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04-18-2021, 08:46 AM | #1 |
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Batt. Supercharger
does anyone out there run a Batt Supercharger on there model A? I have had one for years, it is damaged on the inside. so I never installed it. another FB member contacted me about mine and to let me know that he has one with no inner parts. so the question is, does someone out there have a complete one and is running it?
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04-18-2021, 03:56 PM | #2 |
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Re: Batt. Supercharger
That thing seems pretty unique. It would nice to hear from someone if it actually works. Looks like its suppose to get the intake air spinning.
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04-18-2021, 10:01 PM | #3 |
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Re: Batt. Supercharger
Brad in Maryland Last edited by Brad in Germany; 04-20-2021 at 09:36 PM. |
04-19-2021, 08:12 AM | #4 |
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Re: Batt. Supercharger
I thought about posting that ad from the Fahnestock book myself, but annoyingly it doesn't say anything about how the product is supposed to work.
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04-19-2021, 11:19 AM | #5 | |
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Re: Batt. Supercharger
Quote:
David Serrano |
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04-19-2021, 11:30 AM | #6 |
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Re: Batt. Supercharger
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04-19-2021, 11:33 AM | #7 |
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Re: Batt. Supercharger
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04-19-2021, 11:43 AM | #8 |
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Re: Batt. Supercharger
I looked up the patent and it's for the hourglass-shaped component visible in the second image attached to post #1. Apparently that's the entire product, there are no other parts. It's supposed to "break up particles of hydrocarbons and mix them with the air more thoroughly than is done in the mixing chamber of an ordinary carburetor and prevent quantities of the liquid from accumulating on the walls of the intake manifold."
You can see from the diagram and from the component photos that it's not really a Venturi-type device. The tube has a consistent I.D., it just has this hourglass device inside it. The theory apparently is that the fuel-air mixture passing through the tube would be induced to atomize more uniformly via these fins. This was patented in '26 and, in my view, would be vulnerable to obsolescence from improvements in carburetor design. Quite likely it's unnecessary, especially if running a more advanced carb such as the Marvel. |
04-19-2021, 11:46 AM | #9 |
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Re: Batt. Supercharger
Kinda reminds me of what W C Fields had to say.
But, I kinda like the design/looks of the manifold itself. |
04-19-2021, 12:21 PM | #10 |
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Re: Batt. Supercharger
When I first saw that I thought it was an earlier version of the "Turbonator" Air Intake Booster.
https://www.ebay.com/itm/11243285698...b89976112d4b36 I first heard of the "Bat" Super-Charger in 'Those Wonderful UNAUTHORIZED ACCESSORIES for Model A Ford' book. Find on Page 80. Last edited by Y-Blockhead; 04-19-2021 at 02:03 PM. |
04-19-2021, 02:17 PM | #11 |
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Re: Batt. Supercharger
Like JW Hash mentioned. I am running a Bat Supercharger on my 28 Roadster without the inner cone. I tried to post an image but for some reason it won't let me select a file from my computer.
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04-19-2021, 08:12 PM | #12 |
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Re: Batt. Supercharger
Sooo, what do you think? Improve performance? Improve gas mileage? Just looks cool, and a great conversation starter at car events?
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04-19-2021, 08:27 PM | #13 |
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Re: Batt. Supercharger
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04-19-2021, 08:40 PM | #14 |
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Re: Batt. Supercharger
No notable change in performance. Looks cool. I carry the advertisement from "Those Wonderful Unauthorized Accessories" with me. I am also running a high compression head and 3.27 rear end but I give the Bat all the credit when I'm talking to the non-"A" folks. I also include a line of smoke about the red striped coil wire that I use.
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04-19-2021, 08:50 PM | #15 |
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Re: Batt. Supercharger
Yep...That's about it. Just an adornment. The inner cone might make a difference. I suppose one could be fabricated. I doubt it would live up to the claims in the advertisement.
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04-19-2021, 11:39 PM | #16 |
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Re: Batt. Supercharger
"Bat" Super-Charger |
04-20-2021, 12:16 PM | #17 |
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Re: Batt. Supercharger
When I first read the title I thought this thread was about Battery Chargers.
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04-20-2021, 12:55 PM | #18 |
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Re: Batt. Supercharger
I think the theory is sound. The fact the manifold is enlarged to compensate for the houreglass device should prevent any choking effect at partial throttle and increase fuel mixing at wide open throttle. I'm pretty sure the turbin is stationary.
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04-20-2021, 01:31 PM | #19 |
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Re: Batt. Supercharger
People have been suckers for "fuel saving" gadgets for about as long as cars have existed. The list is endless, but a couple that stick out in my mind are the mythical 100 MPG carburetor and the more recent "HHO" hydrogen producing gadgets that scammers promote.
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04-20-2021, 02:17 PM | #20 |
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Re: Batt. Supercharger
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04-20-2021, 03:32 PM | #21 |
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Re: Batt. Supercharger
If the bore was not enlarged for the turbine, i would discount any benefit, but this one takes into account preserving the venturi area. I'd love to try one anyway.
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04-20-2021, 03:48 PM | #22 |
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Re: Batt. Supercharger
I am concerned about the vanes of the inner cone breaking of and being sucked into the valves and cylinders. They look like they are made from a thin sheet of brass.
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04-20-2021, 04:14 PM | #23 |
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Re: Batt. Supercharger
Well, first of all, there is no proof that such gadgets do work. With the "100 MPG carb", the myths are always vague; it seemed that someone's uncle's third cousin's barber heard stories down at the corner bar and the myth grew from there. Wild conspiracy theories are repeated instead of hard facts, no real evidence proves such wild claims! Heard of the Fish Carburetor? The myth says it was a 100 MPG carb. In reality, the inventor only claimed "up to 20% better fuel mileage". The typical car of the day got maybe 15 MPG; 20 MPG was seldom seen. So it was really a 18-24 MPG carb at best. Tens of thousands were built and sold by the Fish Carburetor Company, and they still show up on ebay so anyone can buy one and test it for themselves. Fish made enough money to sponsor a NASCAR car in the mid-'50's. But he never claimed 100 MPG. As far as the "HHO" scam goes, it too is unworkable. The claim is that you can use electrical current from the alternator, pass it through a set of metal plates in a jar of water, and make hydrogen as you drive. Supposedly this gives magical fuel economy! Not true! It takes power to get electricity from the alternator. It takes extra gasoline to get the extra power, resulting in a net loss! Don't forget: A car engine is only about 20-25% efficient, and an alternator is 50% efficient at best. So a lot of the gasoline burned is wasted as heat. A gallon of gasoline has about 120,000 Btu's of energy. A gallon-sized container of hydrogen at ambient temperature and pressure contains about 42 Btu's! A typical HHO unit makes 1 to 2 liters of "HHO" a minute. "HHO" is 1/3 oxygen so that leaves 28 Btu's in our gallon of HHO and we only make about 1/2 gallon a minute. So there is not enough "HHO" produced to make any improvement!! It's all smoke and mirrors! |
04-20-2021, 07:01 PM | #24 |
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Re: Batt. Supercharger
Modern fuel injection and electronic ignition all with computer control gets the economy about as good as it gets and same with performance. To put a swirl tube device in the plenum likely doesn't help the vaporization all that much. The amount is likely just above negligible due to the amount of blockage drag there is in there. (One might help a bit while the other affect detracts a bit). It's most likely affect on economy would have been slowing down the fuel mixture to a degree that may have given a slightly better burn. The way a flathead is made, there is already enough chaos going on inside the cylinder to create a good burn but with the low compression, it also loses out a bit on performance.
Now an actual turbocharger might get the performance up a bit but then the economy would likely go down a bit too. It's always a trade off somewhere with these old flat motors. |
04-20-2021, 07:09 PM | #25 |
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Re: Batt. Supercharger
BatInstall copy.jpeg
Still no luck with posting picture. |
04-21-2021, 03:15 AM | #26 |
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Re: Batt. Supercharger
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04-21-2021, 07:36 AM | #27 |
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Re: Batt. Supercharger
https://www.fordbarn.com/forum/attac...3&d=1558465006
Here is a link from a previous post where I was able to upload a picture. |
04-21-2021, 07:40 AM | #28 |
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Re: Batt. Supercharger
Russ
the hourglass turbine devise just float inside. it looks to me that when the air goes through it, it could rotate. i have always thought it was like the old snake oil salesman. but to me it is just cool to look at. |
04-21-2021, 10:02 AM | #29 |
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Re: Batt. Supercharger
If it actually spins, you would think it would make quite a racket.
Would someone send one to me for testing |
04-21-2021, 11:12 AM | #30 |
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Re: Batt. Supercharger
Would the extra length of the manifold have an effect? Sort of the same theory of a high rise manifold. I don't see any notable performance from an original manifold.
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04-21-2021, 12:21 PM | #31 |
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Re: Batt. Supercharger
I doubt the 'turbine' rotates. I think its suppose to sit there and get the fuel/air charge to spin as the charge passes thru it and enhance the flow/charge into the cylinders.
The manifold design could in itself [without the turbine] enhance the cylinder charging. If I had one I think I'd leave out the turbine. |
04-21-2021, 06:29 PM | #32 |
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Re: Batt. Supercharger
It would cause a swirl or vortex in the air/fuel flow. My problem with it is the hour glass shape would redirect the vortex and hinder the flow more. A plain swirl tube would likely have been more effective but even that may hinder the mixture from staying in a good vaporized state. Some of the vapor may form into larger droplets instead of a nice even vapor flow.
These type of things were also developed for OHV engines as well and all it would really do is allow for a bit slower burn in the cylinder. This might reduce detonation but it won't do much for performance. |
04-23-2021, 11:19 AM | #33 |
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Re: Batt. Supercharger
Here's another attempt at "fuel/air enhancement", this was for the flathead V8s:
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04-23-2021, 02:29 PM | #34 | |
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Re: Batt. Supercharger
Quote:
The browns gas generator actually works, a friend powered his Vw beetle with it. The car did burn to the ground from and electrical fire,and the generator was ungainly...but I saw it with my own highly skeptical eyes.. |
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04-24-2021, 03:53 PM | #35 |
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Re: Batt. Supercharger
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04-25-2021, 10:31 AM | #36 |
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Re: Batt. Supercharger
From the comment about the "ungainly" generator, I assume it was significantly larger than stock. Which means it took more power from the engine to spin it. Using more power means using more gasoline. The result is a net loss! While he no doubt made some "Brown's gas", it would not be enough to offset the extra gasoline used to produce it. Wishful thinking does not replace science! |
04-26-2021, 12:42 PM | #37 |
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Re: Batt. Supercharger
Isn't there some law of physics that says "energy can neither be created or destroyed"?
Or simply stated, no free lunch. |
04-26-2021, 01:03 PM | #38 |
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Re: Batt. Supercharger
This might be just confusion of terms... in most cases you wouldn't put the HHO generator itself in the car. You generate the HHO via AC power and then you keep the HHO in an onboard tank. So it's basically a CNG conversion.
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04-26-2021, 02:56 PM | #39 | |
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Re: Batt. Supercharger
Quote:
No, I don't think so! It takes a very special (very expensive) compressor to reach the high pressures needed to store enough hydrogen to get out of your driveway. And special high pressure tanks that won't be damaged by hydrogen embrittlement. Since hydrogen has such low energy density. the tanks needed would be huge. Actually, the "HHO" systems in common use are on-board generators that only make miniscule amounts of hydrogen as you drive, using the vehicle's alternator for the electricity needed. This scam seems to have died out in recent years, but just wait until gas goes over $4 a gallon again! |
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04-26-2021, 04:19 PM | #40 | |
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Re: Batt. Supercharger
Quote:
You have confused me. So it does work or doesn't it work??
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01-25-2022, 03:58 PM | #41 | |
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Re: Batt. Supercharger
Quote:
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01-25-2022, 05:15 PM | #42 |
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Re: Batt. Supercharger
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01-25-2022, 06:04 PM | #43 |
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Re: Batt. Supercharger
I have no idea if a hydrogen generator improves mileage but the principle is that the hydrogen gas improves combustion. I think that is generally true because hydrogen is very combustible and will burn with a wide range of air/fuel ratios. It is correct that the energy it takes to generate the hydrogen is not recovered when it is burned. But I don't think that is the point. The fact that the car manufacturers do not put this on their cars speaks for itself.
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01-26-2022, 08:53 AM | #44 | |
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Re: Batt. Supercharger
Quote:
I remember a TV show back in the late 50's/early 60's called "Strange But True". At least I think that was what it was called. Anyway, it was a supposedly true story about a guy. Who convinced a high US government official (Supreme Court Justice ?). To drain the gas out of his car, add ordinary tap water and then place a mysterious tablet in the gas tank. The car started and ran and the official drove it to work. Before he left the unknown man said he would be back later to tell how he invented the tablet. He never came back. This supposedly happened in the early 20's. Bob-A |
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01-26-2022, 09:11 AM | #45 |
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Re: Batt. Supercharger
Hydrogen is highly explosive, corrosive and I believe also creates acid conditions when made.
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01-26-2022, 09:13 AM | #46 | ||
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Re: Batt. Supercharger
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https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gasoline_pill Quote:
Quote:
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01-26-2022, 01:28 PM | #47 |
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Re: Batt. Supercharger
Time traveler Charles Elton.
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01-28-2022, 01:29 PM | #48 |
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Re: Batt. Supercharger
If all this stuff worked it would have already have installed by the auto manufacturer. It works like this. The one with the best gas mileage wins all the marbles.
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01-28-2022, 05:17 PM | #49 |
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Re: Batt. Supercharger
Why not applaud them for taking the time, cost and effort to reproduce a verified period accessory? We complain about poor quality, things not being produced, or too expensive. If suppliers read this forum for input, they wouldn't want to produce anything!
Let's give Mike's recognition for reproducing one more item that fit our cars! |
02-07-2022, 02:54 PM | #50 | |
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Re: Batt. Supercharger
Quote:
They plan to test the new ones and attempt to quantify the improvements. Once the results are in, I'll be taking a closer look. |
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