title issues (Nada values)

Just registered my 28a in maine. Paid sales tax of 5% on purchase price in 1999. Excise tax of .0100 based on what vehicle sold for in 1928 ($550.00) no title required if older than 15 years.
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Old 04-26-2014, 03:42 PM   #16
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Default Re: MN title issues (Nada values)

That entire sales tax is BS in my opinion-they collect sales tax numerous times on the same vehicle. Crock talks about a bill of sale for old cars-what an experience it is to bring a car on a bill of sale to Minnesota and get it registered. One part of the process is purchasing a bond to protect the state.
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Old 04-29-2014, 12:16 PM   #17
karasmer
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Default Re: MN title issues (Nada values)

You got that right 37pickup, even worse is property tax (rent) on your home.
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Old 04-29-2014, 01:05 PM   #18
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Default Re: MN title issues (Nada values)

NADA Antique car values must have been dreamed up by some non-car guy,,,, they are outrageous. Pure BS and not a reflection of what a car is worth.

Illinois is a flat rate tax for old cars under $20,000 and then 5% of the car after that. I can't recall the tax for under 20K, been a while since I bought a car but seems like it was 60 bucks or so........................
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Old 04-29-2014, 03:55 PM   #19
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Default Re: MN title issues (Nada values)

Va can be a pain as well. Tried to title a 35 (Chevy) - never heard after weeks of waiting - called Richmond and woman said I have the title right in front of me - when queried whats the hold up she said there is no way a car as old as this only has 60k miles.

Then to make money the county mulled over the idea of making personal property (already $5 per hundred) on collector cars to be taxed at the insured value . I idea was eventually killed after an write/call in campaign that all horses in the county should be taxed since they too are recreational.
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Old 04-29-2014, 04:01 PM   #20
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Default Re: MN title issues (Nada values)

Sure glad that we don't have to put up with any of this BS here in Alaska.

$15.00 for a title and $15.00 for a permanent Historical Vehicle plate and that is it. It is triple the amount it was a few years ago, but no complaints here.

Darryl in Fairbanks
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