Flathead V8 head bolts vs studs

[scicala]

Does anyone know when the Ford flathead V8 switched from head studs to head bolts ? Was it with the 8BA ?


Sal

[Seth Swoboda]

I believe you are correct. It started with the 8BA in 1949.

[flatjack9]

Actually in 1948 when the 8BA was introduced in trucks.

[Ziggster]

My C59A/C69A has bolts. The bolts come in three different lengths that all protrude from the mating surface the same amount = 0.75".
My heads are C7RA, and from what I could find all stud kits are only offered in two lengths, which mean as far as I could tell that some of the studs would protrude more than others. Finding the correct head bolts has been a royal pain so far.

[supereal]

From 38-48 Ford used three lengths of head studs, In 49-53 the 8BA used 20 bolts, 1.94" . In 49-53, 28 bolt engines used 2.62". Mercury, the same. Be aware the studs have different threads on each end, and should not bottom in the block. Removing studs for bolts is risky, as the threads in the block may be fragile.

[Ziggster]

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Originally Posted by supereal

From 38-48 Ford used three lengths of head studs, In 49-53 the 8BA used 20 bolts, 1.94" . In 49-53, 28 bolt engines used 2.62". Mercury, the same. Be aware the studs have different threads on each end, and should not bottom in the block. Removing studs for bolts is risky, as the threads in the block may be fragile.

If you know of anyone selling a stud kit with the three different length studs, please let me know.

[marko39]

Originally Posted by supereal

From 38-48 Ford used three lengths of head studs, In 49-53 the 8BA used 20 bolts, 1.94" . In 49-53, 28 bolt engines used 2.62". Mercury, the same. Be aware the studs have different threads on each end, and should not bottom in the block. Removing studs for bolts is risky, as the threads in the block may be fragile.

Not to mention breaking some off. Ask Mart.

[Ronnieroadster]

Originally Posted by scicala

Does anyone know when the Ford flathead V8 switched from head studs to head bolts ? Was it with the 8BA ?


Sal

In 1948 the Ford truck engine was the first release of the 8BA block however it came with head studs. Starting in 1949 all 8BA flathead engines were now using head bolts studs were no longer being used in production.
Ronnieroadster

[flatjack9]

I have a 48 - 51 Ford truck parts book and it only lists bolts.

[Kube]

Originally Posted by flatjack9

I have a 48 - 51 Ford truck parts book and it only lists bolts.

Parts books list replacement parts only. Not necessarily what was installed on the assembly line. Also, not all parts were available for service.

[scicala]

Thank you everyone for the replies. It looks like it's a fairly safe bet the head bolts first appeared in '49 on the 8BA. possibly '48 truck, although Ronnieroadster said '48 trucks had studs. I'll have to believe that since I wasn't sure.


Sal

[Russ/40]

Very early production of 49 cars also came with studs and were painted blue.

[Ol' Ron]

Been using bolts for 50 years on all my builds. Tourk to 45 ft/lb for 3 heat cycles.

[JM 35 Sedan]

I prefer using studs over using bolts......
First, that's what all the Flathead engines I own were originally built with at the factory...., second, I feel I can seal the threads on those studs that enter the water jacket a lot better than I could if using bolts....., and third, I feel I can control setting the torque a lot better when using studs, hardened flatwashers, and nuts, than I ever could using bolts. I believe the use of bolts to fasten the cylinder heads on our beloved Flatheads happened after Henry's death, and strictly as a cost saving measure. I have never been a fan of the 8ba versions of the Flathead engine, but if I ever build one to use in any of my old Ford's, it would definitely be built using studs, rather than head bolts, but then again, I wouldn't be building racing engines that may only last a few races, before their blown, and rebuilt maybe several times in a season, or maybe find it necessary to quickly pull a head to possibly make a repair between races.

[Ziggster]

Originally Posted by JM 35 Sedan

I prefer using studs over using bolts......
First, that's what all the Flathead engines I own were originally built with at the factory...., second, I feel I can seal the threads on those studs that enter the water jacket a lot better than I could if using bolts....., and third, I feel I can control setting the torque a lot better when using studs, hardened flatwashers, and nuts, than I ever could using bolts. I believe the use of bolts to fasten the cylinder heads on our beloved Flatheads happened after Henry's death, and strictly as a cost saving measure. I have never been a fan of the 8ba versions of the Flathead engine, but if I ever build one to use in any of my old Ford's, it would definitely be built using studs, rather than head bolts, but then again, I wouldn't be building racing engines that may only last a few races, before their blown, and rebuilt maybe several times in a season, or maybe find it necessary to quickly pull a head to possibly make a repair between races.

So could you please tell me where I can find the correct studs (the correct three different lengths) for my C59A?

[Tim Ayers]

Duplicate post

[Tim Ayers]

Originally Posted by Ziggster

So could you please tell me where I can find the correct studs (the correct three different lengths) for my C59A?

Michael @ Third Gen/Ford Bolts. Roy N. offered this kit and I'm assuming Michael is still offering it.

Or, you can order ARP studs individually from Allen's fasteners.

https://www.allensfasteners.com/

I ordered ARP studs for my build and it came to around $250 after their discount for ordering 50 or more. This was about 1/2 price of any pre-packaged kit from a vendor.

[supereal]

ARP products are a bit more pricier, but well worth the difference.

[Ziggster]

Originally Posted by Tim Ayers

Michael @ Third Gen/Ford Bolts. Roy N. offered this kit and I'm assuming Michael is still offering it.

Or, you can order ARP studs individually from Allen's fasteners.

https://www.allensfasteners.com/

I ordered ARP studs for my build and it came to around $250 after their discount for ordering 50 or more. This was about 1/2 price of any pre-packaged kit from a vendor.

Thanks for the link to the Allen site. Took a bit of digging, but I found both the ARP flanged head bolts (incl 12 point) and studs and in the correct sizes sold individually.

[VeryTangled]

My junk is all built for studs and I'll keep 'em no matter how much grief they give me. I have two cars, a 36 and a 35, and total three engines. All have block off plates so they're insert bearing but I use them with the pumps in the heads. Long Live Studs!

[Ol' Ron]

When it comes to the use of studs, they should have only 7 or 8 threads on the coarse side and be torqued into the block to prevent water from leaking around the threads. I never saw a spec on the am't of torque but 10/15 lbs should do it. Addi some sealant would be a good idea. I use a sealant for steam pipes on the bolts I use.

[swedishsteel]

When I built my '36 21 stud, I used aftermarket heads so the original studs were the wrong length. I went to my local Auto Value and, at the time, could get a variety of studs. It's been several years, but as I recall, I couldn't get the exact length, but could get slightly longer than needed, so I needed to cut a little bit off of some of them. Easy to do, just took some time. And, they were reasonably priced.