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Old 06-12-2021, 12:00 AM   #41
ETAModel
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Default Re: Longest trip yet...MPG suck!

A few points worth making.

1. This Model A isn't mine; I am the driver and mechanic, so repairs/upgrades have to be approved by the owner. He's fine with most of my recommendations, but thought I'd mention that.
2. The notches on the steering column for the throttle and spark are long gone. I posted about this 18 months ago, but haven't made any changes to it due to more pressing issues and time limitations So I just move the spark up and down to what seems right. It isn't repeatable, except at max settings.
3. Other than youtube videos and anecdotal stories about operating the Ford A I have had very little "instructions" on the operations of said vehicle. The manual provided by Shew01 is a Godsend, and Will be studied laboriously.

I'm plan on pulling the plugs and looking/cleaning them, then taking her ( I haven't named the car yet) out in the morning and trying retarding the spark when climbing a hill or under a load, and not advancing the spark as far as I have been. As I said, I was under the impression that you pulled both levers down for max speed/power.

Thanks for all the help and info.
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Old 06-12-2021, 01:16 PM   #42
nkaminar
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Default Re: Longest trip yet...MPG suck!

A good article about setting the spark lever at http://model-a.org/use_carb_check_timing.html
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Old 06-12-2021, 09:13 PM   #43
ETAModel
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Default Re: Longest trip yet...MPG suck!

Quote:
Originally Posted by nkaminar View Post
A good article about setting the spark lever at http://model-a.org/use_carb_check_timing.html
What a great idea...I wish I had thought of that. I'll just check the factory tachometer in the dash to confirm it's running twice the idle speed....oh Snap!!!
😁
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Old 06-12-2021, 11:39 PM   #44
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Default Re: Longest trip yet...MPG suck!

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Originally Posted by ETAModel View Post
What a great idea...I wish I had thought of that. I'll just check the factory tachometer in the dash to confirm it's running twice the idle speed....oh Snap!!!
😁
For someone asking for an endless amount of help, you have a bad attitude.
If you have been working on cars for some time, you can tell when it is about doubled in RPM. Or you could use a tune-up/diagnostic tachometer that will give you RPM. You may need to hook it up to a 12 volt battery then use the spark plug wire pickup on the Model A.
And by the way, no one cares that Texas is a big state, they are just trying to help you.
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Old 06-13-2021, 11:45 AM   #45
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Default Re: Longest trip yet...MPG suck!

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For someone asking for an endless amount of help, you have a bad attitude.
If you have been working on cars for some time, you can tell when it is about doubled in RPM. Or you could use a tune-up/diagnostic tachometer that will give you RPM. You may need to hook it up to a 12 volt battery then use the spark plug wire pickup on the Model A.
And by the way, no one cares that Texas is a big state, they are just trying to help you.

I apologize if it sounded like a bad attitude. I was trying to add some levity and humor to a project that has caused aches, pains and sweat. I thought the emoji would be a clue I was joking.

As to the size of the state, my poorly illustrated point was its easy to wind up in the middle of nowhere and at 10mpg I'd need gas. I'm trying to increase the mpg, that's all. Most my life people have told me the Model A would get 20 mpg, that's what I was trying to get to.
The new plugs surely will help, and I'm gonna add some E15 gas to the tank, and see what happens.

Again, my apologies if I offended anyone.

Et
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Old 06-13-2021, 12:14 PM   #46
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Default Re: Longest trip yet...MPG suck!

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One more thing - your sample size is very small and inaccurate. You may not have been precise about re-filling to the same point in the tank. GPS has induced errors that vary. Your speedometer doesn't work. You only went 40 miles.

Try a much longer trip with known distance off mapquest or similar, and fill up at the end. That will give you a more accurate assessment.

PS. Throw a 5 gallon container of gas on the luggage rack, or make a temporary wooden bracket. Boom! Longer range.
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Old 06-13-2021, 02:41 PM   #47
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Default Re: Longest trip yet...MPG suck!

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One more thing - your sample size is very small and inaccurate. You may not have been precise about re-filling to the same point in the tank. GPS has induced errors that vary. Your speedometer doesn't work. You only went 40 miles.

Try a much longer trip with known distance off mapquest or similar, and fill up at the end. That will give you a more accurate assessment.

PS. Throw a 5 gallon container of gas on the luggage rack, or make a temporary wooden bracket. Boom! Longer range.

Your totally correct, one drive does not make a very good sample. I'm still learning this car, and getting help along the way. The manual says start no more than 1 turn on GAV to crank, then no more than 1/4 turn on the GAV on the highway. I had it closer to 2/3 turn on highway. I put new plugs in yesterday, gonna confirm timing this week, and take her on the road again. Hopefully I will be better at this.

I also got a gas can, hope I never need it.
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Old 06-13-2021, 02:46 PM   #48
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Default Re: Longest trip yet...MPG suck!

Most likely dragging brake. If the points are too close it hurts performance a lot. The block that rides on the cam sometimes wears down quite a bit.

The GAV open 1/8 to 1/4 should be fine. Check to assure that the bolts holding the carb on the intake are "snug", not tight, "snug".
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Old 06-13-2021, 02:53 PM   #49
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Default Re: Longest trip yet...MPG suck!

BTW, I put her in neutral and pushed her up and down the driveway pretty easy yesterday, I don't think anything was dragging and didn't hear anything. I think keeping the spark all the way down, uphill and downhill, wasn't helping, as was the GAV too far open. I'll change those too items and see how she does.
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Old 06-13-2021, 05:05 PM   #50
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Default Re: Longest trip yet...MPG suck!

Quote:
Originally Posted by GeneBob View Post
For someone asking for an endless amount of help, you have a bad attitude.
If you have been working on cars for some time, you can tell when it is about doubled in RPM. Or you could use a tune-up/diagnostic tachometer that will give you RPM. You may need to hook it up to a 12 volt battery then use the spark plug wire pickup on the Model A.
And by the way, no one cares that Texas is a big state, they are just trying to help you.
Yup.
John
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Old 06-13-2021, 06:34 PM   #51
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Default Re: Longest trip yet...MPG suck!

ET, here is my input.

Did you check the point gap, should be 0.020?
You are going to check the timing, good.
You pumped up the tires, good.
You are going to do a longer run or multiple runs to check the mileage, good. (Carry extra gas in case you run dry.)
Are you doing your mileage test at a constant speed of 45 to 50 mph on a level highway?
You checked for resistance by pushing the car and there was none, good.
You are going to try turning in the GAV (1/4 turn open or shut) while cruising at a constant speed on the highway, good.
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A is for apple, green as the sky.
Step on the gas, for tomorrow I die.
Forget the brakes, they really don't work.
The clutch always sticks, and starts with a jerk.
My car grows red hair, and flies through the air.
Driving's a blast, a blast from the past.
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Old 06-13-2021, 10:07 PM   #52
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Default Re: Longest trip yet...MPG suck!

nkaminar,
Good summary, sounds like ETA is working the issues like you stated and will find the answer.
For what it is worth, my Tudor has never done well on mpg's but I am always pushing her at 60 or 65 mph. It is as aerodynamic as a brick.
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Old 06-13-2021, 11:40 PM   #53
ETAModel
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Default Re: Longest trip yet...MPG suck!

Quote:
Originally Posted by nkaminar View Post
ET, here is my input.

Did you check the point gap, should be 0.020?
You are going to check the timing, good.
You pumped up the tires, good.
You are going to do a longer run or multiple runs to check the mileage, good. (Carry extra gas in case you run dry.)
Are you doing your mileage test at a constant speed of 45 to 50 mph on a level highway?
You checked for resistance by pushing the car and there was none, good.
You are going to try turning in the GAV (1/4 turn open or shut) while cruising at a constant speed on the highway, good.
Flat and level around here is almost impossible. Gently rolling hills is more like it. The hand throttle at almost wide open runs around 49, so a smidge off that gives me 44-45 MPH on a reasonably flat stretch. The points gap at .021, is that close enough? The timing wrench is on the way.

If I keep driving it I might just get it figured out...finger's crossed.
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Old 06-14-2021, 09:24 AM   #54
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Default Re: Longest trip yet...MPG suck!

0.021 close enough.

If you are only getting 49 mph out of the old girl then there is something wrong. Sounds like the timing is off, especially if you have the spark lever all the way down and it does not make a difference. Review how to set the spark lever when driving and do that after you check the timing.
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A is for apple, green as the sky.
Step on the gas, for tomorrow I die.
Forget the brakes, they really don't work.
The clutch always sticks, and starts with a jerk.
My car grows red hair, and flies through the air.
Driving's a blast, a blast from the past.
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Old 06-14-2021, 12:01 PM   #55
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Default Re: Longest trip yet...MPG suck!

ETA stated hand throttle. Does the hand throttle give you full throttle? I never tried it. He may have more mph above the hand throttle limit?

The timing wrench is a big help but make sure the advance lever is all the way up before adjusting the timing. You can drive yourself crazy with that mistake.
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Old 06-14-2021, 01:17 PM   #56
ETAModel
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Default Re: Longest trip yet...MPG suck!

Quote:
Originally Posted by nkaminar View Post
0.021 close enough.

If you are only getting 49 mph out of the old girl then there is something wrong. Sounds like the timing is off, especially if you have the spark lever all the way down and it does not make a difference. Review how to set the spark lever when driving and do that after you check the timing.

I am sorry I was not more clear. If I use the foot feed I have reached 62 miles an hour per Speedbot and the engine has plenty of Pep. Using the hand throttle I'll get it up almost to 50 but not quite. I've been using the hand throttle to act as a cruise control.
This is a strong motor, IMHO, it just needs someone who knows what they're doing.

Last edited by ETAModel; 06-14-2021 at 01:22 PM.
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Old 06-14-2021, 11:30 PM   #57
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Default Re: Longest trip yet...MPG suck!

ETA, you seem to be juggling a few things with this car so I will add one more thing for you to worry about. Check your fan blade. You can search on the forum to see if your blade should be replaced. Better to replace it if it is suspect because a broken fan blade will ruin your day.
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Old 06-14-2021, 11:40 PM   #58
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Default Re: Longest trip yet...MPG suck!

Most of the stock engines effciency issues come from low compression,under fueling and manual timing.
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Old 06-20-2021, 04:40 PM   #59
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Default Re: Longest trip yet...MPG suck!

So what was it?
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