1935-36 pickup restoration book

[Clem Clement]

I have been in volved in similar cost cutting decisions in the past. My council would be to look first at the letter of incorporation and charter of the organization. Then the bylaws. Quite offen there are some programs going on that don't match the founding thrust and should be first to go.

[Teltruck]

Two more 1936 Pickups. The two stars on the flag in the front door window represented my two sons serving there country in the war in Afganistan. Thank God they both returned home safetly! Pray for all our troops!!.

[Fe26]

As far as expanding coverage to 1937 is concerned, my suggestion would be no. In trying to please a few others (and possibly the EFV8C) you will create a lot more work for yourselves with little or no gain, and the club may still say no. And you will have no satisfaction in creating a bastard child. I think a book that covered '37' '38' and '39' trucks would have more relevance, than placing the '37' with the '35-36' pickups.

I like the proposal of electronic publishing, e.g I have The Green Bible, on CD, although lying in bed with a book (V8's of course) propped against my knees is hard to beat. So perhaps both media could be considered.

I also think now is the time to write a formal letter to the club. There have been many good suggestions made in this thread, and from sifting though these suggestions and observations, many good points are available to you to use.

In this regard I would like to make the following observations; In all dealings and especially with an organisation (club) dealing with it's members, the notion of 'Fair Play' is paramount. For the club to advise you apparently in an off-handed way, that your project will be abandoned, without giving you first the courtesy of explaining your position in regards to the need for the '35-36' book, and the work (investment) already made, is unfair and churlish to say the least.

I am surprised the board wholeheartedly agreed to this high-handed course of action without first consulting the authors. This is unfair and rude.

Another point I would like to make is; How many members on the roster (the numbers they quoted) are in the USA, compared to EFV8 Chapters worldwide. It could be worthwhile finding out just how many are listed in the clubs data base worldwide. I suspect the numbers would be much higher than those quoted to the authors.

If the worldwide numbers are significantly higher, and the club has been dishonest and underhanded in not telling you the exact numbers, the authors would have a powerful argument in their favour to ask the club to reconsider, on the grounds of 'Fairness' and the need for the document as a referance book for all models, not just the most numerous or the most popular. The club is (should be) there for all, not a select few. Furthermore, on some years/models of cars the club will make a profit on booksales, on other years/models they will not. The accounting method to employ is to look at total sales of all books, compared to publishing costs for all books. You may be pleasantly surprised that total sales are profitable, and an accomodation may be made for a loss making venture.

The club will have all this information, available on request to interested members.

Time to skin a few cats, let me count the ways...

[Old Redneck]

Evin I was going to get the book. Did they have the OK before they started this?

[myfirst36]

if they were trying to do whats best for the club then why give the OKAY and let these guys go through years of dedicated research only for it to get unknowingly shut down. Sounds to me like someone owes you for the extreme amount of time already invested.

Just because there are only a 200+ trucks listed on the earlyv8 roster doesnt mean there arn't plenty more out there.

[JM 35 Sedan]

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Maybe some of the EFV8C/A board members will post a response here or on the V8 Club's website explaining all the rational for their decision but knowing some of these folks I doubt it will happen.

[rotorwrench]

Another course of action may be to find a sponsor or plural. The club may have to approve this but I see no reason why it couldn't be done. They may have to put a few plugs for the sponsors in the book but that wouldn't be a big deal as long as it was appropriate to the venture.

[Lawson Cox]

Originally Posted by DICK SPADARO

Jerry , just because it doesn't have the the V8 clubs blessing doesn't mean it cant be published. Contact me via PM with what you have, how it is formatted and about how many pictures and drawings.

Dick, check your PM's. I am intentionally withholding my comments until the dust settles a bit.

[C&GEarlyFordParts]

Jerry,

If you do end up publishing the book, you know we would be happy to sell them here at C&G!

-Cody

[Fe26]

Originally Posted by C&GEarlyFordParts

Jerry,

If you do end up publishing the book, you know we would be happy to sell them here at C&G!

-Cody

Hear, Hear!

[alrivera]

Jerry and Lawson. I am not a member, but I have a 36 pickup and a 36 slantback 2-door sedan, and would love to buy a copy if you guys get it together. Al

[jerry grayson]

You know, I never knew what price for the pickup book that the EFV8 board used to calculate break even. The 35-36 passenger book is $29.95, the 32 book is 84.95, the 33-34 is 64.95, the 37 is 44.95, the 38-39 is 49.95. So, how is the price figured? What price would be too high for a very interested V8er to pay? If you are restoring a car and suddenly rare information is available, would you dig deep in your pocket to get this? By the way, if you are interested, you can get from the EFV8 club a cook book with a model "T" on the front cover for $9.95!

[jerry grayson]

Originally Posted by alrivera

Jerry and Lawson. I am not a member, but I have a 36 pickup and a 36 slantback 2-door sedan, and would love to buy a copy if you guys get it together. Al

I would like to take this opportunity to thank all of you for your support of the work Lawson and I have been doing on the "35-36 Ford pickup restoration book". Your encouragement is very gratifying.

[Fe26]

Originally Posted by jerry grayson

You know, I never knew what price for the pickup book that the EFV8 board used to calculate break even. The 35-36 passenger book is $29.95, the 32 book is 84.95, the 33-34 is 64.95, the 37 is 44.95, the 38-39 is 49.95. So, how is the price figured? What price would be too high for a very interested V8er to pay? If you are restoring a car and suddenly rare information is available, would you dig deep in your pocket to get this? By the way, if you are interested, you can get from the EFV8 club a cook book with a model "T" on the front cover for $9.95!

Of all the points made/raised so far, this is the most relevant. It appears the club sets the price according to a given criteria. Whatever criteria they use should be made known to all authors. In this regard authors may then make an informed decision whether to proceed with their venture, and what risks they may face should they decide to proceed.

In the case of the 35-36 pickup book, it appears the authors were not given these salient facts or details. If this is so, the authors were operating in the belief the club would publish the book according to the publishing criteria of the club. If they were never informed of the risk of the club abandoning the project, they have been treated unfairly and very shabbily. Likewise, either as a preliminary, or shortly after a project begins one of the first tasks is to estimate time and cost. Armed with these facts the decision is then made whether or not to proceed, this is usually done in consultations between the author/s and the publisher. To allow the authors to proceed for years, then arbitrarily abandon the project without giving due consideration to the authors, is reprehensible. To abandon the project without having first informed the authors of the peril they faced is again, reprehensible.

If I read the situation correctly it seems the club approached the authors, thereby commissioning the book. In doing so, certain procedures; legal, copyright, dispute resolution, project management, marketing etc, come into play. Both sides must be aware of all of the factors, in order that the project is conducted in a professional manner. It seems the authors have been deprived of much information regarding protocols and procedures, indeed even their rights (in so far that they may exist).

For there to be such a wide range of prices across the published range of books, indicates to me that prices are set per individual publication, or to put it another way, on a 'cost plus' basis. If this is so, then the club has no legitimate argument to withhold publication. The cost may be higher for an (club alleged) low volume book, however the owners of the marque will pay for the privilege of having a club sanctioned document.

I suggest that based on the price of the 1932 book of $84.95, any price that is under a ceiling of say, $99.95 would be an acceptable price. The question to ask the club is this; what price did the club determine the book would retail at? The club must have this figure, how else could a board of directors make their decision without the most pertinent facts of; a) the cost to publish the book, and, b) the retail cost of the book. This information should be disclosed to the authors as a matter of urgency, and as a courtesy.

It is unacceptable for a Board of Directors to simply issue a Fiat without giving reasons why, and when asked what information and/or data they used to arrive at their decision, the BoD should provide the information and data they used in making their decision. I have mentioned in a previous post, the authors should have been given access to the reasoning of the board, in order that they may have exercised their right of reply, and made their submissions to the board, stating their reasons why the project should be continued. Failure to observe procedural fairness is a cause for concern.

[barryfromvictoria]

there is a lot of gearheads and hot rodders who would buy the book even though they have never owned a 35-36 p.u. just because they are interested in old fords. now who would have thought a v-8 club member might do that.

[Hamtown Al]

The Early V-8 club seems to be going to allot of trouble to ensure that the NEXT elections will have the most participation in the club's history! The present Board can do better than what's been done so far.

Every governing body makes mistakes and good governing bodies will revisit them and make corrections as best they can.

It's time for EV-8 board to revisit the issue and get the book back on the road to completion.

In this day and age, printing and publication costs are fractional compared to what they used to be.

Let's get this truck show back on the road with apologies to all concerned for hitting the speed bump too fast and ruffling all the feathers of the birds riding in the back!

2 cents Al

[Cecil/WV]

Originally Posted by Hamtown Al

The Early V-8 club seems to be going to allot of trouble to ensure that the NEXT elections will have the most participation in the club's history! The present Board can do better than what's been done so far.

Every governing body makes mistakes and good governing bodies will revisit them and make corrections as best they can.

It's time for EV-8 board to revisit the issue and get the book back on the road to completion.

In this day and age, printing and publication costs are fractional compared to what they used to be.

Let's get this truck show back on the road with apologies to all concerned for hitting the speed bump too fast and ruffling all the feathers of the birds riding in the back!

2 cents Al

Well said, Al, and it's worth more than 2 cents!!

[John R]

Fe26 has made some very astute observations. The BOD simply did not deal with this matter in an ethical and business-like manner. More important, this episode has revealed several existential issues that must be addressed: the basic nature and purpose of the club (profit-making vs. non-profit), adherence to IRS requirements, and lack of financial disclosure to members. This calls for action by all EFV8 club members.
John

[rotorwrench]

I've never been a member if the Early Ford V8 club so I knew nothing about it and tend to compare it to other clubs I've been involved with. I took a very good look at their web-sit just fo sh!ts & grins and have come to the conclusion that it is a monster in size compared to anything I've ever been associated with. It has its hands in a lot of different pies. It appears to have vested intrest in more stuff than I can count on both hands. Now it definitely reminds me of the US government. Top heavy for sure. I could understand why it might be having money concerns with that sort of structure.

[Fe26]

Originally Posted by John R

Fe26 has made some very astute observations. The BOD simply did not deal with this matter in an ethical and business-like manner. More important, this episode has revealed several existential issues that must be addressed: the basic nature and purpose of the club (profit-making vs. non-profit), adherence to IRS requirements, and lack of financial disclosure to members. This calls for action by all EFV8 club members.
John

Thank you John,
I notice that Mr Cox has opened another thread on this topic. Some of the comments on the new thread have been intemperate. This will not advance the cause (which is to get the board of the EV8CoA to reconsider this most worthy project).

As I have previously said; enough information and queries have been gathered and gleaned from this discussion for a formal letter to be written to the BOD, regarding this project. Sufficient comment has been made, both on Fordbarn and the EFV8C site, to give weight to any arguments that can be made to the club for this project to be reinstated.

John, I support your point that some fundemental and structural issues seem to exist within the club. The next AGM should be interesting.

I now urge Messers Grayson and Cox to write the letter. In doing so a formal dialogue is opened, you are then able to properly mention your concerns, and put forward reasons and arguments why publication should continue. This is an important first step. Enough discussion has been had on the various forums, and I would suggest enough comments have been made for the BOD to now be aware of our concerns. They are not required to respond to opinions on forums, however they must respond to a formal letter.

I am a member of a regional group, and so have some legitimate standing. If I can be of any assistance in drafting some opinions and points for argument and discussion, I would be happy to do so. I'm sure many others here who have letter writing skills would be pleased to join me in this endeavour.

I believe the club is wrong to not publish the 35-36 Pickup book. To not put your case for reinstatement denies the members of the EFV8C, the opportunity to purchase a club sanctioned book. This is not a glib argument, in sanctioning the book, the book becomes an official club document, with a weight of reputation that cannot be matched. Also, the cost of the book sold through the club, would I suggest be lower than through private enterprise.

Lastly, to Mr Cox and Mr Grayson, you have been poorly treated and are entitled to feel resentful at that treatment. However I again urge you to take a professional attitude to this situation. If you do take a professional attitude, the BOD may see the error in judgement for what it is, an error, errors can be corrected. But first a calm, logical, polite and professional (yet firm) tone needs to be put into words. How else can the club respond if they have not been formally advised. In conveying our concerns to the club, you have nothing to lose and everything to gain. And we, the 1935 and 1936 Pickup Truck owners, have everything to gain.