The Ford Barn

'46Ford · 07-09-2015, 12:55 PM

I have a 51 or 52 Merc v-8 Flathead that was put into a 46 Ford coupe when I bought it. It had not run for a while, it had a stuck valve which I got freed up and runs pretty smooth now. However, it will not start unless I have the timing Advanced (distributor rotated clockwise quite a bit). It will fire up and of course not run too smoothly, I set the timing at top dead center on the crank pulley. It runs real smooth, no misses, everything sounds great, until I shut it down. It will not start up again unless I advance the timing as I did in the beginning. I have new plugs, cap, rotor, same points and condenser, points set at 14-16. Fuel supply is okay, new fuel pump, rebuilt carb. I cannot figure out why it won't fire back up with the timing set correctly. I have replaced the vacuum advance on the distributor. Does anyone have any ideas, solutions to this problem. I was going to switch out the distributor? Not sure if that would fix the problem.

Kahuna · 07-09-2015, 01:28 PM

If your engine has the "Loadamatic" distributor, I'd bet that's your problem.
But I'm not familiar with whatever distributor you may have

19Fordy · 07-09-2015, 01:39 PM

Did you plug the vacuum advance line on the distributor when you set the timing? Did you reattach that line to the correct port after you timed the engine?

George/Maine · 07-09-2015, 01:40 PM

When the pointer is on mark make sure the rotor is on #1 you don't want to be 180 out you are not.
The way the rotor should be if the cap is marked #1 the rotor should be at 6 o'clock.
Place the dist in middle of limit of movement.
Start up and turn till it runs the best and back off little then try it don't use the light.

BUBBAS IGNITION · 07-09-2015, 03:18 PM

Some confusion ???
The 51-52 engine would use a loadamatic distributor . You are timing using the pointer and thats good but that also tells us its the vac only distributor. SO from that point like Kahuna said the problem is in the distributor. The vac may or may not be working etc, May not be returning to the mark and may not have the correct vac applied to it. They are also bad to short out the lead wire under the plate.
I would rebuild the distributor or switch it over to a full mechanical unit etc....

'46Ford · 07-09-2015, 09:40 PM

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It is a loadamatic distributor, I have another distributor that I may try in there and/or rebuild this one. What type mechanical distributor could I swap this one for. Iv'e double checked everything that everyone suggested except checking for a short on the lead wire under the plate. I am open to any other suggestion, in the meantime I will be working in this direction. Thanks for the feedback.

19Fordy · 07-09-2015, 10:23 PM

46Ford; Call Bubba's Ignition. He will give you the best advice.

Kahuna · 07-09-2015, 10:39 PM

I have replaced the vacuum advance on the distributor.

Did you replace with correct diaphram for the loadamatic?

avrotom · 07-10-2015, 12:03 AM

Had a shop where we did a lot of tune ups, o/h distributors on all. Many times on Fords, the lead was broken inside the rubber insulation where it flexes most. Connection would make and break at random, causing very erratic starting and running. Just an old thought.

BUBBAS IGNITION · 07-10-2015, 09:45 AM

OK, heres what i think has happened.
You set the timing with the vacuum line connected and the advance was pulled out to
, lets say 15-16 degrees and you adjusted that to zero on the pointer ( 2-4 degrees). Then when engine is shut off the advance comes down to zero ( which is now 15-16 degrees retarded ) and the engine dont want to start at that setting.

Unhook the vac unit line plug and adjust the timing, tighten down and then hook up the vacuum........

Make sense ??????????

Tinker · 07-10-2015, 08:32 PM

To add to bubbas post as a tinkerer of things.

Any vac advance dizzy, you need to set initial timing first. That does require that you do remove the vacuum line and setting the timing at idle off a known tdc mark. That would be your idle or initial timing.

Then hook the vacuum and check your timing as it revs. That will show if you have any vac advance to your system. Alterations to the vacuum input can effect the performance. Carberator changes, etc.

Personally, I'd just talk to bubba about getting a points mech setup and take all the guess work out of diaphragms. Sometimes it's okay to go straight to go. Not that you can't go the other way either.

I don't have a dizzy machine or the resources to set a dizzy up, so that's my opinion.

billwill · 07-10-2015, 08:52 PM

I think you have a BAD timing chain good luck

Tinker · 07-10-2015, 08:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by billwill

I think you have a BAD timing chain good luck

On a flathead?

JSeery · 07-10-2015, 08:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by billwill

I think you have a BAD timing chain good luck

Now that's funny!!!

48 coupe · 07-10-2015, 09:31 PM

I think there is one push rod off.

07-09-2015, 01:28 PM	#2
Kahuna Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: NorCal Posts: 2,617	Re: timing & starting problems If your engine has the "Loadamatic" distributor, I'd bet that's your problem. But I'm not familiar with whatever distributor you may have

07-09-2015, 01:39 PM	#3
19Fordy Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Coral Springs FL Posts: 10,942	Re: timing & starting problems Did you plug the vacuum advance line on the distributor when you set the timing? Did you reattach that line to the correct port after you timed the engine?

07-09-2015, 01:40 PM	#4
George/Maine Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Mid coast Maine Posts: 1,878	Re: timing & starting problems When the pointer is on mark make sure the rotor is on #1 you don't want to be 180 out you are not. The way the rotor should be if the cap is marked #1 the rotor should be at 6 o'clock. Place the dist in middle of limit of movement. Start up and turn till it runs the best and back off little then try it don't use the light.

07-09-2015, 03:18 PM	#5
BUBBAS IGNITION Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: SPEEDWAY INDIANA Posts: 4,148	Re: timing & starting problems Some confusion ??? The 51-52 engine would use a loadamatic distributor . You are timing using the pointer and thats good but that also tells us its the vac only distributor. SO from that point like Kahuna said the problem is in the distributor. The vac may or may not be working etc, May not be returning to the mark and may not have the correct vac applied to it. They are also bad to short out the lead wire under the plate. I would rebuild the distributor or switch it over to a full mechanical unit etc.... __________________ If it Makes Spark, we do it !!!! www.bubbasignition.com [email protected]

07-09-2015, 09:40 PM	#6
'46Ford Junior Member Join Date: Dec 2014 Location: Hermann, MO Posts: 19	Re: timing & starting problems Sponsored Links (Register now to hide all advertisements) It is a loadamatic distributor, I have another distributor that I may try in there and/or rebuild this one. What type mechanical distributor could I swap this one for. Iv'e double checked everything that everyone suggested except checking for a short on the lead wire under the plate. I am open to any other suggestion, in the meantime I will be working in this direction. Thanks for the feedback.

07-09-2015, 12:55 PM	#1
'46Ford Junior Member Join Date: Dec 2014 Location: Hermann, MO Posts: 19	timing & starting problems I have a 51 or 52 Merc v-8 Flathead that was put into a 46 Ford coupe when I bought it. It had not run for a while, it had a stuck valve which I got freed up and runs pretty smooth now. However, it will not start unless I have the timing Advanced (distributor rotated clockwise quite a bit). It will fire up and of course not run too smoothly, I set the timing at top dead center on the crank pulley. It runs real smooth, no misses, everything sounds great, until I shut it down. It will not start up again unless I advance the timing as I did in the beginning. I have new plugs, cap, rotor, same points and condenser, points set at 14-16. Fuel supply is okay, new fuel pump, rebuilt carb. I cannot figure out why it won't fire back up with the timing set correctly. I have replaced the vacuum advance on the distributor. Does anyone have any ideas, solutions to this problem. I was going to switch out the distributor? Not sure if that would fix the problem.

07-09-2015, 10:23 PM	#7
19Fordy Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Coral Springs FL Posts: 10,942	Re: timing & starting problems 46Ford; Call Bubba's Ignition. He will give you the best advice.

07-09-2015, 10:39 PM	#8
Kahuna Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: NorCal Posts: 2,617	Re: timing & starting problems I have replaced the vacuum advance on the distributor. Did you replace with correct diaphram for the loadamatic?

07-10-2015, 12:03 AM	#9
avrotom Junior Member Join Date: Jul 2011 Location: Ft. McMurray, Alberta Posts: 21	Re: timing & starting problems Had a shop where we did a lot of tune ups, o/h distributors on all. Many times on Fords, the lead was broken inside the rubber insulation where it flexes most. Connection would make and break at random, causing very erratic starting and running. Just an old thought.

07-10-2015, 09:45 AM	#10
BUBBAS IGNITION Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: SPEEDWAY INDIANA Posts: 4,148	Re: timing & starting problems OK, heres what i think has happened. You set the timing with the vacuum line connected and the advance was pulled out to , lets say 15-16 degrees and you adjusted that to zero on the pointer ( 2-4 degrees). Then when engine is shut off the advance comes down to zero ( which is now 15-16 degrees retarded ) and the engine dont want to start at that setting. Unhook the vac unit line plug and adjust the timing, tighten down and then hook up the vacuum........ Make sense ?????????? __________________ If it Makes Spark, we do it !!!! www.bubbasignition.com [email protected]

07-10-2015, 08:32 PM	#11
Tinker Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: MN Posts: 7,053	Re: timing & starting problems To add to bubbas post as a tinkerer of things. Any vac advance dizzy, you need to set initial timing first. That does require that you do remove the vacuum line and setting the timing at idle off a known tdc mark. That would be your idle or initial timing. Then hook the vacuum and check your timing as it revs. That will show if you have any vac advance to your system. Alterations to the vacuum input can effect the performance. Carberator changes, etc. Personally, I'd just talk to bubba about getting a points mech setup and take all the guess work out of diaphragms. Sometimes it's okay to go straight to go. Not that you can't go the other way either. I don't have a dizzy machine or the resources to set a dizzy up, so that's my opinion.

07-10-2015, 08:52 PM	#12
billwill Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: capemaynewjersey Posts: 653	Re: timing & starting problems I think you have a BAD timing chain good luck

07-10-2015, 09:31 PM	#15
48 coupe Senior Member Join Date: Nov 2014 Location: Shell Knob Missouri Posts: 151	Re: timing & starting problems I think there is one push rod off.