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Old 06-03-2020, 12:54 AM   #1
jg61hawk
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Default Jackson III 2nd Condenser -How

I read the below in a post on backfiring and didn't want to "hijack" that thread with my question.

Re: Misfire and backfire when hot
Here is something that is easy to try. Connect a second condenser from the passenger side of the coil to ground. Easy with jumpers.


How do you do that, and is this a simple roadside fix / test if you suspect a bad condenser...Do you wire to the coil and how do you ground???

I love the simple tests/fixes like jumping the two lugs on the box to bypass the voltage meter if no spark!!

Thanks.

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Old 06-03-2020, 05:34 AM   #2
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Default Re: Jackson III 2nd Condenser -How

The easiest way is using jumpers. A lot of people mount a condenser on the fire wall, that grounds it, then an alligator clip to the pass. side of coil.
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Old 06-03-2020, 10:09 AM   #3
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Default Re: Jackson III 2nd Condenser -How

So that replaces the condenser in the system? Supposed the original condenser is OK, it's fine that they both are firing? This sounds like a great roadside fix.... Are my questions all YES answers? Thanks for the great tip!!! One last question...the POSITIVE side of the coil should be red wire on the passenger side of car? Again hoping for all yes answers.

Jim

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Old 06-03-2020, 10:16 AM   #4
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Default Re: Jackson III 2nd Condenser -How

Quote:
I love the simple tests/fixes like jumping the two lugs on the box to bypass the voltage regulator!!
Voltage regulator? What voltage regulator?
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Old 06-03-2020, 10:59 AM   #5
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Default Re: Jackson III 2nd Condenser -How

I corrected the post...I meant voltage meter, when you get no juice.
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Old 06-03-2020, 11:10 AM   #6
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Default Re: Jackson III 2nd Condenser -How

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Yes, the POSITIVE side of the coil should be red wire on the passenger side of car.

Just take a mirror underneath and see if you see a + or - on the dist.
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Old 06-03-2020, 02:58 PM   #7
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Default Re: Jackson III 2nd Condenser -How

Yes to all. I have always heard that you have a higher probability of a new one being bad than an old good one going bad. I think a lot of good condensers are changed out. The A is unique in that it can cook a good condenser if things get hot enough.
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Old 06-03-2020, 03:35 PM   #8
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Default Re: Jackson III 2nd Condenser -How

Thanks so much. Perhaps a thread should be started about fast roadside bypasses, like the jumper wires on the junction box and this type of fix to by pass/ check the condenser...what else you got up your sleeve??
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Old 06-03-2020, 03:58 PM   #9
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Default Re: Jackson III 2nd Condenser -How

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Originally Posted by jg61hawk View Post
Thanks so much. Perhaps a thread should be started about fast roadside bypasses, like the jumper wires on the junction box and this type of fix to by pass/ check the condenser...what else you got up your sleeve??
He already has a lot of that stuff on YouTube. Check it out.

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Old 06-03-2020, 04:20 PM   #10
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Default Re: Jackson III 2nd Condenser -How

I see an item of terminology that might need addressing. That is, when you jumper across the two posts on the junction box, you are bypassing the Ammeter, not voltage meter. That's kind of an important distinction electrically speaking. The ammeter is in series with the entire electrical circuit and when you jumper across it, you are eliminating the possibility that the ammeter has some how burned up or the connections are not holding out well. That is really all you are doing.
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Old 06-03-2020, 04:51 PM   #11
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Default Re: Jackson III 2nd Condenser -How

But if the ampmeter is bad and you jumper it, then wouldn’t the ampmeter be acting as a cut out or voltage regulater??? So “technically” he’s right. Smiley face
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Old 06-03-2020, 04:59 PM   #12
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Default Re: Jackson III 2nd Condenser -How

Ha Bill G...funny you said that...first I said voltage regulator, then volt meter, I should have walked out to the car!!! It says AMPERE... the older I get the better I was!!!

THANKS TO ALL for this forum.
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Old 06-03-2020, 06:04 PM   #13
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Default Re: Jackson III 2nd Condenser -How

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Originally Posted by Chuck Sea/Tac View Post
But if the ampmeter is bad and you jumper it, then wouldn’t the ampmeter be acting as a cut out or voltage regulater??? So “technically” he’s right. Smiley face

No, jumpering it just bypasses (short circuits) the ammeter entirely as if it were not there. In the standard Model A, the real regulator is the battery's ability to absorb the current the generator throws at it in a passive sense. No active voltage regulator exists in the Model A. But, you are correct in that with no ammeter in the circuit, that does cut out the load to the battery and all heck breaks loose and the generator can run amuck.
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Old 06-03-2020, 07:25 PM   #14
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Default Re: Jackson III 2nd Condenser -How

Yes but the important thing here is............the older I get the better I was!!!
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Old 06-04-2020, 11:31 AM   #15
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Default Re: Jackson III 2nd Condenser -How

Am not sure, maybe I am missing something. I can see this working if the condenser is opening. But if the old condenser is left in and the fault is the condenser is shorting, the shorting is still there and the second condenser is shorted by the original condenser.


Aren't most bad condensers due to shorting?
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Old 06-05-2020, 06:36 AM   #16
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Default Re: Jackson III 2nd Condenser -How

You can of course make a temporary condenser by sticking two wires into a potato.
I read about some guy doing it with a Landrover in 2015. Didn't really believe it but it got me home when my 1910 Hupmobiles magneto went bad once I just wired the potato so that it was across the points and surprisingly it worked
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Old 06-05-2020, 03:53 PM   #17
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Default Re: Jackson III 2nd Condenser -How

I just tried Jackson's parallel condenser quick fix.
Loosen the passenger side terminal on the coil and slide the pigtail terminal under the nut and tighten it. Use a wire with two alligator clips, one the tab on the condenser and the other end to the screw on the firewall. just minutes
Great tip.
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Old 06-05-2020, 04:34 PM   #18
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Default Re: Jackson III 2nd Condenser -How

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I think a lot of good condensers are changed out.
I have often thought about that. Back in the day when you brought your car in for a "tune up" they just automatically changed out the condenser (among other parts). no testing just out with the old, in with the new.

I wonder how many 'good' parts were just thrown out. Back when we were young and poor we salvaged many batteries, points, condensers, rotors, caps, etc.

Now I am old but still poor...
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Old 06-14-2021, 11:30 AM   #19
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Default Re: Jackson III 2nd Condenser -How

Old post but that's ok.

So, how is the condenser tested?

First, ground the condenser, then what do you do with the pigtail on the condenser? #17 says loosen the passenger side, but that doesn't say the + or - side, who knows how the coil was installed. Then where do the jumper wires go?
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Old 06-14-2021, 11:42 AM   #20
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Default Re: Jackson III 2nd Condenser -How

I accidentally reposted this thread in answering another thread. At any rate the condenser gets grounded by mounting to firewall and then a jumper from pigtail of condenser to positive coil.....or if mounted close enough wire to coil with no jumper.

OLD31...You knew that a year ago!!! See post 6 on here......Funny stuff we do.
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Old 06-14-2021, 12:12 PM   #21
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Default Re: Jackson III 2nd Condenser -How

I think the point is that the condenser should be connected to the side of the coil that goes to the points. If you have a negative grounded battery, then that should be the negative side of the coil, or if positive grounded then the positive side of the coil. Seems to me that it is just as easy to change out the condenser with two screws. If the condenser is shorted than adding a second condenser will not solve anything.
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Old 06-14-2021, 01:45 PM   #22
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Default Re: Jackson III 2nd Condenser -How

I put in a A&L burnout proof condenser in 35 years ago, no more fooling with changing condensers, before that I got real good at it, take screw out of tab, put screwdriver in hole, unscrew, keep screwdriver on screw, pull out old , put in new, start screw
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Old 06-15-2021, 09:29 AM   #23
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Default Re: Jackson III 2nd Condenser -How

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Originally Posted by old31 View Post
Old post but that's ok.

So, how is the condenser tested?

First, ground the condenser, then what do you do with the pigtail on the condenser? #17 says loosen the passenger side, but that doesn't say the + or - side, who knows how the coil was installed. Then where do the jumper wires go?
One side of the condensor gets grounded, the other side connects to the terminal that connects to the distributor points. Simple.
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Old 06-20-2021, 07:26 AM   #24
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Default Re: Jackson III 2nd Condenser -How

The condenser is tested with a coil condenser tester. The same tool that makes an arc then heats the coil to see if the arc gets less. You can put a condenser across it and see if it causes issues.

The other tool is a condenser test set used by radio repair guys. That is a bit more complicated, I have one.

There is an ESR meter also but I do not know if that will do a good job on these types of capacitors. I use that for checking power supply filter capacitors.

The capacitor value checker on some volt meters does not check for problems. A capacitor will show proper capacitance yet still not function in circuit. There are other attributes such as leakage at high voltages and such.

The best solution is to use a modern high quality unit such as what is made by A&L. Switching to the V8 points and condenser is a mistake. The modern condensers are made low bid in china and may fail quick, even out of the box.
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Old 06-20-2021, 07:42 AM   #25
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Default Re: Jackson III 2nd Condenser -How

JG, I did not know that 1 year ago, as that #6 statement has absolutely nothing to do with the condenser hook up.

I was stating that from the factory, the - side of the coil goes on the driver's side and that the red wire goes to the plus or passenger's side. And, to make someone's life easier as to see how someone installed the coil, just take a mirror and look underneath vs removing the coil.
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Old 06-20-2021, 09:43 AM   #26
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Default Re: Jackson III 2nd Condenser -How

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The quality of condensers in more recent times seems to be in the decline. This makes for unpredictable reliability to the point where you should buy and carry spares incase you experience a premature failure. I converted to electronic ignition quite some time ago which eliminates this problem. Start up, not having to worry about condensers & point settings provide continuous uniform engine performance which makes driving my "A" a joy.
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Old 06-20-2021, 10:18 AM   #27
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Default Re: Jackson III 2nd Condenser -How

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The quality of condensers in more recent times seems to be in the decline.
It's not just condensers.
I have a friend w/a '66 Ford pickup, he was telling me that he was having troubles w/the points not lasting very long, he was getting them from NAPA. I gave him a NOS set that I had, from the '70s, he installed them and his problem w/points not lasting went away.
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Last edited by katy; 06-20-2021 at 10:19 AM. Reason: Addition
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