The Ford Barn

asapguy · 08-15-2018, 06:28 PM

Approx. 4 yrs ago I had to replace the head gasket on my Model B motor in my Cabriolet with the modern style gasket, it blew between #1 & 2. It's been fine until last week I noticed water in the oil, but it still ran fine. When I got the head off I noticed the steel ring around the combustion chamber on # 2 cyl. was eaten away with rust allowing water to enter the cyl. The water was coming from one of the two steam hole that is only in B motors at that point. After replacing the previous gasket I did torque 3 times. When doing a search on the Ford Barn I see it is recommended to plug those holes in the block & head. My question is can J-B Weld be used successfully. They are 1/4 inch holes & could be threaded to 5/16 but this would require drilling out the holes. I'm afraid trying to tap the hole with a 5/16 tap might crack the block. Has anyone used just J-B Weld?? Thanks in advance. Perry

40 Deluxe · 08-15-2018, 06:50 PM

Perhaps a metric tap would fit the existing hole.

briphaeton · 08-15-2018, 07:23 PM

7 mm

Tanglfoot · 08-15-2018, 10:07 PM

I used 8mm grub screws works fine no need to drill. The trick is not to tap in too far with a taper tap then the plug will lock in the hole, file flush.

asapguy · 08-16-2018, 01:02 AM

Thanks I'll make a trip to town tomorrow, we have a hardware store that has a good selection of metric sizes. Hopefully they'll have a tap & some Allen screws that size. I have dozens of used blocks, some with cracks to experiment on.

jim1932 · 08-16-2018, 11:28 AM

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Quote:

Originally Posted by asapguy

Approx. 4 yrs ago I had to replace the head gasket on my Model B motor in my Cabriolet with the modern style gasket, it blew between #1 & 2. It's been fine until last week I noticed water in the oil, but it still ran fine. When I got the head off I noticed the steel ring around the combustion chamber on # 2 cyl. was eaten away with rust allowing water to enter the cyl. The water was coming from one of the two steam hole that is only in B motors at that point. After replacing the previous gasket I did torque 3 times. When doing a search on the Ford Barn I see it is recommended to plug those holes in the block & head. My question is can J-B Weld be used successfully. They are 1/4 inch holes & could be threaded to 5/16 but this would require drilling out the holes. I'm afraid trying to tap the hole with a 5/16 tap might crack the block. Has anyone used just J-B Weld?? Thanks in advance. Perry

Are you also running a B head?

asapguy · 08-16-2018, 11:42 AM

Yes it's a complete B engine. What may have facilitated the gasket going bad was that the car sat for over 6 months after I was in very bad car accident in my Jeep & unable to drive. The water seeping from that hole probably ate at the steel ring around the combustion chamber. Normally I drive this Model A regularly all year long for club events & mtgs.

Jim Brierley · 08-16-2018, 12:27 PM

The plug must be flush with the top deck. Plugging and filing is probably the best thing to do but it is hard to file without scarring the deck. Put plug in a little deep and fill with JB Weld work just as well. JB Weld by itself is risky because it needs support.

asapguy · 08-16-2018, 12:53 PM

Thanks Jim. I went back & read several previous threads concerning this issue. One other person had the same issue after his car sat for two yrs. I have several new modern gaskets on hand & three new copper ones. I may go back to copper I have one that has part # 6051 & doesn't have the steam holes in it. This should be OK with holes filled. Checked my Ford parts book for correct #'s. A 6051-A = head gasket pass. & comm. 28-31, B 6051-A = head gasket pass. & comm. 32-34. Ironically it then says A 6051-A is replaced by B-6051-A. This would indicates Ford OKed the use of a B gasket on a Model A. Which s/b OK.

Charlie Stephens · 08-16-2018, 01:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by asapguy

Yes it's a complete B engine. What may have facilitated the gasket going bad was that the car sat for over 6 months after I was in very bad car accident in my Jeep & unable to drive. The water seeping from that hole probably ate at the steel ring around the combustion chamber. Normally I drive this Model A regularly all year long for club events & mtgs.

If you have a complete B engine including the head you shouldn't have a problem. Are you trying to run a Model A gasket which would be a problem?

Charlie Stephens

asapguy · 08-16-2018, 01:22 PM

No I was running a modern style B gasket with the steam holes, B block & B head. I think what happened is exactly like Bob Bionde mentioned happened to him after his car sat for two yrs with modern gasket. The silicon deteriorated around one of the holes that allowed water to seep against steel rim which then rusted. My car sat & wasn't driven for 6-7 months. I could just install a new modern gasket which I have but if the car sits for a long period again I run the risk of the same problem.

john in illinois · 08-16-2018, 03:09 PM

The silcone gaskets have a very poor track record. I have had good luck with Best brand graphtite gaskets. The Best copper gaskets are also said to be good.

John

asapguy · 08-16-2018, 08:54 PM

Taped & plugged the holes in the head & the block with 8MM Allen screws. No drilling needed just taped the holes. Screwed them in just below the surface a covered holes with JB Weld. After the JB Weld cures I'll sand flat & install a copper gasket w/o steam holes. Something I forgot to mention that is important if you don't already know this take note!! I installed new hardened studs when I replaced the gasket a few yrs, ago. The long stud for the dist. cable clamp is longer and this is what I didn't know. You must install the clamp before you install the nut. What I did was to install the nut, torque it several times after running it for awhile. Then I installed the clamp & installed a half nut to hold clamp. When I removed the head nuts that stud came out with the nut which had bottomed out on the threads. The threads are to short to allow proper torque to the head. The reason I did this is on another car I have I removed the clamp to work on the dist. & with the nut off just that one head bolt water leaked into the oil. You could also cut a few more thread in that long stud to correct this problem. I have heard others had this same problem so something to think about.

daren007 · 08-17-2018, 07:47 AM

Do not use countersunk screws. Don't ask me why I know this. Use a Best graphite gasket with copercoat spray and you are golden.

08-15-2018, 06:50 PM	#2
40 Deluxe Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: now Kuna, Idaho Posts: 3,778	Re: Filling Model B steam holes Perhaps a metric tap would fit the existing hole.

08-15-2018, 07:23 PM	#3
briphaeton Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2012 Posts: 241	Re: Filling Model B steam holes 7 mm

08-15-2018, 10:07 PM	#4
Tanglfoot Member Join Date: Jan 2013 Location: Mangawhai NZ Posts: 66	Re: Filling Model B steam holes I used 8mm grub screws works fine no need to drill. The trick is not to tap in too far with a taper tap then the plug will lock in the hole, file flush.

08-16-2018, 01:02 AM	#5
asapguy Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Snohomish Wa. Posts: 389	Re: Filling Model B steam holes Thanks I'll make a trip to town tomorrow, we have a hardware store that has a good selection of metric sizes. Hopefully they'll have a tap & some Allen screws that size. I have dozens of used blocks, some with cracks to experiment on.

08-16-2018, 11:42 AM	#7
asapguy Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Snohomish Wa. Posts: 389	Re: Filling Model B steam holes Yes it's a complete B engine. What may have facilitated the gasket going bad was that the car sat for over 6 months after I was in very bad car accident in my Jeep & unable to drive. The water seeping from that hole probably ate at the steel ring around the combustion chamber. Normally I drive this Model A regularly all year long for club events & mtgs. Last edited by asapguy; 08-16-2018 at 11:53 AM.

08-15-2018, 06:28 PM	#1
asapguy Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Snohomish Wa. Posts: 389	Filling Model B steam holes Approx. 4 yrs ago I had to replace the head gasket on my Model B motor in my Cabriolet with the modern style gasket, it blew between #1 & 2. It's been fine until last week I noticed water in the oil, but it still ran fine. When I got the head off I noticed the steel ring around the combustion chamber on # 2 cyl. was eaten away with rust allowing water to enter the cyl. The water was coming from one of the two steam hole that is only in B motors at that point. After replacing the previous gasket I did torque 3 times. When doing a search on the Ford Barn I see it is recommended to plug those holes in the block & head. My question is can J-B Weld be used successfully. They are 1/4 inch holes & could be threaded to 5/16 but this would require drilling out the holes. I'm afraid trying to tap the hole with a 5/16 tap might crack the block. Has anyone used just J-B Weld?? Thanks in advance. Perry Last edited by asapguy; 08-15-2018 at 08:30 PM.

08-16-2018, 12:27 PM	#8
Jim Brierley Senior Member Join Date: Jun 2010 Location: Temecula, CA Posts: 4,085	Re: Filling Model B steam holes The plug must be flush with the top deck. Plugging and filing is probably the best thing to do but it is hard to file without scarring the deck. Put plug in a little deep and fill with JB Weld work just as well. JB Weld by itself is risky because it needs support.

08-16-2018, 12:53 PM	#9
asapguy Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Snohomish Wa. Posts: 389	Re: Filling Model B steam holes Thanks Jim. I went back & read several previous threads concerning this issue. One other person had the same issue after his car sat for two yrs. I have several new modern gaskets on hand & three new copper ones. I may go back to copper I have one that has part # 6051 & doesn't have the steam holes in it. This should be OK with holes filled. Checked my Ford parts book for correct #'s. A 6051-A = head gasket pass. & comm. 28-31, B 6051-A = head gasket pass. & comm. 32-34. Ironically it then says A 6051-A is replaced by B-6051-A. This would indicates Ford OKed the use of a B gasket on a Model A. Which s/b OK. Last edited by asapguy; 08-16-2018 at 01:54 PM.

08-16-2018, 01:22 PM	#11
asapguy Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Snohomish Wa. Posts: 389	Re: Filling Model B steam holes No I was running a modern style B gasket with the steam holes, B block & B head. I think what happened is exactly like Bob Bionde mentioned happened to him after his car sat for two yrs with modern gasket. The silicon deteriorated around one of the holes that allowed water to seep against steel rim which then rusted. My car sat & wasn't driven for 6-7 months. I could just install a new modern gasket which I have but if the car sits for a long period again I run the risk of the same problem.

08-16-2018, 08:54 PM	#13
asapguy Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Snohomish Wa. Posts: 389	Re: Filling Model B steam holes Taped & plugged the holes in the head & the block with 8MM Allen screws. No drilling needed just taped the holes. Screwed them in just below the surface a covered holes with JB Weld. After the JB Weld cures I'll sand flat & install a copper gasket w/o steam holes. Something I forgot to mention that is important if you don't already know this take note!! I installed new hardened studs when I replaced the gasket a few yrs, ago. The long stud for the dist. cable clamp is longer and this is what I didn't know. You must install the clamp before you install the nut. What I did was to install the nut, torque it several times after running it for awhile. Then I installed the clamp & installed a half nut to hold clamp. When I removed the head nuts that stud came out with the nut which had bottomed out on the threads. The threads are to short to allow proper torque to the head. The reason I did this is on another car I have I removed the clamp to work on the dist. & with the nut off just that one head bolt water leaked into the oil. You could also cut a few more thread in that long stud to correct this problem. I have heard others had this same problem so something to think about.

08-17-2018, 07:47 AM	#14
daren007 Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2015 Location: Saint Cloud Mn Posts: 745	Re: Filling Model B steam holes Do not use countersunk screws. Don't ask me why I know this. Use a Best graphite gasket with copercoat spray and you are golden.