Model T... all 12 volt all the time.

[yachtsmanbill]

WOW... I feel like Im walking on a freshly oiled floor. Must be from that 12 volt starter leaking all over the place. Actually, I have one of the fEW model Ts that does not leak oil. After the fresh overhaul and all summer, I did add a quart, but it really only needed a pint. Was Ford IRISH??? LOL...

So heres the new dilema fellas; ALL 12 volts all the time; remember that, OK? I just installed the new Becker and son 12 volt one wire alternator.Its a basic 40amp DELCOTRON with an internal, self exciting regulator.
I need a copy (here) of the OEM wiring schematic in black, with a correction in RED to show me what I need to know. I get confused on the switch back when starting and charging on battery, then switching and still charging on MAG. Thats with a generator. Does the cutout turn the generator on and off? I dont think so... if you turn the key on, the ammeter will show a discharge until its started. If the engine is OFF and you turn the switch to MAG, will it still show a discharge?
I can wire the alt. so it charges when the switch is on BATT, but is there a contact for charging when in the MAG position? As a last reort, I can install a toggle switch strictly for the charging circuit, and even have an idiot light next to it so I don forget to turn it off.
I have 4 of these alternators on my boats, but I forget if you merely shut down the engines, and the one wire is still "HOT", depending on residual magnetism on the fields to excite the unit. IDEAS? Comments?? ws

As a side bar, I will not EVER ask this question across the hall. Thats WAY WAY worser than asking about water pumps or sealed beam headlights! Happy Holidays. I sure hope the babbit thrust washers dont fail as we approach that fiscal cliff. WHOAAA NELLY!

[tmodelman]

The alt/gen goes thru the ammeter to the battery (yellow) wire. Doesn't ever get to the ignition switch directly, only when the ignition switch is on BATT, same with MAG, you sure don't want any DC volts going to the magneto ever......dead magnets!

[tmodelman]

This earlier post mentions the use of an alternator, and to just simply wire it direct to the battery, don't go thru the T ammeter, it won't handle alt amps.

http://fordbarn.com/forum/showthread.php?t=24849

[yachtsmanbill]

Thats the perfect schematic! THANKS TMM !! Woodja believe my service manual doesnt show that?
So what I am seeing is that the cutout is actually working as an on-off switch. Where I get confused, is will the ammeter show a discharge if not running but switch in mAG position? Looks like not. I should know this as Ive owned 10 Ts over the years but NEVER paid attention. Flip it to MAG and she runs so lets go!!!
Now, where does that leave me with the alternator? Merely shut off the ignition and the stopped engine will cause the regulator to turn the unit off? If thats the case, Id still rather have a switch in the line. I do know that the battery goes throught the ignition switches on the boats AND theres a 70Amp inline fuse at the alternators. On the old 3 wire alts, the big battery post was always hot. ws

[tmodelman]

Never have run an alt on a Model T, just the std gen. The cut-out serves to prevent battery discharge when not running the gen. Without that device, the battery would be drained to ground thru the gen.

Most folks with T gen use the Fun Project regulator, that precisely does what is inside modern alternators. It tells when to charge the battery and when to not, and it stops current flow from the battery too.

A std T gen will keep on volting the battery all the time it is turning, the cutout does not regulate. That is why back ago, most folks ran headlamps to burn off the excess current to the battery. Simple way.

Or I used to place a toggle switch in the cutout wire, and then to ground. Flip the switch when running and grounded the gen, so the battery would not cook. Pic shows the toggle switch under the dash with wires to ground out the generator while on long day tours.

[yachtsmanbill]

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YUP! I ran an old T we had with no battery and you know where thats leading eh? ws

[tmodelman]

Maybe a smokin' hot gen

[Doug Money]

With a self exciting regulator, the alternator has to turn fast enough to exite the field and turn on the alt. Connect lead straight to battery and you are set.

[yachtsmanbill]

As barbaric as this may look, am I on the right track? With OEM, the switch is powered through the ammeter. Im gonna use a VOLTMETER instead and will have an auxilliary switch to turn that on and off. That way the charging circuit will be isolated from the rest of the system. Make sense? ws

[yachtsmanbill]

Originally Posted by tmodelman

Maybe a smokin' hot gen

Blew solder all over the side of the hood! ws

[Doug Money]

If you put a switch on the power lead from a self excited alternator, when the engine comes to speed, it is the equivalent of having the battery disconnected. Not something you want to do.

[yachtsmanbill]

Im trying to utilize the terminal block. The alt is a direct connection to the battery AND to the hot (coil) side of the OEM switch with a toggle switch ONLY on the voltmeter leg. It wont matter whether or not the meter is turned "on" or "off". The hot side of the switch will run the coils, and also power for the lights' side. MAG will remain independent of any back feed on the DC side of things. Plausable? ws

[Doug Money]

I was just reiterating that the connection from the alt to the battery needs to remain constant and not switched. It sounds like you have it figured out from your description above.

[yachtsmanbill]

WHEW!! The last move is to make the connections and check for voltage draw between the post and the clamp. Itll probably give me 12 volts and then to check that bridge with an ammeter... Ahooga-chugga-chug!!
Did you work for ComEd at Braidwood? ws

[Mike V. Florida]

Is there any reason one could not simply place a wire from A to C?

[Doug Money]

No Bill, I moved here from the city to get away from the problems.

[yachtsmanbill]

Where in the city? I was from LaGrange and then all over but spent 30 years at ComEd at Pulaski and the Stevenson. Also had several classes at Braidwood Nuclear plant. During Viet Nam, my dad had a job with AM General testing the 5 ton military dump trucks. They were stored at Greer training center by I55. I used to ride around putting on miles with him and doing "gradability" tests up the hills at the strip mines. At 14 I drove one of theose 6X6s up that hill. The old man said put it in 1st gear and floor it and DO NOT BACK OFF THE THROTTLE! All I saw was blue sky in front and dirt in the mirrors. Also did some excellent fossil hunting out there and we'd also run the motorcycles out there to swim at a mine at 129 (?) and Wilmington (Strip Mine) road. Think thats all condos now no? ws



Crawford Generating Station 3501 S. Pulaski They are now tearing it down thanks to the bunny huggers and ROM!

[Doug Money]

I grew up in Dolton and Hyde Park. I moved to Blue Island for a few years and then headed south. I am about 300 feet off of 129 and almost a stones throw north of ComEd. 129 and Strip Mine hasn't changed. 129 and Coal City Road is now called Shadow Lakes and is Park Model Trailers and houses.

[yachtsmanbill]

I can just about picture where you are... I gotta ask you what year you graduated from high school and where... I have a bunch of friends and relatives in Dolton, Blue Island, and cal city. Until I moved up here 2 years ago, I kept my boats in Dolton and Cal city (Burnham) on Torrence avenue at 140th. Believe you me, I know why you moved! ws



The biggest boat there is my 65 foot Hatteras and my 36 foot Roamer is on the ground just outa the pic. This is right across from the O'brien lock and dam.

[yachtsmanbill]

Just goofed off today... got my replacement tool post for the SB 9" lathe today and assembled the antique wol whistle... hope it sounds this good! ws
WATCH THE VIDEO AT THE BOTTOM !!






WATCH THE VIDEO !!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UNN3rx7Li40