The Ford Barn

Straightpipes · 06-03-2018, 07:29 PM

Just wondering.......Why do so many folks refer to a 37 Ford and up coupe as a 5 window ? Maybe they don't know that 36 was the last of the 3 window. Or maybe I don't know either.

Art Newland · 06-03-2018, 07:35 PM

I hear that with my Model A too.

tubman · 06-03-2018, 07:35 PM

I think Minotti has complicated the situation.

34pickup · 06-03-2018, 08:59 PM

Its just ignorance. Not meant to sound hateful, but ignorance is the lack of knowledge so they just don't know. It is kind of an esoteric thing only known among old car dudes.

itsa52 · 06-03-2018, 10:50 PM

Or tri powers for flatheads,, a GM marketing term

itsa52 · 06-03-2018, 10:51 PM

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Or Post and no post???

Ken/Alabama · 06-03-2018, 11:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by itsa52

Or Post and no post???

Never quite understood the term "Hardtop". When I was a kid I remember my Dad would refer to a peticular car being a Hardtop. Heck, to me they were all hardtops unless it was a convertible with a cloth top. I know now that hardtops don't have a post but it's just one of those terms I guess.

corvette8n · 06-04-2018, 06:37 AM

Or "Just like Henry built it", fiberglass fenders,sbc,turbo 350, yada yada yada.

Oakhurst · 06-04-2018, 09:29 AM

In 49 the "hardtop convertible" was born, as it simulated the convertible look. A 2 door or later a 4 door with no post. It has just been shortened to "hardtop" through the years.

Fred A · 06-04-2018, 09:29 AM

Sure there can be a splash of ignorance with these terms but also something either near correct as Ford historians might describe things. In my case, a 1940 Five Window Coupe is the Ford term for the Coupe with the package tray behind the seat, while according to Ford a Business Coupe name is for the Coupe with the jump seats behind the front seat. Seems that the rest of the auto industry thought differently, along with many car guys. Who Knew? Fred A

Karl Wescott · 06-04-2018, 09:45 AM

In 1937 or 1938 it is still a good idea to use "5 window coupe" to differentiate from the "club coupe", even if both had 5 windows. In 1939 or 1940 you still should use "5 window coupe" to prevent confusion with the Mercury "sedan coupe", which was the "hardtop" style even if the name had not been invented yet.

19Fordy · 06-04-2018, 09:57 AM

OK, I'll bite. The reason so many folks call the 1937 and up 5 window coupes is because they feature 5 windows - 2 on each side and the rear window counted as one. Front window isn't counted. Over time, this became the "common vernacular" among car hobbyists despite what the sales literature originally depicted. I still keep this 1959 R&C Magazine featuring 5 window coupes that was in my 40 glove box when I bought the car in 1963. It gives a nice "peek" at 5 window coupes.
https://www.ebay.com/itm/ROD-AND-CUS...YAAOSw4s9XlLrK

rotorwrench · 06-04-2018, 10:55 AM

5-window is just a term. Ford made a lot of different coupes. It generally doesn't completely tell you what it is but it gets a person in the ball park. The use of the terms deluxe & standard in cars between 1937 and 1940 gets you right in there along with business types. In 1941, the terms special and super were added in the mix as well as sedan or long door coupes. Some folks use the term opera but that one gets confusing some times.

Ford Freak · 06-04-2018, 04:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fred A

Sure there can be a splash of ignorance with these terms but also something either near correct as Ford historians might describe things. In my case, a 1940 Five Window Coupe is the Ford term for the Coupe with the package tray behind the seat, while according to Ford a Business Coupe name is for the Coupe with the jump seats behind the front seat. Seems that the rest of the auto industry thought differently, along with many car guys. Who Knew? Fred A

So , a 1940 w/rear jump seats is a "business coupe" according to Ford ? I have seen many Ford so called "business coupes" w/no rear seat(s) . Speaking of "terms", just what is an 1940 "opera coupe" ? - F F

itsa52 · 06-04-2018, 05:16 PM

1949 Buick was the first hard top, They considered it a hard top convertible. Now it all makes sence right? Saw that on a Buick display in Flint MI airport. Home of Buick

itsa52 · 06-04-2018, 05:18 PM

But since they did not make a coupe anyother way, Isn't it redundant?

Ken/Alabama · 06-04-2018, 05:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ford Freak

So , a 1940 w/rear jump seats is a "business coupe" according to Ford ? I have seen many Ford so called "business coupes" w/no rear seat(s) . Speaking of "terms", just what is an 1940 "opera coupe" ? - F F

Yes, the 40 coupe with the rear auxiliary seats is the business coupe. Don't know where the term "Opera"Coupe came from but I don't think it's the term Ford used in 1940. Just like Ford referred to their cars as Ford V8 and Deluxe Ford V8. No reference to "Standard". Terminology gets changed around over the years.

CHuDWah · 06-04-2018, 05:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ford Freak

So , a 1940 w/rear jump seats is a "business coupe" according to Ford ? I have seen many Ford so called "business coupes" w/no rear seat(s) . Speaking of "terms", just what is an 1940 "opera coupe" ? - F F

Five Window Coupe (no jump seats) and Business Coupe (jump seats) are official Ford-speak - Ford never used the term Opera Coupe. To further complicate matters, I think there was a jump seat delete option. Some other manufacturers used Business Coupe for no jump seats and may have used Opera Coupe for jump seats. For example, late-30s Plymouths did not have jump seats but called the trunk model a Business Coupe - the rumble seat models were Rumble Seat Coupes. Confused yet?

CHuDWah · 06-04-2018, 05:53 PM

36 was the last Ford 3-window but not the last 3-window (e.g., Lincoln Zephyr) so the 3- and 5-window terms were still descriptive

rotorwrench · 06-04-2018, 06:31 PM

Ford didn't like referring to any of their cars as "Standard" but folks couldn't live with that terminology. The term "Ford V8" could fit any car that had one but folks described it the way they saw it.

A lot of the old opera houses had the fold up seats in places so they could pack in a few more fans when the house was near full. I think a lot of folks just use the opera term since they didn't know what else to call a fold up seat. There were aftermarket kits for traveling sales men to add shelves behind the seat in some of the popular cars of the era so some business coupes likely had the fold up seats removed for stuff like that. Farmers purchased aftermarket bed kits to install in the coupes to make them into a sort of pickup configuration. The guys from the southern pacific regions of Australia and New Zealand could call that a coupe ute.

06-03-2018, 07:29 PM	#1
Straightpipes Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Ballston Spa, NY Posts: 789	5 Window Coupes ??? Just wondering.......Why do so many folks refer to a 37 Ford and up coupe as a 5 window ? Maybe they don't know that 36 was the last of the 3 window. Or maybe I don't know either.

06-03-2018, 07:35 PM	#2
Art Newland Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2016 Location: Lynden, WA Posts: 1,564	Re: 5 Window Coupes ??? I hear that with my Model A too. __________________ "whatever works!"

06-03-2018, 07:35 PM	#3
tubman Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2013 Location: Minnesota, Florida Keys Posts: 10,303	Re: 5 Window Coupes ??? I think Minotti has complicated the situation.

06-03-2018, 08:59 PM	#4
34pickup Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Huntsville Al Posts: 1,526	Re: 5 Window Coupes ??? Its just ignorance. Not meant to sound hateful, but ignorance is the lack of knowledge so they just don't know. It is kind of an esoteric thing only known among old car dudes. __________________ Matt 24:36-41

06-03-2018, 10:50 PM	#5
itsa52 Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2012 Location: Nebraska Posts: 603	Re: 5 Window Coupes ??? Or tri powers for flatheads,, a GM marketing term

06-03-2018, 10:51 PM	#6
itsa52 Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2012 Location: Nebraska Posts: 603	Re: 5 Window Coupes ??? Sponsored Links (Register now to hide all advertisements) Or Post and no post???

06-04-2018, 06:37 AM	#8
corvette8n Senior Member Join Date: Jul 2010 Location: 36 miles north of Albany NY Posts: 2,943	Re: 5 Window Coupes ??? Or "Just like Henry built it", fiberglass fenders,sbc,turbo 350, yada yada yada.

06-04-2018, 09:29 AM	#9
Oakhurst Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2014 Location: Oakhurst, CA Posts: 140	Re: 5 Window Coupes ??? In 49 the "hardtop convertible" was born, as it simulated the convertible look. A 2 door or later a 4 door with no post. It has just been shortened to "hardtop" through the years.

06-04-2018, 09:29 AM	#10
Fred A Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Encino California, near Burbank Posts: 935	Re: 5 Window Coupes ??? Sure there can be a splash of ignorance with these terms but also something either near correct as Ford historians might describe things. In my case, a 1940 Five Window Coupe is the Ford term for the Coupe with the package tray behind the seat, while according to Ford a Business Coupe name is for the Coupe with the jump seats behind the front seat. Seems that the rest of the auto industry thought differently, along with many car guys. Who Knew? Fred A

06-04-2018, 09:45 AM	#11
Karl Wescott Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Oregon Posts: 1,283	Re: 5 Window Coupes ??? In 1937 or 1938 it is still a good idea to use "5 window coupe" to differentiate from the "club coupe", even if both had 5 windows. In 1939 or 1940 you still should use "5 window coupe" to prevent confusion with the Mercury "sedan coupe", which was the "hardtop" style even if the name had not been invented yet.

06-04-2018, 09:57 AM	#12
19Fordy Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Coral Springs FL Posts: 10,921	Re: 5 Window Coupes ??? OK, I'll bite. The reason so many folks call the 1937 and up 5 window coupes is because they feature 5 windows - 2 on each side and the rear window counted as one. Front window isn't counted. Over time, this became the "common vernacular" among car hobbyists despite what the sales literature originally depicted. I still keep this 1959 R&C Magazine featuring 5 window coupes that was in my 40 glove box when I bought the car in 1963. It gives a nice "peek" at 5 window coupes. https://www.ebay.com/itm/ROD-AND-CUS...YAAOSw4s9XlLrK Last edited by 19Fordy; 06-04-2018 at 10:44 AM.

06-04-2018, 10:55 AM	#13
rotorwrench Senior Member Join Date: Jun 2010 Location: San Antonio, Texas Posts: 16,422	Re: 5 Window Coupes ??? 5-window is just a term. Ford made a lot of different coupes. It generally doesn't completely tell you what it is but it gets a person in the ball park. The use of the terms deluxe & standard in cars between 1937 and 1940 gets you right in there along with business types. In 1941, the terms special and super were added in the mix as well as sedan or long door coupes. Some folks use the term opera but that one gets confusing some times.

06-04-2018, 05:16 PM	#15
itsa52 Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2012 Location: Nebraska Posts: 603	Re: 5 Window Coupes ??? 1949 Buick was the first hard top, They considered it a hard top convertible. Now it all makes sence right? Saw that on a Buick display in Flint MI airport. Home of Buick

06-04-2018, 05:18 PM	#16
itsa52 Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2012 Location: Nebraska Posts: 603	Re: 5 Window Coupes ??? But since they did not make a coupe anyother way, Isn't it redundant?

06-04-2018, 05:53 PM	#19
CHuDWah Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2010 Location: Kritter Krick, Flaw-duh Posts: 1,158	Re: 5 Window Coupes ??? 36 was the last Ford 3-window but not the last 3-window (e.g., Lincoln Zephyr) so the 3- and 5-window terms were still descriptive

06-04-2018, 06:31 PM	#20
rotorwrench Senior Member Join Date: Jun 2010 Location: San Antonio, Texas Posts: 16,422	Re: 5 Window Coupes ??? Ford didn't like referring to any of their cars as "Standard" but folks couldn't live with that terminology. The term "Ford V8" could fit any car that had one but folks described it the way they saw it. A lot of the old opera houses had the fold up seats in places so they could pack in a few more fans when the house was near full. I think a lot of folks just use the opera term since they didn't know what else to call a fold up seat. There were aftermarket kits for traveling sales men to add shelves behind the seat in some of the popular cars of the era so some business coupes likely had the fold up seats removed for stuff like that. Farmers purchased aftermarket bed kits to install in the coupes to make them into a sort of pickup configuration. The guys from the southern pacific regions of Australia and New Zealand could call that a coupe ute.