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Old 05-22-2019, 01:30 PM   #21
bucket-o-rust
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Default Re: STP and Transmission: any negative experience ?

I agree with Bill learn to shift correctly and have evey thing in your car set up correctly and you will have no problems shifting. And if you think you need to double clutch then you have some kind of problem and it is not oil. 600 wt has always worked for me. Sometimes people that do not know how to shift need someone that knows how to shift teach them how to shift.
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Old 05-22-2019, 02:06 PM   #22
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Default Re: STP and Transmission: any negative experience ?

Thank's Dick for clarifying.
Dan, if you don't have an instruction Manual here is the link for a pdf of one. All these lever positions and setting the idle is covered in it. We all learn as we go. Chap
http://motormayhem.net/wp-uploads/20...ion-Manual.pdf
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Old 05-22-2019, 03:07 PM   #23
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Default Re: STP and Transmission: any negative experience ?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dick Steinkamp View Post
I think chap means the RIGHT hand lever (the throttle).

If your A is timed correctly, you will want the left hand lever (spark advance) below the middle while driving. Better performance and easier on the engine.
Thank you. Yes, I wrote right hand lever. The club technician of the club checked the timing too and it was perfect. They also told me to drive the A fully advance based on my timing. And from that day I am doing that. Previously I was half way down.

Cheers
Daniel

Last edited by Forddan; 05-22-2019 at 03:50 PM.
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Old 05-22-2019, 03:10 PM   #24
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Default Re: STP and Transmission: any negative experience ?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Terry, NJ View Post
I think I've read in a couple of places that Bratton's or somebody, maybe every vendor was mixing 50/50 600 with STP. If that's true, you're all using it anyway. As for STP not being a lubricant, Take the test! With a straight blade screwdriver, dip the tip in STP. Now try to hold it by the tip! Betcha can't do it!. Terry
Ja, ja,... this is a very slippery test.
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Old 05-22-2019, 03:17 PM   #25
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Default Re: STP and Transmission: any negative experience ?

Quote:
Originally Posted by chap52 View Post
Thank's Dick for clarifying.
Dan, if you don't have an instruction Manual here is the link for a pdf of one. All these lever positions and setting the idle is covered in it. We all learn as we go. Chap
http://motormayhem.net/wp-uploads/20...ion-Manual.pdf
This forum is fantastic and you all are soo nice.

Thank you for the info. Is good to have this link.

I have a new copy of the manual in my car and I was able to get an original 1929 for my collection.

I do agree 100 % with the latest comments. Still I need more experience, no discussion at all. My intention is to help that inexperience, probably by improving the gear oil. In other posts I have read about people adding less heavy oil or shifting without clutching, etc. I bet my name that those drivers have many, many years of experience. Could be one day I will achieve it. In the meantime, I am trying to provide the best condition to my gears so i can only focus on improving my expertise.

Cheers
Daniel

Last edited by Forddan; 05-22-2019 at 03:28 PM.
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Old 05-22-2019, 03:27 PM   #26
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Default Re: STP and Transmission: any negative experience ?

Let me introduce my 1929 Tudor





Best
Daniel - Forddan-
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Old 05-22-2019, 03:54 PM   #27
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Default Re: STP and Transmission: any negative experience ?

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When did they start putting brass components into Model A transmissions?

I can't think of a one.

STP now 100% and about 30 years. No adverse effects. Of course I don't drive cross country in the car. And I have noticed STP is a little "slow" at first when its below freezing - but so was the 600W.

I may be corrected, but STP in my estimation is probably the "original" synthetic oil - engineered for consistency of viscosity no matter the temperature. That is their selling point as it "holds up" and augments a thinner lubricant.

I believe I have STP in my John Deere 110 tractor - which has a lot of commonality with the Model A transmission - straight cut gears, no synchros. But John Deere wanted all of outdoors and my first born child for the quart of JD branded gear oil for this application. But JD is like that. What the market (and market ignorance) will bear.

Tranny (both of them) still going strong.

Joe K
Hi, On The Early Cluster Gear at each end, Brass/Bronze.. Until 1929
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Old 05-22-2019, 05:41 PM   #28
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Default Re: STP and Transmission: any negative experience ?

check the archives in MARC for Roger Kauffman the Tech advisor for many years. He had a '30 pickup he ran for years, all over the US and used 100% STP in the steering box, transmission and rear end.
He opened them up after 50 k miles and the fluid was clear and everything was operating properly.
A pretty good real life testimonial in my view.
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Old 05-22-2019, 06:35 PM   #29
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Default Re: STP and Transmission: any negative experience ?

The reverse idler bushing is likely phosphor bronze. I have one of the early transmissions in my A that has the thrust washers. ZDDP is an EP additive with zinc and phosphate that is designed to eat in to the cam and tappet faces in order to act as a sacrificial coating to protect the cam components from uneven wear. It is mildly acidic and can act on the few soft metals in a sliding gear type unit. I don't think it was in the original STP oil treatment from the 1960s as Studebaker Tech Products originally formulated it.

Anyone that describes SAE 140 gear lube as thin hasn't had a bath in it yet. This is a link to Mobil 600W cylinder oil specs.https://www.mobil.com/English-US/Ind...-Cylinder-Oils
This is a link to a viscosity comparison chart. https://www.acculube.com/lubricant-viscosity.html
If you look at Mobil's spec on standard 600W you will see that it is somewhere between the beginning of the SAE 140 range and ISO 460. The Super Cylinder oil is ISO 460. Those above that are out of the 600W range. Even ISO 680 is at the high end of the SAE 140 range.

I realize that this is a plain old sliding dog & gear transmission but that cluster will slow down just fine in the viscosities below SAE 250. If folks want to use a viscosity builder for a gear lube, far be it from me to stop them but is is not a gear lube unless it is mixed with one. The Model A crash box was built with some of the best steel Ford could make at the time and it is a testament to how much they could take from just about anyone with any kind of perceived lubricant put inside of it. It probably would run just fine with John Deere Corn header gearbox lube inside. It damn sure wouldn't leak.
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Old 05-22-2019, 06:39 PM   #30
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Default Re: STP and Transmission: any negative experience ?

Quote:
Originally Posted by d. View Post
check the archives in MARC for Roger Kauffman the Tech advisor for many years. He had a '30 pickup he ran for years, all over the US and used 100% STP in the steering box, transmission and rear end.
He opened them up after 50 k miles and the fluid was clear and everything was operating properly.
A pretty good real life testimonial in my view.
I read that in many posts, but I tried and failed to find those technicals archived files.

Can someone point me where I have to search ?

I did a lot of Google search with different keywords and only postings like yours were found. I failed to find the articles.

Thanks
Daniel
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Old 05-22-2019, 06:47 PM   #31
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Default Re: STP and Transmission: any negative experience ?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Forddan View Post
They also told me to drive the A fully advance based on my timing. And from that day I am doing that. Previously I was half way down.

Cheers
Daniel
Daniel,
So now you drive with the left lever (spark advance) all the way down, right?
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Old 05-22-2019, 07:02 PM   #32
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Default Re: STP and Transmission: any negative experience ?

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Originally Posted by F.M. View Post
Hi, On The Early Cluster Gear at each end, Brass/Bronze.. Until 1929
Hah! You got me there. March 1929 no gots.

Ah well, each to their own. Those who buy Cadillac NEVER regret the decision. Those who bought Yugo now wish they had bought TWO.

Back then they needed it. Not so much now except as investment.

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Old 05-22-2019, 07:54 PM   #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dick Steinkamp View Post
Daniel,
So now you drive with the left lever (spark advance) all the way down, right?
Correct !!

I have both levers up when I start the A. For driving I use the left (spark lever) all advanced. Car drives very well.

This weekend I drove it under a pretty nasty rain. And all went OK. I was very afraid of any issue due to water, but nothing happened. A woman wrote the club if someone nearby with a 1929 A could take her dad to a surprise party for his 90 years old. The dad is a car fan. I said that I will do it. Saturday was all sunny and Sunday was going to rain late afternoon. Well, all changes in 24 hours. At 10 AM the sky started to pour water. I already have the car out of the barn, so by 11 AM it was all soaked. Suddenly sun. I said now I go. 15' later it was worst. Fortunately I made it to the house. The guy was surprised. He jumped inside the car under the rain. I do not now if it was due to excitement or because it was raining a lot :-). We make it to the restaurant and stop raining. Sun out and 50 family members all around the A taking pictures with the 90 years old guy and a car of the same age. A lot of fun. My round trip was 60 miles. Not bad, mainly because 30 miles were under rain.

Sorry, this is out of topic. But I just wanted to tell it.

Cheers
Daniel Forddan

Last edited by Forddan; 05-22-2019 at 08:02 PM.
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Old 05-22-2019, 08:01 PM   #34
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Default Re: STP and Transmission: any negative experience ?

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Originally Posted by F.M. View Post
Hi, On The Early Cluster Gear at each end, Brass/Bronze.. Until 1929
Mine is from January 1929. Can I be relax about this aspect ?

Thanks
Daniel

Last edited by Forddan; 05-22-2019 at 08:13 PM.
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Old 05-22-2019, 08:08 PM   #35
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Default Re: STP and Transmission: any negative experience ?

Dan (Fordan) that looks like a very nice Tudor! Good Luck with her! The next gear lube I want to mention is Lucas Hub Oil, which is great for beginners, It won't leak out, It will stiffen up the tranny. So stiff in the winter you may find shifting difficult. The stuff is hard to find, lotta dealers don't have it. You can usually find it in truckstops. For your steering box, try John Deere Cornhead grease. Do not put a grease fitting on the box and pump it up till it's full! "Normal" greases will not run down into the gears. The gears will cavitate and just make a hole in the grease and never get on the teeth where the grease can do it's job. Cornhead grease never gets solid enough to not lube the gears. You'll wonder if it's grease or a heavy oil. $3 a tube at the JD dealership. Type in JD Cornhead grease and JD has a lot of info about it. Not for transmissions though. One more semi solution to the shifting problem is to park on a slope (with the left side down) And fill the transmission with just a little more oil. This gives the gears more liquid resistance. Just a little more, don't try to fill the case. Till you learn to shift, then get that extra oil out of here. Good Luck!
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Old 05-22-2019, 08:17 PM   #36
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Default Re: STP and Transmission: any negative experience ?

Hi Terry. I read about the JD grease/oil. I did not find any negative comment about it. I will go to JD site to read more about it. Thank you for the oil tip !!!

Thanks
Daniel
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Old 05-22-2019, 08:43 PM   #37
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Default Re: STP and Transmission: any negative experience ?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Forddan View Post
Correct !!

I have both levers up when I start the A. For driving I use the left (spark lever) all advanced. Car drives very well.
Mine too, Dan.
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Old 05-23-2019, 03:47 PM   #38
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Default Re: STP and Transmission: any negative experience ?

50/50 STP and Lucas oil stabilizer here. About 15k miles on it. I will probably go with 100% STP next as I do have some difficulty making quiet gear changes. Especially when someone is tailgating from a light and I am working on getting into second in an expedited manner. No ill effects that I can find from the STP though.
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Old 05-23-2019, 04:58 PM   #39
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Default Re: STP and Transmission: any negative experience ?

And there are those who have pointed out that current production of STP has bronze attacking additives.

My addition was from back in the "peel off the top" can days - no additive.

I think?

The old stuff is still out there (Ebay)



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Old 05-23-2019, 06:34 PM   #40
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Default Re: STP and Transmission: any negative experience ?

It MAY be ok, It MAY not be! Generally speaking, in 1930 (28, 29,) it was the place to have your timing lever. However, with the higher compression heads and oversized bores you may have to back off a few degrees or you get preignition and that will ruin your bearings . Have you done a compression test? Your head may be stock, or an aftermarket High Compression. Or just ground. Your cylinders may be as much as .125 oversize or 215 cu. in. as opposed to it's original 200.5 . This is an increase of 7% in horsepower, I don't know what it will increase the Comp. Ratio by. Does it have a large B or C cast into it? This would also indicate either a model B ( C ) or a police head ( B ). Both are higher compression than a stock A head. Normally, most people can hear pinging, I can't. If your engine pings, back the timing off till it stops while at speed on the highway. When climbing steep hills, back the timing off a few degrees. When running slow back it off a few degrees . Modern engines perform these operations automatically as did the later mod B 1932 - 1934. with a centrifical advance This timing stuff is controversial and it can be confusing and you will meet guys who tell you to set it and forget it. But the timing can be critical to engine life, gas mileage, and performance. For me, "set it and forget it" is not good enough.
Terry




Quote:
Originally Posted by Forddan View Post
Thank you. Yes, I wrote right hand lever. The club technician of the club checked the timing too and it was perfect. They also told me to drive the A fully advance based on my timing. And from that day I am doing that. Previously I was half way down.

Cheers
Daniel
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