Removed engine; some improvements?

[Werner]

Good evening all together.

Because the engine block crack can only be welded when removed, now the question of what should be done while this occasion.

I think to renew the clutch friction disk and the clutch pressure release bearing (1/4 inch radial clearance).

Are there any further suggestions?


Thanks in advance for helpin' sentence.

[jwilliams81]

Replace the engine mount rubber.

[Werner]

Hallo Williams,

I don't know ecactly; do you mean to replace the two front holder iron springs?
Thisone: https://www.macsautoparts.com/ford_m...a5089-kit.html ?

[1955cj5]

I think he may mean the pads between the original rear motor mounts and the frame.

https://www.brattons.com/motor-mount-pads.html


I would carefully check the condition of the front crankshaft pulley and replace if needed.

Also the pilot bearing located in the center of the flywheel..

https://www.brattons.com/pilot-or-fr...r-bearing.html


.

[Mike Peters]

Good time to inspect the starter ring gear on the flywheel.

[dansluck]

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If you replace the crankshaft pulley use a one piece one. I have had the two piece type fail. Engine looks clean. Good Luck!

[ryanheacox]

Also change the pilot bearing when you do the clutch. If the pressure plate has been balanced with the flywheel you might not want to change it unless it really needs it.

I would pull the transmission, inspect the gears and change the bearings. I didn't when I had my engine rebuilt and then I found myself pulling the transmission 1000 miles later to do a rebuild... would have been much easier with the engine already out. Not to mention it's easier to install the engine and transmission back into the car as a unit.

[Jim Brierley]

I prefer "stitching" the block rather than welding, and maybe it can be done without removing the engine if the crack is reachable. I just lube the throwout bearing, using a wheel bearing packer to force the grease in, same with pilot brg.

[Bob Bidonde]

Replace & rebuild:

Clutch Disc
Pressure Plate
Throw-Out Bearing
Transmission Pilot Bearing in Flywheel
Front Engine Mount Springs
Rubber Pads on Rear Engine Mounts
All Engine Gaskets
Camshaft Timing Gear
Distributor-Oil Pump Drive Gear
Original Valve Lifters
Rebuild Steering Gearbox
Fix Cracks in Front Cross-member
Starter Ring Gear

Starter Switch Rod Grommet

[sethkestenbaum]

Don't forget to clean and repaint the firewall and engine compartment if it needs it.

[abachman3]

If you are removing the water pump, replace the 4-studs with bolts. We use clutch housing-to-flywheel bolts, correct pitch and length. This makes it much easier to replace the water pump on the car for future maintenance without needing to remove the radiator.

[Brentwood Bob]

Gasket between the flywheel housing and the block.

[Werner]

Guten Abend,
many thanks for the great advices! I write what I think to do:

New friction disc.

Renew the clutch pressure bearing in the gear splines (wobble).

Renew the bearing that I can see in the middle of the pressure plate (rough).

All four rubber pads are missing, they were not mounted.

Oil pan off, perhaps due to grains of dirt from the crumbled camshaft wheel in front of the sieve of the oil pump.

Starter gear wreath is perfect.

I only renew the pressure plate if it has grooves. Otherwise, I clean and grease the joints. (I'll see that part tomorrow.)

I will polish the tread of the pulleye.

At the revision of the water pump I have already installed the short nozzles.


The hint to expand the transmission at this torture, is very good. Although I do not like this bone work. But I can see shavings on the oilscrew magnet, and the 2nd gear howls. -


One more question: I have some of these half circle seals. There are modern circular shaft seals in the catalog. Are they really better?
Edit: This one: https://www.snydersantiqueauto.com/P...earchByKeyword

[Lee Mitch]

In addition to what the others have suggested, I suggest the following: I had to do this very same thing last year. I had my engine "stitched", which has done very well for nearly 1000 miles. While the engine was out, I took the opportunity to:
1. change the clutch disc and pressure plate. It chattered terribly. I reinstalled the engine and the new pressure plate was terribly out of balance. Quite the second order vibration. I had to pull the engine again and re-balance everything.

2. Adjust the valves. (much easier to do when the engine is out)
3. Check bearing clearances (much easier to do when the engine is out of the car!!)

[ryanheacox]

I’d probably stick with the rope seal. Just make sure to soak it with oil and it should work well.

[Benson]

When you get it apart check the name on throwout bearing...

Might say "Aetna" there are a bunch of those still around at swap meets, Ebay and such.

They were recalled many years ago ... after vendors found many failures.

Considering the amount labor involved in replacing the T.O. bearing this is a good reason to buy parts from a known dealer to avoid some of the junk at swap meets!!

[Werner]

Scary insights that I must see now because the sudden crack give me some looks through the engine block!

I think the car has been underwater for 30 years. Rust everywhere where only oil should be. Even the bottom baffles from the oil pan insert are perforated. Oil pump screws fragmented. Cracks in the flywheel and in the pressure plate.

[Brentwood Bob]

Neglected, then resurrected.

[Synchro909]

Originally Posted by dansluck

If you replace the crankshaft pulley use a one piece one. I have had the two piece type fail. Engine looks clean. Good Luck!

Now that I have one on an engine, I wouldn't use anything other than one of the New Zealand made pullies with a harmonic balancer built in.

Werner, I get the imperession you are becoming disheartened with your car. Please perservere. It will be worth it in the end and you have plenty of good advice here. I have found that bringing a car back to top condition is a reward in itself and that in turn makes driving it an even more enjoyable experience.
If by "improvements" you mean more power or just more robust, again there is plenty of advice. I have my own version of that and probably everyone else has too. I'd be glad to elaborate on what I have done by private message if you like.

[History]

Werner, try and not take it personally as it looks like you got screwed by someone, maybe unwittingly. The vehicle may have changed hands more than once after the (((restoration))). But it also may have been restored by the seller. If you can afford it monetarily, it will be a great experience for you as you will (((KNOW))) the car inside and out. Hang in there and hopefully the rest will be in good shape.

[macdonge]

Werner.. the micro-cracks you see in the flywheel surface are fairly common. Remachining the surface should clean it up but whatever depth of cut is necessary must also be taken off the land which the pressure plate bolts to.


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[old31]

My flywheel had many more mico cracks. The guy that did my engine said that was not an issue. He resurfaced it and 9,000 miles later it still feels new.

[Werner]

Originally Posted by macdonge

Remachining the surface should clean it up but whatever depth of cut is necessary must also be taken off the land which the pressure plate bolts to.

MacDone, thank you for the hint, sorry that I canot understand the red marked sentence.
Would you please explane it detailed? Thank you!

[rocket1]

I'm pretty sure the new rope seals are teflon,I don't know if you have to soak them in oil,I did not and found no problems.

[macdonge]

Werner... Regarding the "red marked sentence" : "It is critical that the normal distance between the flywheel clutch surface and the pressure plate clutch surface be maintained after the flywheel is machined. This is done by machining the area of the flywheel where the pressure plate mounts. The amount of metal removed from this surface should be equal to the amount removed from the flywheel clutch surface (plus any amount also removed from the pressure plate clutch surface, if it also needs to be machined. Not a factor if a new pressure plate is used)." If this is not done, the depth of clutch engagement is compromised.

[Werner]

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N'Abend Macdonge,
thanks for the explanation. I dismantle the disk of the pressure unit and let it turn off 0.06". I think that the thinness can be compensated with the adjustmentable feet screws.

Thanks again!

[Werner]

I would like to thank you especially for this wise advice from Ryan.

Originally Posted by ryanheacox

I would pull the transmission, inspect the gears and change the bearings. I didn't when I had my engine rebuilt and then I found myself pulling the transmission 1000 miles later to do a rebuild... would have been much easier with the engine already out.

Honestly, I did not feel like to lift the gearbox too. But what Ryan wrote is very reasonable. After sleepless night, I have therefore pulled out the gearbox today.

Thanks for the future-wise advice, Ryanheacox!

[ryanheacox]

Did you pull off the pedals and transmission tower to get it out of the car?? Must have been a pain with it all together like that. You won't regret going through everything, even if it's perfect (which the odds of that are slim) you will have peace of mind afterwards.



Good luck, Werner and keep us posted on what you find.

[chrs1961815]

Check all of your transmission bearings, maybe replace gaskets, and check gears for pitting and broken teeth. Do the pedals need to be rebushed or new shafts?

[butch chase]

Install the rope seal dry then smear grease on it to keep the crankshaft from burning it until enough oil splashes up and soaks he seal.

[Synchro909]

Werner, is the fourth photo in your post #17, a rear hub? If so, it looks to be quite bad. I have just converted the hubs on one of my cars to modern roller bearings. The original hubs on my car weren't as bad as what you have so I think yours need attention. The vendors sell a repair kit for the rear wheel bearings but I don't think they are very good. They rely on using the rollers from a V8 car and the reproduced ones of those are of poor quality. So are some of the sleeves for the trumpet and hub.
If you like, send me a PM with your email address and I will send you an article I wrote about my conversion which explains exactly what I did.

[Werner]

Thanks for advice.

Sorry I put a wrong old picture. Another theme. It was made 1 year ago. It's the reare axle bearing face, I repaired it with the sleeve repair kit like you.

[Synchro909]

Originally Posted by Werner

Thanks for advice.

Sorry I put a wrong old picture. Another theme. It was made 1 year ago. It's the reare axle bearing face, I repaired it with the sleeve repair kit like you.

Werner, I did not use the commercially available repair kit. I didn't think they are good enough so I used modern bearings. I suggest you keep an eye on the hubs to see that they don't wear too quickly.

[Werner]

Good evening at all together!

Can someone please explain me how to mount this Bratton's Engine Motor Mounting Kit?

I find only short hints. But I didn't understand it correctly.

No rubber intermediate layer was installed when the engine was removed.


Thanks!

[Werner]

Really no one here who has mounted this engine swing damper?

[Russ/40]

The metal plate and the flat rubber are on the outside of the frame. The "L" shaped piece fits between the metal motor mount ant the inside of the frame rail. The 3 tubular spacers fit through the frame and the 2 rubbers.

[Werner]

Thank you Russ for the hint!

I could not understand the assembly because the outer parts of my car were missing. There were only the screws. And inside a rock-hard mass like tar. No sleeves. No split pins.

Now it's correkt mounted.

[Russ/40]

Wow, that was a mess. Now you have it, and you should have less vibration.

[Ranchero50]

Looks correct. Mine splayed the rubber out more when I tightened the nuts enough to get the cotter pins installed.

[katy]

FWIW, that large nut on the spare tire carrier is the same as the rear axle nut. I know because I "borrowed" one one time when we lost an axle nut on the road.

[Werner]

Hallo Ranchero,

are you sure that the correct screw length has been installed? The rubber intermediate layers must not be squeezed because then the springy comfort cannot swing.

The 3 sleeves should prevent too much compression.

The required tightening force was very low, I estimate the torque at 2 m / kp.

The other picture shows the protruding screw ends and the soft rubber plate in more details. -


At Katy: You are sure to be on the right place?

[Russ/40]

Since the discussion continues, I should add, you can experiment with how tight the tubular inserts are clamped, but in my experience I could not get any difference in vibration if tightly clamped or if some movement is allowed.

[Werner]

Guten Abend Russ,

you are right. Because there ist only a swinging way about 1/10", there is not a big feelin' different. But if the rubbers are too much pressed, the swinging moves destroy the rubbers.

[katy]

This nut:

[Werner]

Hallihallo, the engine is finally installed again. Hearty toil!

[40 Deluxe]

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Considering all the problems with this engine, maybe you should keep an eye out for a German B engine or a Russian GAZ as a future replacement.

[Sunnybrook Farm]

The block is cast iron, welding may not work very well on that metal. They have done stitching on the block since the cars were new. It doesn't involve welding the metal but instead boring holes and screwing in studs then boring and screwing in more that overlap the first ones. It amounts to filling the crack with new metal. There are videos on youtube showing the process.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Pq0wfU4ZaKk

There is another series of videos of a shop repairing a model A block that it cracked from the cylinder to the valve seat but it doesn't sound like that is your problem. A machine shop should know all about it.

[ryanheacox]

Originally Posted by 40 Deluxe

Considering all the problems with this engine, maybe you should keep an eye out for a German B engine or a Russian GAZ as a future replacement.

I never thought of that. A G28T would be a huge improvement. Wonder how easy one would be to find?

[Werner]

Sorry, picture mistake. Don'n know how to remove.

[Werner]

Guten Morgen!

The uncertainty of the risk of breakage of a welded cast ingot bares naturally also in me.

But in Germany there are not really spare parts for Model A or B. Some dealers offer few parts that they buy in the USA. I can do that by myself.

Of course I'm looking for a replacement engine!

Please, what is a G28T engine type?

[ryanheacox]

http://www.fordgarage.com/pages/1948kolnLKWparts.htm


There are other links at the bottom of that page with more info as well.



The G28T was essentially an improved Model B engine but with some significant improvements like insert bearings and full pressure oiling.

[Werner]

Hallihallo!

Many days, many hours of work. Today the removed engine was running again for the first time. Nice day!

[Russ/40]

Looks good, nice job, any leaks?

[Werner]

Hallo Russ!
It looks good! But I only drove 1/2 mile. Without a seat, without the hood, no headlights, no license plate. Our policemen are not amused by something like that ...

[katy]

Originally Posted by Werner

Hallo Russ!
It looks good! But I only drove 1/2 mile. Without a seat, without the hood, no headlights, no license plate. Our policemen are not amused by something like that ...

Our police are not overly impressed by something like that either.

Although it does look good.

BTW, what make/model are those spark plugs?

[Werner]

Guten Abend Ken.
That's modern iridium spark plugs with adapters. NGK BPR 5 EiX. Best for cold start idle and a little bit less consumption.

[katy]

Originally Posted by Werner

Guten Abend Ken.
That's modern iridium spark plugs with adapters. NGK BPR 5 EiX. Best for cold start idle and a little bit less consumption.

Sounds good, thanks, Ken

[Werner]

Very good evening at all together!

Now 10 miles test drive today. (Still without seats.) Everything's fine. The 2nd gear no longer howls. The tautly manual transmission is tight. Also the cardan / universal gear. No leakage at the front of the crankshaft. And no more water in the oil!

A lot of work, but also a lot of joy.

I would like to thank all the advisers again, otherwise the work would not have been so perfect.