The Ford Barn

gearloose · 02-18-2011, 07:11 PM

The timing is set by the book, Starts and runs at full retard but doesn't sound retarded. timing light shows 2 1/2 degrees advanced. as I run the spark lever to advance the engine speeds up but is not smooth and the exhaust poops a lot. if I go to full down it runs worst. It did run right before. could it be a condenser?

BCCHOPIT · 02-18-2011, 07:18 PM

You said it ran good before. Before what? Did you play with the timing and now it doesn't run?

Keith True · 02-18-2011, 07:21 PM

If you are doing this at an idle it sounds right.You don't pull the advance down much until you are under way.About halfway when running around,and all the way down when running down the highway.Just a notch or two at idle.More is required as the speed climbs.

gearloose · 02-18-2011, 07:22 PM

I didn't say it doesn't run

BCCHOPIT · 02-18-2011, 07:54 PM

We need more info if you wont help.
Do it just stop running good all by its self
Did you you change any parts
Did you play with the points
when did you play with the timing before or after the pooping out the tail pipe

Stan/MO. · 02-18-2011, 08:03 PM

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Read the 2nd post...I think what they are asking is...did you change anything that could have caused the problem you are having. Just trying to help you get the answers you need. Good luck.

Stan/Mo.

Stan/MO. · 02-18-2011, 08:08 PM

Sorry BCCHOPIT...Didn't mean to step on your toes. didn't know you posted again.

Stan/Mo.

Great Lakes Greg · 02-18-2011, 08:11 PM

If the timing is set correctly, as you state, maybe it's somthing worse like the gears skipped a tooth and the cam shaft is mechanically advanced or retarded on the crank too far? I know a timing chain can skip, but will the gears also skip if they are worn? Hope I'm wrong (I usually am).

BCCHOPIT · 02-18-2011, 08:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stan/MO.

Sorry BCCHOPIT...Didn't mean to step on your toes. didn't know you posted again.

Stan/Mo.

Its all good

It fun helping with no info

Tom Endy · 02-18-2011, 08:53 PM

What you describe sounds as if the timing is too far advanced to begin with. When you pull the spark lever down for normal advance when driving it may end up as too much. I have seen this problem on cars that had a timing cover from a "B" engine. When the timing was set by the book it was advanced instead of at TDC. When the handle was pulled down it ran erratic. You might varify that the #1 piston is at TDC when you set the timing.
Hopefully you have a timing cover installed for an "A" engine.

Tom Endy

Randy308 · 02-18-2011, 08:54 PM

When I start my car, and it runs poorly after running good, I check for contaminantes in the carb jets. If the idle jet is restricted, it will run lean. Running lean typically will increase your rpm's, making it sound like it's not fully retarded. As you pull down on the advance, the engine will stumble, worse the more you pull down. The engine may even backfire.

gearloose · 02-18-2011, 09:11 PM

thanks tom, I know for sure its an A cover on it now because when I had the engine rebuild a B cover was put on by mistake and it F*** up the engine running too advanced.

BCCHOPIT · 02-18-2011, 09:14 PM

Sorry I would never talk down to anyone. I am just asking and I hope I didn't miss something but when did it start running poor? If its after the set or adjusted I would go back you might have missed something. I know I have had to go back in the past.
How cold was it when you had your car running. (I see you live in Main)I drove mine to work today and it took a little bit for it to run right

gearloose · 02-18-2011, 09:14 PM

yes it does sound too advanced. maybe the gear did jump a tooth, I am going to check the #1 piston to make sure it's at tdc. the slot in the cap is spot on. I timed it with Marco's timing instructions in hand. Thanks for the good tips

Glenn C. · 02-18-2011, 09:15 PM

He might have a crack in the distributor cap that shorts across to another cylinder when he advances the spark or revs it up ?? Yes/No ??

gearloose · 02-18-2011, 09:22 PM

I have a cutaway cap on it to check for that, looks OK

BCCHOPIT · 02-18-2011, 09:30 PM

do you have any pics of this cutaway cap it sound cool

gearloose · 02-18-2011, 09:57 PM

Here's the back story....It ran great when I parked, it next time I tried to start it after a week or so it wouldn't run. I had an electronic ignition on it that seemed to have stopped working ,no spark. After much troubleshooting I couldn't find why no spark or power to the coil. I removed the components and sent them back to be checked, they were returned saying everything was working fine. I then reinstalled everything but still no spark. to see if it was a bad system I remove the electronic components and reinstalled the point system, set the points, timed it and it started right up but now has this running problem. so, it won't run with the electronic system but will with the old point setup but now it runs rough. Yes It's cold here in Maine, thank goodness for a heated garage. good thing it's not touring weather yet, Maybe by then I will have found and fixed it.

gearloose · 02-18-2011, 10:01 PM

Bratton's catalog has a picture of the cap under "ignition timing tools"

Bruce Adams · 02-18-2011, 11:54 PM

What happens if you take up the slop by turning the cam clockwise until the points JUST CLOSE at TDC?
Then set the timing at that location while at TDC.
That eliminates slop, I guess the lazy way.

BTW, you DID set the points with the lever at full retard, right?

Were it me, I would just try retarding the spark a bit and see if that "fixes" the problem without getting to introspective about WHY it fixed the problem.

02-18-2011, 07:18 PM	#2
BCCHOPIT Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Torrington, CT Posts: 609	Re: Engine runs worse when spark is advanced You said it ran good before. Before what? Did you play with the timing and now it doesn't run? __________________ WAC that banger in the A$$ and drive it home hard http://waccustoms.com

02-18-2011, 07:21 PM	#3
Keith True Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Epping N.H. Posts: 2,987	Re: Engine runs worse when spark is advanced If you are doing this at an idle it sounds right.You don't pull the advance down much until you are under way.About halfway when running around,and all the way down when running down the highway.Just a notch or two at idle.More is required as the speed climbs.

02-18-2011, 07:22 PM	#4
gearloose Member Join Date: Aug 2010 Location: South Berwick,Maine Posts: 59	Re: Engine runs worse when spark is advanced I didn't say it doesn't run

02-18-2011, 07:54 PM	#5
BCCHOPIT Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Torrington, CT Posts: 609	Re: Engine runs worse when spark is advanced We need more info if you wont help. Do it just stop running good all by its self Did you you change any parts Did you play with the points when did you play with the timing before or after the pooping out the tail pipe __________________ WAC that banger in the A$$ and drive it home hard http://waccustoms.com

02-18-2011, 08:03 PM	#6
Stan/MO. Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Hannibal, Mo. Posts: 124	Re: Engine runs worse when spark is advanced Sponsored Links (Register now to hide all advertisements) Read the 2nd post...I think what they are asking is...did you change anything that could have caused the problem you are having. Just trying to help you get the answers you need. Good luck. Stan/Mo.

02-18-2011, 07:11 PM	#1
gearloose Member Join Date: Aug 2010 Location: South Berwick,Maine Posts: 59	Engine runs worse when spark is advanced The timing is set by the book, Starts and runs at full retard but doesn't sound retarded. timing light shows 2 1/2 degrees advanced. as I run the spark lever to advance the engine speeds up but is not smooth and the exhaust poops a lot. if I go to full down it runs worst. It did run right before. could it be a condenser?

02-18-2011, 08:08 PM	#7
Stan/MO. Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Hannibal, Mo. Posts: 124	Re: Engine runs worse when spark is advanced Sorry BCCHOPIT...Didn't mean to step on your toes. didn't know you posted again. Stan/Mo.

02-18-2011, 08:11 PM	#8
Great Lakes Greg Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Posts: 1,369	Re: Engine runs worse when spark is advanced If the timing is set correctly, as you state, maybe it's somthing worse like the gears skipped a tooth and the cam shaft is mechanically advanced or retarded on the crank too far? I know a timing chain can skip, but will the gears also skip if they are worn? Hope I'm wrong (I usually am).

02-18-2011, 08:53 PM	#10
Tom Endy Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Southern California Posts: 3,131	Re: Engine runs worse when spark is advanced What you describe sounds as if the timing is too far advanced to begin with. When you pull the spark lever down for normal advance when driving it may end up as too much. I have seen this problem on cars that had a timing cover from a "B" engine. When the timing was set by the book it was advanced instead of at TDC. When the handle was pulled down it ran erratic. You might varify that the #1 piston is at TDC when you set the timing. Hopefully you have a timing cover installed for an "A" engine. Tom Endy

02-18-2011, 08:54 PM	#11
Randy308 Junior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Monrovia, California Posts: 7	Re: Engine runs worse when spark is advanced When I start my car, and it runs poorly after running good, I check for contaminantes in the carb jets. If the idle jet is restricted, it will run lean. Running lean typically will increase your rpm's, making it sound like it's not fully retarded. As you pull down on the advance, the engine will stumble, worse the more you pull down. The engine may even backfire.

02-18-2011, 09:11 PM	#12
gearloose Member Join Date: Aug 2010 Location: South Berwick,Maine Posts: 59	Re: Engine runs worse when spark is advanced thanks tom, I know for sure its an A cover on it now because when I had the engine rebuild a B cover was put on by mistake and it F*** up the engine running too advanced.

02-18-2011, 09:14 PM	#13
BCCHOPIT Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Torrington, CT Posts: 609	Re: Engine runs worse when spark is advanced Sorry I would never talk down to anyone. I am just asking and I hope I didn't miss something but when did it start running poor? If its after the set or adjusted I would go back you might have missed something. I know I have had to go back in the past. How cold was it when you had your car running. (I see you live in Main)I drove mine to work today and it took a little bit for it to run right

02-18-2011, 09:15 PM	#15
Glenn C. Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Didsbury Alberta Posts: 838	Re: Engine runs worse when spark is advanced He might have a crack in the distributor cap that shorts across to another cylinder when he advances the spark or revs it up ?? Yes/No ??

02-18-2011, 09:22 PM	#16
gearloose Member Join Date: Aug 2010 Location: South Berwick,Maine Posts: 59	Re: Engine runs worse when spark is advanced I have a cutaway cap on it to check for that, looks OK

02-18-2011, 09:30 PM	#17
BCCHOPIT Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Torrington, CT Posts: 609	Re: Engine runs worse when spark is advanced do you have any pics of this cutaway cap it sound cool

02-18-2011, 09:57 PM	#18
gearloose Member Join Date: Aug 2010 Location: South Berwick,Maine Posts: 59	Re: Engine runs worse when spark is advanced Here's the back story....It ran great when I parked, it next time I tried to start it after a week or so it wouldn't run. I had an electronic ignition on it that seemed to have stopped working ,no spark. After much troubleshooting I couldn't find why no spark or power to the coil. I removed the components and sent them back to be checked, they were returned saying everything was working fine. I then reinstalled everything but still no spark. to see if it was a bad system I remove the electronic components and reinstalled the point system, set the points, timed it and it started right up but now has this running problem. so, it won't run with the electronic system but will with the old point setup but now it runs rough. Yes It's cold here in Maine, thank goodness for a heated garage. good thing it's not touring weather yet, Maybe by then I will have found and fixed it. Last edited by gearloose; 02-18-2011 at 10:10 PM.

02-18-2011, 10:01 PM	#19
gearloose Member Join Date: Aug 2010 Location: South Berwick,Maine Posts: 59	Re: Engine runs worse when spark is advanced Bratton's catalog has a picture of the cap under "ignition timing tools"

02-18-2011, 11:54 PM	#20
Bruce Adams Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Northport, NY Posts: 1,597	Re: Engine runs worse when spark is advanced What happens if you take up the slop by turning the cam clockwise until the points JUST CLOSE at TDC? Then set the timing at that location while at TDC. That eliminates slop, I guess the lazy way. BTW, you DID set the points with the lever at full retard, right? Were it me, I would just try retarding the spark a bit and see if that "fixes" the problem without getting to introspective about WHY it fixed the problem.