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Old 05-28-2019, 06:37 PM   #1
Chris Haynes
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Default So what is an AR?

So what is an AR? I was a teenager old timers who were very much into A's, Jim Talmadge for one, told me that when Ford upgraded a part for an early 1928 that the new replacement part number had an AR suffix. So people started calling the early cars that had those early parts on them AR's. There was never an AR designation from Ford. Am I correct? Please no I think ideas, only provable facts please.
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Old 05-28-2019, 06:44 PM   #2
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Default Re: So what is an AR?

Hi Chris,

it's my understanding the "A" is for Model A and the "R" means replaced. The the part should next have a "B".

I could be wrong.

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Old 05-28-2019, 06:51 PM   #3
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Default Re: So what is an AR?

Chris,


Same Californian's told me it meant 'All Rust'.....
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Old 05-28-2019, 07:21 PM   #4
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Default Re: So what is an AR?

fwiw

If you look at the Restoration Guidelines and Judging Standards, Section A Early 1928's Section A-1 pages A-1 through A-17 Revised 2016. This section address all the unique characteristics of the earliest models, October 1927 through December 1927 and January through June 1928. Some refer to these early vehicles as "AR".
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Old 05-28-2019, 10:00 PM   #5
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Default Re: So what is an AR?

An "AR" is a term used to describe something, it is not a car. The term was created by hobbyists to loosely describe early Model A's that had unique parts. As this term is more colloquial than anything there is no way to define it.

It is derived from the fact that when Ford redesigned or replaced a part an "R" was added to the part number.

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Old 05-29-2019, 12:36 AM   #6
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Default Re: So what is an AR?

Pretty much what I have always thought. Thank you guys.
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Old 05-29-2019, 08:31 AM   #7
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Default Re: So what is an AR?

"AR" cars are misnamed and are more properly called "ER" cars. AR was a part designation as above. ONCE & FOR ALL - Let's settle this issue. THERE ARE NO AR MODEL A's. Jim Langley...
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Old 05-29-2019, 01:09 PM   #8
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Default Re: So what is an AR?

Somewhere along the line, the term began to take on more meaning than I think it originally had. I always figured that the term was "As Released" which would indicate production of the original design before changes were made. Design was in flux at nearly all points of production in the model A era. There was some talk at one time about the first 200 cars but they may have run the first 200 in a very short period of time before making a lot of the changes to fix warranty concerns that were constantly popping up. Once production cranked up, they would have produced 200 cars well before lunch time on any given day.

Most folks just refer to it now as the "Early Production" or E28 that refers to those cars produced in the early model year of 1928 which also includes the cars produced in late 1927 that have so many early characteristics.
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Old 05-29-2019, 01:24 PM   #9
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Default Re: So what is an AR?

The R is for removed or retired (obsolete). Most involve the early style wheels and brakes that did not include a separate parking brakes carry the AR in the catalog parts number. (I am sure there are others but am using brakes/wheels as an example) In general these parts could not be mixed on later cars. For example; AR wheels could not be used on later drums or vice versa.
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Old 05-29-2019, 02:02 PM   #10
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Default Re: So what is an AR?

Quote:
Originally Posted by redmodelt View Post
The R is for removed or retired (obsolete). Most involve the early style wheels and brakes that did not include a separate parking brakes carry the AR in the catalog parts number. (I am sure there are others but am using brakes/wheels as an example) In general these parts could not be mixed on later cars. For example; AR wheels could not be used on later drums or vice versa.
Not even close !!
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Old 05-29-2019, 02:40 PM   #11
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Default Re: So what is an AR?

If you want to get ‘the real definition’ of AR, go to the MARC Facebook page and read those answers!
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Old 05-29-2019, 03:10 PM   #12
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Default Re: So what is an AR?

That's easy. Chambered in the ever capable 5.56 mm or .223 for civilian lingo! And 'no' the AR does not mean 'Assault Rifle' as the news media contends it stand for ArmaLite


https://www.cheaperthandirt.com/cate...r-15-rifles.do
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Old 05-29-2019, 03:32 PM   #13
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Default Re: So what is an AR?

So tell us your opinion of what the "R" means in AR or was it my example.
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Old 05-29-2019, 04:55 PM   #14
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Default Re: So what is an AR?

Here's a page from the 12/1/29 parts price list. There were -d parts already in use. AR is just a parts designation. The very early and early 28 cars started out with part numbers with out a suffix. If the parts were changed the the suffix was added, first as -a, then -b etc. or a new number was assigned if it was a totaly new part. If the old part was retained for service a "r" was added i.e. -ar, -br etc. The car was never referred to as AR only the parts. heres more on part numbers. http://www.abarnyard.com/workshop/partnum.htm
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Old 05-29-2019, 06:02 PM   #15
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Default Re: So what is an AR?

I've read in several descriptions from Ford employees and from historians about release dates for updated parts. Each individual part for the vehicles had to be released for service by engineering after they passed testing. Those parts generally show a production change either in the prefix or the suffix by an alpha letter change.

In my experience with aircraft parts which go through similar engineering changes over time, they use dash numbers to indicate the changes or at least that is the standard I'm accustomed to. The part, as it was originally released, would have no dash number. Some service bulletins refer to them as the part number followed by the term "basic" in parenthesis when there is a directive to change that part for the new dash number part. Ford may or may not have used an abbreviation of this in the service bulletins but I haven't had a chance to go through the bulletins and find any examples so I don't know for any certainty. It's just the only thing that makes sense to my way of thinking. When they obsoleted a part, only the latest revision part number was included in later editions of the parts catalogs. Obsoleted parts were no longer put into the parts catalogs. This practice can lead to confusion when trying to find out what part you need and the number doesn't match the old part. Some times they will indicate "replaces part number such and such" in the description column but not always.

Currently, most helicopter parts catalogs use an "AR" abbreviation in the part quantity for each assembly column and it stands for "as required". They use this a lot where shim washers are required and there is no way to know exactly how many will be necessary. In other books I've also seen the term "As Revised" to indicate a current revision or later future revisions. These items don't really fit with the term we are discussing or at least they wouldn't make as much sense.

Last edited by rotorwrench; 05-29-2019 at 06:10 PM.
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Old 05-30-2019, 08:13 AM   #16
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Default Re: So what is an AR?

"AR" refers to the issue of the engineering drawing. "AR" designates the revision of a drawing. In the early days of Model "A" design, the first release of an engineering drawing was given an A, so it was the A Release which abbreviated is AR.


This practice of assigning an "AR" to the first release is unusual and was discontinued, so the initial release of an engineering drawing had no revision letter. Changes made to the drawing necessitated its re-release, so it would be given "A" for its second release, "B" for its third release, etc.
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Old 05-30-2019, 02:18 PM   #17
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Default Re: So what is an AR?

Chris,
Some detailed information regarding part identification is found at https://aafords.com/aa-information/#fpidm


There was no vehicle or body with an AR identifier (only parts). The R identified a part not in current production but available through service. There could have been AR, BR, and some CR parts identified as parts changed.
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Old 06-03-2019, 03:30 PM   #18
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Default Re: So what is an AR?

short answer: incorrect designation of very early production cars/features.
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Old 06-03-2019, 10:26 PM   #19
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Default Re: So what is an AR?

The “R” means for Repairs. The R is added to mean the part is available to ford mechanics for repairs due to the fact that that particular part is no longer used in production but is needed to repair an earlier vehicle or system.
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Old 06-04-2019, 01:51 PM   #20
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Default Re: So what is an AR?

Quote:
Originally Posted by RonC View Post
The R means for Repairs. The R is added to mean the part is available to ford mechanics for repairs due to the fact that that particular part is no longer used in production but is needed to repair an earlier vehicle or system.
A good example is the spare tire carrier to which a gusset was added to the casting as reinforcement for an area prone to cracks/breaking. These carry the AR prefix and were made for both 28-29 and 30-31 cars, at least for coupes and roadsters.
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