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Old 01-20-2019, 09:31 PM   #1
RandyMettler
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Default passenger side of the motor running 20 degrees hotter than driver side

I took off the heads and intake to adjusted the tappet lash.


After reinstall, I did temp readings with an interfered gun and the cooling on all cylinders front to back seems to be even. The odd thing is the passenger side of the block is running roughly 20 degrees warmer than the driver side. An again, all cylinders on passenger side running even, but 20 degrees hotter than the driver side.

The water pump on the passenger side seemed smooth and tight when I had it off, just like the driver side pump.

I noticed a slight tapping on cylinder 4. I located the tapping with a long screwdriver on the head near #4s plug. I don't believe I had the tapping before adjusting the tappet gap for the valves. Could the tapping be causing overheating and poor valve gap adjustment?

It starts cold, but is very hard to start once it starts to warm up. This time the hard starting is even at temperatures as low as 150, so not vapor lock/boiling fuel in the bowl. I bench tested my coil and according to my numbers with a volt meter, the manufacture tech said it was on its way out. Although he had to verify with his supervisor, ten minutes later on hold. I was not really that confident in his knowledge as a tech advisor as he didn't understand my bench test numbers as what was under or over spec. This was MSD home page and their tech! I know they produce quality parts, but to me this was disappointing. Are all companies cutting corners this hard?

Could a suspected lazy coil cause hard starting and overheating?


Regards

Last edited by RandyMettler; 01-20-2019 at 09:54 PM.
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Old 01-20-2019, 10:06 PM   #2
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Default Re: passenger side of the motor running 20 degrees hotter than driver side

It is fairly common for one side to run hotter than the other.
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Old 01-20-2019, 10:42 PM   #3
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Default Re: passenger side of the motor running 20 degrees hotter than driver side

Its not uncommon , 20 degrees perhaps a little on the high side .. Did you shave yours heads or have them faced , did you check clearance? possibly the piston touching the head..just a thought. And yes poor adjustment to the valve[s] or sticking ..
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Old 01-20-2019, 10:52 PM   #4
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Default Re: passenger side of the motor running 20 degrees hotter than driver side

One side hotter than the other is pretty common. Don't fret over it.
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Old 01-21-2019, 09:23 AM   #5
51 MERC-CT
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Default Re: passenger side of the motor running 20 degrees hotter than driver side

Ideal situation to make a hot water heater more efficient
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Old 01-21-2019, 10:25 AM   #6
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Default Re: passenger side of the motor running 20 degrees hotter than driver side

Quote:
Originally Posted by 51 MERC-CT View Post
Ideal situation to make a hot water heater more efficient
This may not be as far-fetched as it might be at first thought. My '51 is the same way. I wonder if there may be a subtle difference between the water passages in the block, head gaskets, or heads to facilitate the operation of the heater (at least on 8BA's). Just for kicks and giggles, I'm going to put a set of 8BA head gaskets back to back and check to see if there are any differences that might effect coolant flow. I really don't expect to find any, but I've never even thought of that before and it won't cost nothin'.
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Old 01-21-2019, 11:28 AM   #7
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Default Re: passenger side of the motor running 20 degrees hotter than driver side

tubman, I am sure you are aware that there was a redesign of the original 8BA head gaskets to actually divert more water to the rear of the block. Wonder if that creates a temperature differential?
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Old 01-21-2019, 11:45 AM   #8
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Default Re: passenger side of the motor running 20 degrees hotter than driver side

The same situation exist with the 59a blocks, don't think it is a head gasket issue.
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Old 01-21-2019, 01:34 PM   #9
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Default Re: passenger side of the motor running 20 degrees hotter than driver side

Quote:
Originally Posted by 19Fordy View Post
tubman, I am sure you are aware that there was a redesign of the original 8BA head gaskets to actually divert more water to the rear of the block. Wonder if that creates a temperature differential?
I knew that, but that's a difference from front to back. What I was thinking of is holes on one side bigger that the other.

"JSeery", I'm not too familiar with the earlier flatheads, but the Ford engineers made some pretty sophisticated changes in water distribution on the 8BA's for cooling purposes, why not to make the heater work better?

Please note : This is all speculation on my part, but it would explain this often observed phenomena.
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Old 01-21-2019, 01:46 PM   #10
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Default Re: passenger side of the motor running 20 degrees hotter than driver side

Talkwrench
"Its not uncommon , 20 degrees perhaps a little on the high side .. Did you shave yours heads or have them faced , did you check clearance? possibly the piston touching the head..just a thought. And yes poor adjustment to the valve[s] or sticking .."

Thanks for the response


I did not shave my heads or have them faced. I pulled the heads to check valve lash, cleaned up the surfaces, bought new copper gaskets and reinstalled. I adjusted the valve lash to 11 intake and 13 exhaust for 8BA block. Is the ticking more likely a piston issue and not a valve noise? I plan on pulling the intake and passenger side head again and check valve lash on the intake and exhaust for #4 cylinder. Is it possible to visually see "sticking"? When rotating the crank all the valves seem to operate smoothly, but I am new cracking open engines.


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Old 01-21-2019, 04:00 PM   #11
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Default Re: passenger side of the motor running 20 degrees hotter than driver side

After first reading this thread, I fired up my 40 and let it run at a fast idle for about 45 min. until stock temperature gauge needle was on the middle line, meaning Normal. Then, with an infra red temp gun, I took a reading at each of the spark plug cavities on the each head near where the plug screws in. Both cylinder heads gave the same reading of 180 to 182 degrees. The temperature at the front and rear of the heads were almost the same -both right and left. Heads are aluminum radiator is Walker with mechanical fan. Ambient temp. is 67 degrees F. When I bought these heads in 1999 Mark Kirby made them for use without thermostats.
Car was in the garage. Maybe under load on the road things would change.
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Old 01-21-2019, 09:40 PM   #12
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Default Re: passenger side of the motor running 20 degrees hotter than driver side

Usually you just check without a head gasket, rotate and see if anything touches. After all these years you just never know what someone has done. The copper gasket might be just slightly thinner than what you had [ but unlikely ]?
Now did you go through the three heat cycles and re torque the heads?
If its no.4 it might well be just the fuel pump rod ticking too.
Incorrect timing can cause heating issues.
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Old 01-21-2019, 10:01 PM   #13
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Default Re: passenger side of the motor running 20 degrees hotter than driver side

Talkwrench


I have gone through two cycles and the leaks are almost gone. Just leaking a little out of the passenger water pump. I re-torqued one time to 40 ponds and the head bolt leaks have seemed to stopped.


I was wrong, the ticking is not from #4, it seems to be coming from lower. When adjusting the valve lash I dropped a nail into the the exhaust valve and had to remove the driver exhaust manifold and use a magnet to retrieve the nail. I reused the existing exhaust manifold gaskets and think that may be the cause of the ticking.
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Old 01-21-2019, 10:03 PM   #14
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Default Re: passenger side of the motor running 20 degrees hotter than driver side

An Exhaust leak does sound a lot like a lower end "tick".


Did you have the "tick" before the change?


Everytime you make a change, observe. A engine log of changes doesn't hurt. I keep one in the glovebox that's 8yrs now.


Oil changes, plugs, compression, etc....etc....
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Old 01-21-2019, 10:10 PM   #15
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Default Re: passenger side of the motor running 20 degrees hotter than driver side

Tinker,


No ticking before. But I have true dual exhausts with glass packs and my car was fully assembled. Now the front consists of a frame, radiator and fully assembled engine. Ticks could be more noticeable. My next step is to replace the driver side exhaust manifold gaskets. I just hope it is not a crankshaft tick.

Last edited by RandyMettler; 01-21-2019 at 10:19 PM.
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Old 01-21-2019, 10:20 PM   #16
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Default Re: passenger side of the motor running 20 degrees hotter than driver side

Rod or crankshaft problems usually don't tick. they slap/thunk.


Been thrown off a few times by the fuel pump rod doing it's job. If your looking for a sound, you'll find it. I do like that Lhead sewing machine sound. Exhaust leak seems most probable. Less you through a bearing sitting.


One thing at a time is best. Hard to track 3 changes at a time on a running engine.







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Old 01-21-2019, 10:22 PM   #17
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Default Re: passenger side of the motor running 20 degrees hotter than driver side

Tinker,


That's exactly what it sounds like, a faint sewing machine sound, more so on the driver side.
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Old 01-21-2019, 10:25 PM   #18
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Default Re: passenger side of the motor running 20 degrees hotter than driver side

Sounds like a flathead running... but you never know. I like that sound.

reusing exhaust manifolds gaskets are not advisable.


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Last edited by Tinker; 01-21-2019 at 10:52 PM.
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Old 01-21-2019, 10:55 PM   #19
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Default Re: passenger side of the motor running 20 degrees hotter than driver side

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Originally Posted by RandyMettler View Post
Tinker,


No ticking before. But I have true dual exhausts with glass packs and my car was fully assembled. Now the front consists of a frame, radiator and fully assembled engine. Ticks could be more noticeable. My next step is to replace the driver side exhaust manifold gaskets. I just hope it is not a crankshaft tick.



Okay... guess the question and answer changed.... Dual exhaust won't matter.



Follow your changes....... Loud exhaust just make it harder to pinpoint.
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Old 01-22-2019, 12:28 AM   #20
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Default Re: passenger side of the motor running 20 degrees hotter than driver side

40 Lbs..? should be torqued at 50 lbs. And three times.
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Old 01-22-2019, 09:40 AM   #21
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Default Re: passenger side of the motor running 20 degrees hotter than driver side

I think we are all assuminging (probably correctly) that he has iron heads, but he has never said explicitly.
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Old 01-22-2019, 09:09 PM   #22
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Default Re: passenger side of the motor running 20 degrees hotter than driver side

Tubman,
"I think we are all assuminging (probably correctly) that he has iron heads, but he has never said explicitly."

I have finned aluminum offys. I torqued to 40 pounds as per VANPELT specs at "35-40". I am going to re-torque twice more. Torque after each heat cycle and keep the torque wrench at 40 pounds, no more.

Last edited by RandyMettler; 01-22-2019 at 09:47 PM.
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Old 01-23-2019, 07:25 PM   #23
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Default Re: passenger side of the motor running 20 degrees hotter than driver side

I put a 49 Merc in the truck we used for flea markets, I converted to duals, one side kept the original truck muffler, the other side I had a near brand new mustang 302 muffler, on hard pulls that side would overheat, the muffler that was good for a 302 was too restricted for 1/2 the flathead, got another truck muffler and no more problems
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Old 02-10-2019, 05:44 PM   #24
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Default Re: passenger side of the motor running 20 degrees hotter than driver side

Kurt in NJ

I have true dual exhaust, original exhaust manifold with dual glasspacks. Both sides with the identical setup. Wish my solution was that simple.

Regards
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Old 02-11-2019, 06:00 PM   #25
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Default Re: passenger side of the motor running 20 degrees hotter than driver side

wouldnt worry to much sounds to me just a case of miss matched thermostats easy enough to check remove them and place in a pan of cold water and bring to boil they should open together as matched pairs are near impossible to buy these days so you just have to keep trying and get a pair thats reasonably close took me 5 thermostats to get a pair that was close
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Old 02-11-2019, 08:08 PM   #26
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Default Re: passenger side of the motor running 20 degrees hotter than driver side

Have you tried swapping the thermostats side to side? That's the first thing I'd do,
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Old 02-12-2019, 06:53 PM   #27
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Default Re: passenger side of the motor running 20 degrees hotter than driver side

Yes, I I've tried that. Good advice though. I had original ford thermostats that I took out and water tested, they passed. I purchased two Speedway Stats for a possible cheap fix. It was a waist of money, although I knew it would be. I water tested them before installing. They passed at 180 degrees. Same results as original thermostats, as it should be. Both sets open at roughly 180.

I have run without thermostats to test flow restriction. I don't get any noticeable change in the passenger side running hot.

I have had both water pumps off and they are smooth and tight.

The temperature drop on the driver side of the radiator is about 10-15 degrees cooler at the bottom of the radiator outlet tube. The temperature actually increases as the fluid drops down the passenger side of the radiator. The bottom outlet of the radiator gets as high as 20 degrees warmer at the bottom. I don't see and leaks in the new radiator.

Its almost like the passenger water pump has the impeller mounted on backwards. I know this is not possible.

The radiator is a new aluminum, an electric puller fan with a full flush mounted shroud. I have the fan currently set up to run continuously. When the sheet metal is installed, the fan will hold a piece of paper on the outside of the grill, so I don't believe airflow is an issue.


I am repeating myself a little but no water jacket restrictions, no head leaks, blue test fluid stayed blue, oil is staying the color of oil, valve tappet lash recently set. Motor sound smooth with no ticks or taps. The tick I had after head installations went away after retorque procedures. (Thank God)

The one unverified thing is the ignition timing. I do not however see how that would only affect one side of the block.

Thanks to barners reply's, I am now testing with the pressurized cap off.

Regards
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Old 02-13-2019, 09:33 AM   #28
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Default Re: passenger side of the motor running 20 degrees hotter than driver side

I had a Dodge Chassis Motor Home that was running so hot on the right side that the exhaust manifold would be a cherry red after about two hours of hwy running. I checked everything I could think of. One day it came to me while I was putting new plugs and points and going through the carburetor, I found that the right side jet was .010 smaller than the left, drilled it out and exhaust ran normal. Like I said this was a Dodge, my first and last, and it came from the factory this way. Considered installing Ford running gear, but decided to just sell it. I have always been told you can't make a silk purse out of a Sows Ear!!
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Old 02-13-2019, 12:11 PM   #29
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Default Re: passenger side of the motor running 20 degrees hotter than driver side

If there is higher compression on one bank than the other the low side will run hotter.
Also, the Flathead block is designed with longer intake ports and shorter exhaust ports on one bank. That is the primary technical reason one bank runs cooler than the other.
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Old 02-13-2019, 12:29 PM   #30
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Default Re: passenger side of the motor running 20 degrees hotter than driver side

Quote:
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If there is higher compression on one bank than the other the low side will run hotter.
Also, the Flathead block is designed with longer intake ports and shorter exhaust ports on one bank. That is the primary technical reason one bank runs cooler than the other.

this. JWL knows better than I, but I've often heard that 10 degrees was common just due to the port differences. if you have offy heads... i would be wondering if you have higher compression on one side. when I assembled my 8ba there was a .010 differences in deck height left to right bank. I had the heads cut to fit...
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Old 02-13-2019, 12:40 PM   #31
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Default Re: passenger side of the motor running 20 degrees hotter than driver side

JWL and revkev6 response to your comments:
"If there is higher compression on one bank than the other the low side will run hotter."


I checked the compression and all cylinders are close to 110. I do have offy finned heads and an offy intake with dual 94's.

All jets in the bowls are 47's.

I have new dual exhausts with original exhaust manifolds and they have good compression at the tail pipe based on feeling the pressure with my hand.
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Old Yesterday, 10:03 AM   #32
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Default Re: passenger side of the motor running 20 degrees hotter than driver side

When you replaced the coolant, did you refill through the radiator or did you fill the block first? I say this because I had a similar issue and found it to be a airlock in the block. so I now fill the coolant to the thermostat level in the block, refit the top hoses then top off the radiator. now runs petty even on both banks.
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Old Yesterday, 01:32 PM   #33
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Default Re: passenger side of the motor running 20 degrees hotter than driver side

46kustom
In response to your question,
"When you replaced the coolant, did you refill through the radiator or did you fill the block first?"


No, I just filled the system at the top of the radiator cap. I rigged a test using a vacuum cleaner tube to check circulation for each side. I disconnected the chrome radiator "riser" tube going into the top inlet of the radiator and hooked the hose up to that and taped the joint. Then refilled the radiator and started the car while maintaining the coolant level. I had flow out of the vacuum cleaner tube, but in spirts, and seemed a little weaker than what I expected. The "spirts" is what bothered me. I don't know if a air bubble would cause the inconsistent fluid transfer?

Don't try this test unless you add lubricant to the water and have lots of water at hand to keep the level as full as possible. Really a two person job. I captured my water in a clean container to reuse. If the pumps run dry you will have to rebuild them.

The picture is of the driver side test. I tested both sides, similar results.

Thanks for your comment.
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