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Old 01-20-2017, 12:33 PM   #1
millersgarage
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Default 1933-34 patch panel installation question

I am putting on rocker and lower front quarter panels.

The rockers extend beyond the B pillar. Am I supposed to trim it and butt weld the seam to the quarter patch, or does the quarter patch wrap around the rocker?
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Old 01-20-2017, 07:02 PM   #2
johnboy34
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Default Re: 1933-34 patch panel installation question

The factory has a joint at the end of the front and rear quarter. I left them about a 1/2 inch inside each and welded top and bottom, just like my sedan was before. Planning to fill with body sealer after epoxy primer.
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Old 01-20-2017, 09:22 PM   #3
millersgarage
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Default Re: 1933-34 patch panel installation question

Thanks for the photo. This area of my Cabrio' was completely rotted away.

So there is a seam at the B pillar?
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Old 01-20-2017, 09:58 PM   #4
DavidG
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Default Re: 1933-34 patch panel installation question

Seams at both the B pillar and at the tail of the cowl moulding.
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Old 01-20-2017, 10:58 PM   #5
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Default Re: 1933-34 patch panel installation question

I'm not sure about all body styles, but I know that the seams are not in exactly the same places on certain models -- so what might be one way on a 3W, may not be the same on a Cabriolet. I can't say for sure, but you should research your particular body style.
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Old 01-21-2017, 10:40 AM   #6
millersgarage
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Default Re: 1933-34 patch panel installation question

again, I am not asking about seams, but the build up of the panels themselves.
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Old 01-21-2017, 11:23 AM   #7
johnboy34
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Default Re: 1933-34 patch panel installation question

I made the bottom B pillar bracket, bottom half of inner rocker. Here's a couple more pics. The rockers are different lengths (as are the doors) for different body styles, as is the lower rear quarter from door to wheel well. The seams on the front lower cowl should be in the same place.
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Old 01-23-2017, 03:42 PM   #8
BrianCT
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Default Re: 1933-34 patch panel installation question

34 Cabrio seams
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Old 01-25-2017, 09:16 AM   #9
millersgarage
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Default Re: 1933-34 patch panel installation question

thank you @BrianCT

exactly what I was looking for.
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Old 01-25-2017, 10:30 AM   #10
David J
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Default Re: 1933-34 patch panel installation question

This is a 33 5w with original paint . Rockers go over recessed lips on cowl and quarter . As you can see the finishing is not real nice .
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Old 01-25-2017, 10:49 AM   #11
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Default Re: 1933-34 patch panel installation question

David J's 33 5 window original paint pictures are very interesting.

I am curious if someone were doing a "concours" type restoration would
the seams be made "pretty" or left as original?
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Old 01-25-2017, 11:42 AM   #12
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Default Re: 1933-34 patch panel installation question

Maybe DavidG will chime back in on your question as he judges stuff I think .

Here's a 33 [ black ] and a 34 [ maroon ] original paint sedan front seams and they are sloppy also .

Quote:
Originally Posted by barnfind View Post
David J's 33 5 window original paint pictures are very interesting.

I am curious if someone were doing a "concours" type restoration would
the seams be made "pretty" or left as original?
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Old 01-25-2017, 12:35 PM   #13
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Default Re: 1933-34 patch panel installation question

I've had more than my fair share of '33s and '34s and none of them have had joints as sloppy as those on David's coupe. I believe that Brian's example is the most representative of both manufacturing intent and actual practice in the vast majority of the cars.

I have two '33 concours restorations in final assembly at present and both bodies required the usual '33-'34 rocker panel replacement. The seams are as original (like Brian's). I'm sure David would agree that no one would likely want to use his coupe's seams as a model, no matter that they are also totally original.

As for judging (at Early Ford V8 Club national meets), the average judge might not observe the absence or presence of those seams given how much ground they have to cover in a limited amount of time.
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Old 01-25-2017, 12:50 PM   #14
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Default Re: 1933-34 patch panel installation question

David ,

Thought you might like those . You saw that car in person but we probably didn't look at the seams .

The 33 and 34 sedan ones are better but not like Brians example . His are about as clean as I have seen .

AND NO I would not use the 33 5w as a pattern either but I kinda like it like that so it is staying just as it is .
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Old 01-25-2017, 02:07 PM   #15
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Default Re: 1933-34 patch panel installation question

Here's another shot of a original car ,rockers come with a reases on the A pillar end. I always thought they slid under, this shows in David js B piller picture .
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Old 01-25-2017, 02:20 PM   #16
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Default Re: 1933-34 patch panel installation question

Ted's photo shows extensive metal finishing above the joint vertical joint. In the two photos below of a '34 roadster body in white, note the obvious metal finishing solder (lead) on either side of the joint which speaks to the intent. Clearly this step was missed on David J's '33 coupe when the body was manufactured.
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Old 01-26-2017, 07:57 AM   #17
millersgarage
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Default Re: 1933-34 patch panel installation question

interesting.
So the seams are soldered?
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Old 01-26-2017, 08:25 AM   #18
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Default Re: 1933-34 patch panel installation question

On my original 34 Ford Fourdoor, the seams were leaded/soldered at both the front and back.
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Old 01-26-2017, 08:58 AM   #19
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Default Re: 1933-34 patch panel installation question

The lead/tin solder was the form of filler used at the time. Major structure has to be welded in some form or riveted to hold the structure. Brazing was used by some manufacturers but Ford didn't seem to use it much. The body solder was just to smooth out the finish prior to paint.
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Old 01-26-2017, 09:11 AM   #20
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Default Re: 1933-34 patch panel installation question

The seams on the roadster in the photos weren't filled with solder, only the areas immediately adjacent to the seams. Fordors and phaetons were treated differently with only a single seam at the cowl/rocker panel joint showing or in at least one case as noted above, no exposed seams.
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