Go Back   The Ford Barn > General Discussion > Early V8 (1932-53)

Sponsored Links (Register now to hide all advertisements)

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 12-17-2019, 02:17 PM   #1
Mart
Senior Member
 
Mart's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Solihull, England.
Posts: 8,730
Default Valve seats. How to remove?

Hi guys. how do you remove a valve seat assuming it can't be set up in a milling machine?

Can it be shrunk by welding on it? Can you weld on it? (I have MIG).

I do have a hand powered valve seat cutter but don't fancy trying to cut them out with that.

Any advice or pointers offered appreciated.

Mart.
Mart is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-17-2019, 02:34 PM   #2
19Fordy
Senior Member
 
19Fordy's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Coral Springs FL
Posts: 10,855
Default Re: Valve seats. How to remove?

Lots of info. here.
https://www.google.com/search?q=how+...hrome&ie=UTF-8
19Fordy is offline   Reply With Quote
Sponsored Links (Register now to hide all advertisements)
Old 12-17-2019, 03:07 PM   #3
flatheadmurre
Senior Member
 
flatheadmurre's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2015
Location: Sweden
Posts: 3,045
Default Re: Valve seats. How to remove?

There are pullers more or less advanced.
The std bruteforce version https://goodson.com/products/valve-seat-pullers
Weld a washer and pull may or may not work depending on what material in seat...some stellites will weld some not...they get brittle and crack easy...
I have seats in oversize for replacing if you need...putting a std size back sometimes ends up loose.
flatheadmurre is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-17-2019, 06:59 PM   #4
JWL
Member Emeritus
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Fitzgerald, Georgia
Posts: 2,204
Default Re: Valve seats. How to remove?

Yes, a quick weld on the seat about as fast as possible. Ring will simply fall out. One word of caution---I once knew a guy to whom I explained my technique. Only too late he realized his block did not have seat rings. Ugly.
JWL is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-17-2019, 07:32 PM   #5
GOSFAST
Senior Member
 
GOSFAST's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Long Island, NY
Posts: 1,052
Default Re: Valve seats. How to remove?

John's correct above here, that's exactly how we get them out also!

If we happen to have the block mounted on the Bridgeport for any other machining at that point we have the option of simply cutting the seats out with an end mill also.

Thanks, Gary in N.Y.

P.S. I'll also give you this, we generally find a +.005" will go right back in without any add'l machining, in other words once the original is removed it is simply a matter of pressing in the O/S replacement! This method has always worked for us here!
GOSFAST is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-17-2019, 07:35 PM   #6
Mart
Senior Member
 
Mart's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Solihull, England.
Posts: 8,730
Default Re: Valve seats. How to remove?

Sponsored Links (Register now to hide all advertisements)
Thanks for the tips guys.

This will be another hoop for me to jump through.
Mart is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-17-2019, 07:59 PM   #7
Ronnieroadster
Senior Member
 
Ronnieroadster's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: East Coast in CT
Posts: 1,503
Default Re: Valve seats. How to remove?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mart View Post
Hi guys. how do you remove a valve seat assuming it can't be set up in a milling machine?

Can it be shrunk by welding on it? Can you weld on it? (I have MIG).

I do have a hand powered valve seat cutter but don't fancy trying to cut them out with that.

Any advice or pointers offered appreciated.

Mart.


Mart what I do is use the tig torch and just weld on the seat without adding any filler rod at all the seats shrink a lot doing it this way. Very easy to do. Once the seats are out if you have an accurate way of measuring the bores for the seats in the block i think you will find there not round anymore. Now the next hoop in the project will need attention.
Ronnieroadster
__________________
I use the F word a lot no not that word these words Flathead , Focus and Finish.
"Life Member of the Bonneville 200 MPH Club using a Ford Flathead block"
Owner , Builder, Driver of the First Ford Flathead bodied roadster to run 200 MPH Record July 13, 2018 LTA timing association 200.921 in one and a half miles burning gasoline.
First ever gas burning Ford flathead powered roadster to run 200 MPH at Bonneville Salt Flats setting the record August 7th 2021 at 205.744 MPH
Ronnieroadster is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-17-2019, 10:02 PM   #8
Tinker
Senior Member
 
Tinker's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: MN
Posts: 7,053
Default Re: Valve seats. How to remove?

Tigs are like precise acetylene torches really. You can heat an area pretty quick without welding on low temps.


Guess that's why they say if you can gas weld you can tig. I can tig like the average bear but haven't learned gas welding. A skill I wish I had.
Tinker is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-17-2019, 10:22 PM   #9
quickchange34
Senior Member
 
quickchange34's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: charlottesville, Va.
Posts: 588
Default Re: Valve seats. How to remove?

Tig works the best . Heat with 1/16th tungsten , quench , they fall out.
quickchange34 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-18-2019, 04:27 AM   #10
Mart
Senior Member
 
Mart's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Solihull, England.
Posts: 8,730
Default Re: Valve seats. How to remove?

Thanks fellas. Unfortunately I'm limited to mig.

I do have arc and oxy acetylene, but for this job, of the options I do have, it will need to be mig.

Mart.
Mart is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-18-2019, 04:03 PM   #11
Ronnieroadster
Senior Member
 
Ronnieroadster's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: East Coast in CT
Posts: 1,503
Default Re: Valve seats. How to remove?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mart View Post
Thanks fellas. Unfortunately I'm limited to mig.

I do have arc and oxy acetylene, but for this job, of the options I do have, it will need to be mig.

Mart.




Mart the mig will also work. Heck when i need to remove cylinder sleeves i run the mig up and down the sleeves and that works the sleeves shrink nicely so there easy to remove. Simple back yard Hot Rodding
Ronnieroadster
__________________
I use the F word a lot no not that word these words Flathead , Focus and Finish.
"Life Member of the Bonneville 200 MPH Club using a Ford Flathead block"
Owner , Builder, Driver of the First Ford Flathead bodied roadster to run 200 MPH Record July 13, 2018 LTA timing association 200.921 in one and a half miles burning gasoline.
First ever gas burning Ford flathead powered roadster to run 200 MPH at Bonneville Salt Flats setting the record August 7th 2021 at 205.744 MPH
Ronnieroadster is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-19-2020, 11:37 AM   #12
GB SISSON
Senior Member
 
GB SISSON's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2014
Location: Orcas Island Washington
Posts: 4,813
Default Re: Valve seats. How to remove?

What am I missing here? Doesn't heating a ring shaped object make it bigger around, not smaller? I'd like to change out an exhaust valve seat in an 8ba block. The seat in question has a bunch of punch marks around it to make it tighter fitting in the block. It is quite apparent that it was done and then run that way with no ill effects, but??? I have mig and oxy/aceteylene. I think I will get a photo of what I'm dealing with. Somewhere I have an envelope with 4 slightly oversized seats.
__________________
Owner/Operator of 'Jailbar Ranch' on the side of Mt. Pickett. Current stable consists of 1946 1/2 ton pickup turned woodie wagon with FH V8, 1947 Tonner Pickup (red) mostly stock with exception of a cummins 6at turbo diesel, 1946 Tonner Pickup (green) with 226 cu in 6 cyl flathead, 1979 Toyota landcruiser wagon, completely encased in 1947 Ford Jailbar sheet metal. Ok, cornbinder rear fenders..... 'Rusty ol' floorboards, hot on their feet' (Alan Jackson)
GB SISSON is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 09-19-2020, 12:17 PM   #13
Bored&Stroked
Senior Member
 
Bored&Stroked's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Central Ohio
Posts: 4,979
Default Re: Valve seats. How to remove?

Quote:
Originally Posted by GB SISSON View Post
What am I missing here? Doesn't heating a ring shaped object make it bigger around, not smaller? I'd like to change out an exhaust valve seat in an 8ba block. The seat in question has a bunch of punch marks around it to make it tighter fitting in the block. It is quite apparent that it was done and then run that way with no ill effects, but??? I have mig and oxy/aceteylene. I think I will get a photo of what I'm dealing with. Somewhere I have an envelope with 4 slightly oversized seats.
What is going on is that you are "heat shrinking" the seat . . . once it gets cold (you can quench it), it will fall out.
Bored&Stroked is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-19-2020, 12:38 PM   #14
19Fordy
Senior Member
 
19Fordy's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Coral Springs FL
Posts: 10,855
Default Re: Valve seats. How to remove?

Could you also heat it up with a propane torch and then quench the seat?
19Fordy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-19-2020, 08:34 PM   #15
Pete
Senior Member
 
Pete's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Wa.
Posts: 5,360
Default Re: Valve seats. How to remove?

Quote:
Originally Posted by 19Fordy View Post
Could you also heat it up with a propane torch and then quench the seat?
Maybe...Maybe not....
The idea is to get the ring as hot as possible WITHOUT getting the block hot so when the heat is removed the ring will cool as fast as possible. The ring will shrink the most this way and fall out.
If after heating or welding and cooling and the ring has been staked, a few taps with a punch on the inside all the way around will usually relieve the punch marks and loosen the ring.
Pete is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-20-2020, 07:27 AM   #16
Ol' Ron
Senior Member
 
Ol' Ron's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Chester Vt
Posts: 8,832
Default Re: Valve seats. How to remove?

Now that the ring is off, you can use a 1.72 intake valve.
Ol' Ron is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-20-2020, 02:45 PM   #17
supereal
Senior Member
 
supereal's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2014
Location: Iowa
Posts: 1,634
Default Re: Valve seats. How to remove?

At our shop we remove the old seats with our big machine used to install new seats. You didn't mention the year of the engine. Early engines don't use separate seats. Before you use a welder or torch, consider having a good machine shop advise you. The area around the valve pocket in the block can be easily damaged.
supereal is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-20-2020, 03:07 PM   #18
GB SISSON
Senior Member
 
GB SISSON's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2014
Location: Orcas Island Washington
Posts: 4,813
Default Re: Valve seats. How to remove?

It's an 8ba and has hardened seats on all valves.
__________________
Owner/Operator of 'Jailbar Ranch' on the side of Mt. Pickett. Current stable consists of 1946 1/2 ton pickup turned woodie wagon with FH V8, 1947 Tonner Pickup (red) mostly stock with exception of a cummins 6at turbo diesel, 1946 Tonner Pickup (green) with 226 cu in 6 cyl flathead, 1979 Toyota landcruiser wagon, completely encased in 1947 Ford Jailbar sheet metal. Ok, cornbinder rear fenders..... 'Rusty ol' floorboards, hot on their feet' (Alan Jackson)
GB SISSON is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 09-20-2020, 05:39 PM   #19
Ol' Ron
Senior Member
 
Ol' Ron's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Chester Vt
Posts: 8,832
Default Re: Valve seats. How to remove?

The 48 and some 50\s 8ba blocks had seats in both similar to the 59series blocks. This lasted untill mid 51 when the harden seats were removed form both. Some of the early 8ba blocks also had the 59 fuel pump push rod. "The mo you know"
Gramps
Ol' Ron is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-21-2020, 04:33 PM   #20
Jacques1960
Senior Member
 
Jacques1960's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2020
Location: Mount Desert, Maine
Posts: 504
Default Re: Valve seats. How to remove?

With original seats, do you advise adding synthetic lead to fuel ? Thank you
Jacques1960 is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump

Sponsored Links (Register now to hide all advertisements)


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 10:36 PM.