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Old 07-29-2020, 10:52 AM   #41
woodiewagon46
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Default Re: Drake 40 dlx headlamp rims (bezels)

Kube, your'e not alone when Drake's people tell you "gee this never happened before". Several years ago I purchased a set of rubber stone guards for my '46 Station Wagon. They attach to the fender with four studs that are plug welded to the steel backer on the guards. Three of the studs were welded in the wrong place. At least they got one right. When I called Drake they told me the same thing, "nobody has ever complained before". I TIG welded them in the correct place and to add insult to injury, the one stud from Drake that I didn't fix, broke off when I tried to tighten it.
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Old 07-31-2020, 08:12 PM   #42
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Default Re: Drake 40 dlx headlamp rims (bezels)

Since this is on the subject of Drake parts.Does anyone know if the 40 bumper guards and the end wings that Drake sells will fit an original 40 bumper good?Can you tell the originals from the repos?
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Old 08-01-2020, 08:50 AM   #43
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Default Re: Drake 40 dlx headlamp rims (bezels)

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Since this is on the subject of Drake parts.Does anyone know if the 40 bumper guards and the end wings that Drake sells will fit an original 40 bumper good?Can you tell the originals from the repos?
The bumper guards fit albeit poorly. The contour does not match the authentic bumper's contour.
The end guards fit. How do you tell a repop from an authentic tip? Two ways.
1) An authentic tip will have the manufactures logo stamped in the back. It is within a circle of approximately 5/16" diameter. The letters "DP" (Detroit Products) is within that circle.
2) An authentic tip has a lip that surrounds both the top and bottom of the bumper bar. The repops have only an upper "lip".
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Old 08-01-2020, 08:51 AM   #44
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Default Re: Drake 40 dlx headlamp rims (bezels)

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Originally Posted by woodiewagon46 View Post
Kube, your'e not alone when Drake's people tell you "gee this never happened before". Several years ago I purchased a set of rubber stone guards for my '46 Station Wagon. They attach to the fender with four studs that are plug welded to the steel backer on the guards. Three of the studs were welded in the wrong place. At least they got one right. When I called Drake they told me the same thing, "nobody has ever complained before". I TIG welded them in the correct place and to add insult to injury, the one stud from Drake that I didn't fix, broke off when I tried to tighten it.
I'd had the exact experience when installing a set on a '46 coupe.
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Old 08-01-2020, 08:09 PM   #45
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Default Re: Drake 40 dlx headlamp rims (bezels)

Kube ,can you tell if this is a repo or original?I tryed to clean back side but cut not find any markings?
IMG_1599.jpg

IMG_1598.jpg
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Old 08-01-2020, 11:38 PM   #46
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Default Re: Drake 40 dlx headlamp rims (bezels)

Looks original to me, it conforms to Kube's description of the lip that is above and below the bumper.
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Old 08-02-2020, 08:15 AM   #47
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Default Re: Drake 40 dlx headlamp rims (bezels)

That's an authentic tip.
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Old 08-02-2020, 09:21 AM   #48
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Default Re: Drake 40 dlx headlamp rims (bezels)

Thanks Kube and deuce.Now I want to see the price on rechroming four of them?My 40 is just a driver,probably don't want to go that far!
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Old 08-02-2020, 09:57 AM   #49
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Default Re: Drake 40 dlx headlamp rims (bezels)

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It actually does cost more to hold tolerances tighter.
You've all heard of the military paying $600 for a hammer that you and I can buy at Lowes for $15.
I worked at North Island Naval Air Station where the $600 hammer, ash trays and toilet seats were manufactured. The cost had little to do with tolerances. 95% of the costs were for overhead. These items had to be designed, approved by engineering, tooling made, material ordered and a learning curve out in the production shops. For low quantities, cost would eat you up.

If you were to make one hammer in your shop, it would cost you allot more too. And in the long run, quality pays not costs. It costs just as much to make a defective part in a mass production scenario as a good one and the defective part gets scraped at major cost to the manufacturer. We learned that from Dr. Edwards Deming and Japan.
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Old 08-02-2020, 10:28 AM   #50
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Default Re: Drake 40 dlx headlamp rims (bezels)

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I worked at North Island Naval Air Station where the $600 hammer, ash trays and toilet seats were manufactured. The cost had little to do with tolerances. 95% of the costs were for overhead. These items had to be designed, approved by engineering, tooling made, material ordered and a learning curve out in the production shops. For low quantities, cost would eat you up.
I have been directly involved in a lot of this. Lets take a hammer as an example. You see one in a store and it has a mass production price. Now the government decides to order say 100 hammers built to a specific requirement (may not really matter, but that is the way they operate).

First you get a request for the item. Then it has to be reviewed and negotiated. Engineering has to write up a specification. The specification has to be reviewed internally and with the government and approved. This specification is summited for bids. The bids are reviewed and then there is negotiations with the manufacture. Now engineering has to write up acceptance testing procedures. The next steep is the actual testing and acceptance. This results has to be documented and submitted to the government for approval. All the while the legal deportment and procurement departments have to be reviewing all of this. Then there is shipping cost. And the big one is YOU, the provider, are liable for any and all incidents that might occur when using the item.

Add all of that up and divide by one hundred. The fact is the items are being sold for way under the actual cost. So way do it at all? It was considered just part of the job, good will, whatever, to go along with much larger contracts.

When all of this started making headlines we just started refusing to provide any item that the government could purchase for another source. It was a big cost lost in the first place!

Some of the government requirements were very specific, such as a tool could not produce a spark. When CRT tubes were being used, we had to warranty any damage to an aircraft or personnel if it ever exploded. If you have never conducted business with the government, you have no idea how difficult it can be. I would not sell hammers to the government for 10x the $600! And that is what the company finally decided as well.
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Old 08-02-2020, 11:01 AM   #51
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Default Re: Drake 40 dlx headlamp rims (bezels)

[QUOTE=JSeery;1915809]I have been directly involved in a lot of this. Lets take a hammer as an example. You see one in a store and it has a mass production price. Now the government decides to order say 100 hammers built to a specific requirement (may not really matter, but that is the way they operate).

First you get a request for the item. Then it has to be reviewed and negotiated.

This was much worse than that. The hammer, the ash trays and toilet seats were actually made by the government, for the government (Navy) at North Island Naval Air Rework Facility. It's much more expensive when the government makes these things internally. There are even more steps and expense than buying it on contracts or open purchase. When the government can manufacture itself, it should only be done when the part can't be obtained in private industry. That often happens when rebuilding 30 year old aircraft but common sense dictates not for toilet seats, ash trays and hammers.
They make things, at great expense, all the time but only for items which can't be had any other way and are flight critical.
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Old 08-02-2020, 11:34 AM   #52
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Default Re: Drake 40 dlx headlamp rims (bezels)

Government contracting is very specific and has been for some time. If it could be simplified to a more practical extent, things wouldn't cost the tax payers as much but there is no incentive in the current system to be pragmatic or practical. This is a classic example of why the government should stay out of manufacturing and let the folks that build the product make the design to fit the needs. This was done during WWII and the system worked very well. Countries in the axis powers chose to ignore this practice and it contributed to their rapid demise.
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Old 08-05-2020, 10:53 AM   #53
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Default Re: Drake 40 dlx headlamp rims (bezels)

Ok,I took my stuff to a home town chrome shop today to get a price.He said he would do 4 bumper guards,4 bumper wings and two grill guards for $330.I left all the stuff with him,thought that wasn't to bad.I have had plating done there before and was pleased.He has done a lot of plating for Carpenters in the past and figured he knows what he is doing.Kube,I finally found a "DP" on grill guard support!
IMG_1612.jpg

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Old 08-05-2020, 11:18 AM   #54
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Default Re: Drake 40 dlx headlamp rims (bezels)

That sounds like a good price.
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Old 08-05-2020, 11:25 AM   #55
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Default Re: Drake 40 dlx headlamp rims (bezels)

Quote:
Originally Posted by JSeery View Post
I have been directly involved in a lot of this. Lets take a hammer as an example. You see one in a store and it has a mass production price. Now the government decides to order say 100 hammers built to a specific requirement (may not really matter, but that is the way they operate).

First you get a request for the item. Then it has to be reviewed and negotiated. Engineering has to write up a specification. The specification has to be reviewed internally and with the government and approved. This specification is summited for bids. The bids are reviewed and then there is negotiations with the manufacture. Now engineering has to write up acceptance testing procedures. The next steep is the actual testing and acceptance. This results has to be documented and submitted to the government for approval. All the while the legal deportment and procurement departments have to be reviewing all of this. Then there is shipping cost. And the big one is YOU, the provider, are liable for any and all incidents that might occur when using the item.

Add all of that up and divide by one hundred. The fact is the items are being sold for way under the actual cost. So way do it at all? It was considered just part of the job, good will, whatever, to go along with much larger contracts.

When all of this started making headlines we just started refusing to provide any item that the government could purchase for another source. It was a big cost lost in the first place!

Some of the government requirements were very specific, such as a tool could not produce a spark. When CRT tubes were being used, we had to warranty any damage to an aircraft or personnel if it ever exploded. If you have never conducted business with the government, you have no idea how difficult it can be. I would not sell hammers to the government for 10x the $600! And that is what the company finally decided as well.
AND what's FUNNY Is the "standard" E6 working on the Aircraft Carrier boiler here at the 2nd largest Navel Seaport on the east coast calls me for Heat Treated B7 Studs and 2H Heavy Hex Nuts to fix a steam line. He gets here to my shop and he ask's "Is it B7 & 2H?" and I lift the end of the stud to show him the stamp "B7" and the Hex Nut stamped "2H" and that is ALL he is concerned with, doesn't care IF is Domestic or Import, Doesn't care what the tolerances are etc etc etc....ITs stamped what he wants, IT fixes the problem and the ship sails!!!!!! Been happening for "over" my 22 years here!!! AND a damn sight cheaper and faster than going through Govt central purchasing OR the above listed process!!!!

Last edited by rockfla; 08-05-2020 at 01:02 PM.
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Old 08-05-2020, 01:21 PM   #56
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Default Re: Drake 40 dlx headlamp rims (bezels)

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Ok,I took my stuff to a home town chrome shop today to get a price.He said he would do 4 bumper guards,4 bumper wings and two grill guards for $330.I left all the stuff with him,thought that wasn't to bad.I have had plating done there before and was pleased.He has done a lot of plating for Carpenters in the past and figured he knows what he is doing.Kube,I finally found a "DP" on grill guard support!
Attachment 438086
That's a "giveaway" price.
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Old 08-05-2020, 01:28 PM   #57
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Default Re: Drake 40 dlx headlamp rims (bezels)

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That's a "giveaway" price.
Agreed!!! Damn good. Kube unfortunately what you started this post with is NOT endemic to just V8 Ford stuff. My buddy is a Willys Jeepster guy and he has the issue with some of the repro stuff too!!! SAD
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Old 08-06-2020, 12:58 PM   #58
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Default Re: Drake 40 dlx headlamp rims (bezels)

Mike,
Installed I set of Vintique ones on my 40 last night and they fit my car perfect.
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