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Old 03-13-2019, 06:33 PM   #1
Rancheroboy
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Default 292 with 239 heads

A couple of questions: I have a 57 Ranchero with a 292, which I bought off the original owner in 1993. He had taken it back to Ford in 1961 where they installed 1961 292. I soon discovered I have 239 heads on the 292. I confirmed by checking casting numbers. First question, is there any reason they would stick 239 heads on a 292, other than it was what they had available. I have no problems, rockers are oiling well. I think the 239 heads have smaller intake valves so I probably donít make the same power as a proper head would. Second question, The spark plugs that were in it, and what I have always replaced with are Autolite AP85. Checking with several mail order shops this plug is not what is called for. Autolite 216, along with many other brands/numbers. Is the Autolite 85 completely wrong for this engine? I have been fighting a mild cutting out problem at highway speed for years. Everything in the ignition has been changed except changing plug types. Thanks for any info you may have.
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Old 03-13-2019, 06:42 PM   #2
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Default Re: 292 with 239 heads

If it has 1954 heads, which distributor does it have? 1956 was a change year for those. Loose distributor bushings can cause intermittent problems
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Old 03-13-2019, 06:59 PM   #3
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Default Re: 292 with 239 heads

those are 54 heads alright with the small plug.what are the casting letters on the block.they are above the oil filter on a 61 block.i have a feeling you dont have a 292
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Old 03-13-2019, 07:15 PM   #4
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Default Re: 292 with 239 heads

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rancheroboy View Post
... is there any reason they would stick 239 heads on a 292, ...
Yes, but it's not a good one.
Heads, intake and block each have their own casting numbers.
The 239 heads use a smaller dia. sparkplug with a gasket, also smaller intake ports which should have a matching intake manifold. (photo)
What is the prefix of the casting number across the top rear of the intake manifold with '9425' in it.
The prefix might be EBU if it's a 2bbl or EBY 4bbl.

Also, if the distributor and carburetor are mismatched (with pre '57 239 parts) the timing might not be advancing correctly. Pictures or casting numbers of those various parts on the engine will be very helpful.
Casting number charts at these links...

http://www.ford-y-block.com/technical.htm

http://www.y-block.info/castings.html
.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg '54 239 vs '55+ intake gasket.jpg (27.7 KB, 21 views)

Last edited by dmsfrr; 03-13-2019 at 09:50 PM.
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Old 03-13-2019, 07:28 PM   #5
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Default Re: 292 with 239 heads

239's also have smaller intake runners. Is you look on the oil filter side of the engine on the side of the block just below where the cyl. head mates to the block there should be some letters and #'s there. If it is a 61 block it should say C1AE R or maybe C. A 57 block may say ECZ or EDB. There are other codes also. The 6015 is on all Y blocks as Ford engine part #. You may also look near the dist. as Dearborn blocks have the letters there and near the generator up side down. I don't think Dearborn cast any blocks larger then 272 and nothing after 57. Also many re builders have bored 272 to 292 because of availability of rebuild kits. I hope this somewhat helps.
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Old 03-13-2019, 10:44 PM   #6
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Default Re: 292 with 239 heads

This is going to be a fun posting to follow.
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Old 03-14-2019, 04:33 AM   #7
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Exclamation Re: 292 with 239 heads

Quote:
Originally Posted by packrat5 View Post

This is going to be a fun posting to follow.
Damned if it ain't. I thought I had heard about everything. Wrong as usual.

It is hard to say what happened in 1961. It may have been a REMAN ordered wrong or a junkyard take-out.

I would verify the complete engine.

As far as the AUTO-LITE plugs go, correct install is 216.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg AUTOLITE - 216.jpg (8.8 KB, 18 views)
File Type: jpg AUTOLITE AP85.jpg (9.4 KB, 13 views)
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Old 03-14-2019, 09:55 AM   #8
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Default Re: 292 with 239 heads

Thanks for all the great responses. The block number is C1AE 6090R and it has EBU on the heads under the rocker shafts. I did suspect the distributor could have bad bushings so I bought one from Rock Auto. Wasn't the problem. The original distributor was Ford 12/27, the replacement Rock Auto sent was Motorcraft 12/27. I discovered after I returned the core this new distributor was shorter and didn't reach the oil pump shaft. I put in a longer 390 shaft and solved that. The original plugs when I got it were Autolite 85, I installed the Autolite AP85, which are almost 1/8" longer, fortunately they don't hit the piston. I will switch over to the 216 and see if it improves. A few years ago I changed to an MSD coil and bypassed the resistor. That was a stupid move. Toasted two Pertronics units a a few condensers before I went back original. Running points/cond now. Everything in the ignition is new except for the resistor, which I've checked and it is good. The 2 barrel Holley has been rebuilt by a local professional carb guy.
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Old 03-14-2019, 10:15 AM   #9
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Default Re: 292 with 239 heads

One thing I didn't mention is the timing has to be up around 18 to 19 deg for best performance, doesn't run well at all any lower than that. I checked and 0-TDC on the balancer is TDC on #1 piston.
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Old 03-14-2019, 10:29 AM   #10
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Default Re: 292 with 239 heads

With those heads on your 292 it would probably hinder performance. If changing the plugs doesn't take care of the intermittent miss maybe confirm the coil is hooked up the proper way. _ to the dist. Also what condition is the ignition switch. That year switch may be sloppy after all these years. If you ever have the heads off you may consider looking for 292 heads. It may also mean changing the intake also. ECZ G heads will give the best performance and compression. You may want to confirm the outer portion of balancer is not moving on the rubber.
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Old 03-14-2019, 10:29 AM   #11
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Default Re: 292 with 239 heads

12127 is a generic number for many/most Ford distributors, the prefix and suffix letters/numbers are the important ones.
"new distributor was shorter" We've heard that a few times before, a common problem with chain auto parts store rebuilds.

6090 is a generic cyl head number. C1 = 1961(+)
The engine block number will have '6015' in the middle of it.

"it has EBU on the heads under the rocker shafts" Yes, '54 239ci.
If it doesn't have a matching intake manif you may have vacuum leaks due to the different port size.

Timing... the distributor may have an internal problem or not have the vacuum line connected correctly. Possibly a bad vacuum advance canister.
.

Last edited by dmsfrr; 03-22-2019 at 12:04 PM.
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Old 03-14-2019, 11:02 AM   #12
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Default Re: 292 with 239 heads

Which carb. are you running? The 54-56 dist is a load a matic and needs to run with the carb. from 54-56 which I believe was equipped with a spark control valve. If you are running the later 57 or newer Holley or Autolite you must run the 57 and newer dist. and that would explain so much initial advance. Initial should be somewhere around 10 deg. or so + or - and total about 35 + or -. That would get you in the ball park.You may want to check total advance. Running the earlier distributor and later carb. does not advance properly.

Last edited by Sid; 03-14-2019 at 11:13 AM.
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Old 03-14-2019, 12:32 PM   #13
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Default Re: 292 with 239 heads

Thanks guys, more great info to chase. I'll let you know what I find.
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Old 03-14-2019, 03:55 PM   #14
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Post Re: 292 with 239 heads

Quote:
The original distributor was Ford 12/27, the replacement Rock Auto sent was Motorcraft 12/27.

He has the 57/ Dual Advance DIST, although the replacement is a SBF.

Do you see any Casting ID Nos. on the intake manifold and what type of carb are you running? Photo?

How a set of 239 heads got there is a mystery.
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Old 03-14-2019, 04:22 PM   #15
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Default Re: 292 with 239 heads

I would also think with 239 heads if it has a later intake there may be a vacuum leak as the ports are smaller on the 239-256 engine. At this point it may be wise to look for a pair of of 57-58 ECZ heads intake and dist. so everything matches. Most of the later y block heads after 56-58 will probably have lower compression and/or smaller valves. As stated earlier the G head is the best if you can find a pair affordable. Otherwise ECZ C is good for a basic good choice. The early pre 57 dist. belongs in the scrap bucket unless you are trying to keep a 54-56 Ford original.
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Old 03-14-2019, 04:47 PM   #16
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Default Re: 292 with 239 heads

Spend that tax refund! You know you want these! http://www.eatonbalancing.com/2010/1...esting-part-i/
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Old 03-14-2019, 05:02 PM   #17
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Default Re: 292 with 239 heads

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rancheroboy View Post

The block number is C1AE 6090R and it has EBU on the heads under the rocker shafts.
C1AE-6090-R



Wait a minute...

6090 Is an ENGINEERING BASIC PN for a CYL HEAD. A block would be 6015.
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I told her that it was no way to run a cat-house and hung the phone up ...


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Old 03-14-2019, 05:25 PM   #18
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Exclamation Re: 292 with 239 heads

GENTLEMEN- (You Too OLDMICS)

It seems we have a SECURITY BREACH.

This gentleman came here seeking advice and forgot something very important. I just noticed his avatar showing a very nice 57 Ranchero.

I believe before any more fancy TECH INFO can be given that he be required to post a few photos and share with this group.

What say 'ye?
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I told her that it was no way to run a cat-house and hung the phone up ...


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Old 03-14-2019, 07:35 PM   #19
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Default Re: 292 with 239 heads

I would be wary about using that distributor - did you check the location of the gear to make sure it is the same as the old distributor?
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Old 03-14-2019, 08:41 PM   #20
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Default Re: 292 with 239 heads

Ideally you want to use a dist.that the part # starts with FEH---FEK---B9AE--- C0AE--- C1AE--- C2AE--- C3AE----.This is the prefix the part # starts with followed by 12127. There may be other parts that fit but these are 57 thru 64 y block distributors.
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