The Ford Barn

31pickup650 · 07-24-2015, 09:42 PM

Hey guys. I have a rebuilt engine that has never been run since it was rebuilt 50 years ago. It sat in a garage without a head on it. I got it up onto the stand and pulled the pan. Theres definitely some dust in there. What's the best course of action from here? Thanks.

40 Deluxe · 07-25-2015, 12:12 AM

I think it would be very interesting for one of the current rebuilders to tear it down for a complete inspection. See what they did for Babbitt, etc. in 1965. Was this a factory rebuild (if I remember, in 1965 you still could buy reman A engines (even from Sears or Monkey Wards))? Or was it a local garage or local machine shop overhaul? Seems like most parts stores also had machine shops back then (one here in Flagstaff still does).

burner31 · 07-25-2015, 01:24 AM

Give everything a good check, clean it up, assemble and start her up, see what happens.
If it's good, your golden, if not, you're out a little time and some gaskets.

Bruce Adams · 07-25-2015, 06:32 AM

I guess you know to pre lube everything already. Will you do a compression test prior to putting much more time into it?

31pickup650 · 07-25-2015, 07:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 40 Deluxe

I think it would be very interesting for one of the current rebuilders to tear it down for a complete inspection. See what they did for Babbitt, etc. in 1965. Was this a factory rebuild (if I remember, in 1965 you still could buy reman A engines (even from Sears or Monkey Wards))? Or was it a local garage or local machine shop overhaul? Seems like most parts stores also had machine shops back then (one here in Flagstaff still does).

I will have to ask my grandpa the specifics, but I know he had it machined and the did the assembly himself.

Quote:

Originally Posted by burner31

Give everything a good check, clean it up, assemble and start her up, see what happens.
If it's good, your golden, if not, you're out a little time and some gaskets.

What's the best way to clean all of it up? I wiped it out with a microfiber cloth the best I could, but that missed a lot of area.

Chris in CT · 07-25-2015, 08:33 AM

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Hi Noah, I notice you've got 20 posts above. Did anyone welcome you to Fordbarn? If not, welcome. If you think the interior of the engine is really dirty - and perhaps gritty would be the best description - then I think you should attempt to clean it out. If it is just congealed oil, then it might be best to leave it alone and use the procedures I would suggest below.
If gritty, turn the engine on its side with the crankcase turned slightly down, and wash it out with kerosene. Do not use anything more aggressive than the kero. Use a squirt bottle or can, and don't get near any source of combustion. Collect the kerosene run-off with pans or shop towels and dispose of safely and legally.
In any case, when you have re-assembled your engine, fill it with 20 weight oil for the first few break-in runs, and use standard break-in procedures for the Model A engine.
Oh! Do not forget to put 2 quarts of oil in the crankcase, and two quarts down the distributor hole to fill the valve galley and main bearing feed tubes with oil before you attempt to start the engine. After about ten hours of the break-in procedure, drain the 20 weight and refill with 30 weight. Addendum: The first few times you start your engine, let it run at a fast idle until it gets hot (steam first beginning to appear at the radiator neck) then shut it down. When the engine can run at a fast idle without getting hot (steam appearing) then you can begin to take it on drives not faster than 35-40 mph. This will also allow you to snug down the head bolts several times after you re-install the head with that new head gasket.

31pickup650 · 07-25-2015, 08:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chris in CT

Hi Noah, I notice you've got 20 posts above. Did anyone welcome you to Fordbarn? If not, welcome. If you think the interior of the engine is really dirty - and perhaps gritty would be the best description - then I think you should attempt to clean it out. If it is just congealed oil, then it might be best to leave it alone and use the procedures I would suggest below.
If gritty, turn the engine on its side with the crankcase turned slightly down, and wash it out with kerosene. Do not use anything more aggressive than the kero. Use a squirt bottle or can, and don't get near any source of combustion. Collect the kerosene run-off with pans or shop towels and dispose of safely and legally.
In any case, when you have re-assembled your engine, fill it with 20 weight oil for the first few break-in runs, and use standard break-in procedures for the Model A engine.
Oh! Do not forget to put 2 quarts of oil in the crankcase, and two quarts down the distributor hole to fill the valve galley and main bearing feed tubes with oil before you attempt to start the engine. After about ten hours of the break-in procedure, drain the 20 weight and refill with 30 weight. Addendum: The first few times you start your engine, let it run at a fast idle until it gets hot (steam first beginning to appear at the radiator neck) then shut it down. When the engine can run at a fast idle without getting hot (steam appearing) then you can begin to take it on drives not faster than 35-40 mph. This will also allow you to snug down the head bolts several times after you re-install the head with that new head gasket.

Thanks, Chris. When I turn the engine so the crankcase is slightly down, is this just the bare block after I have disassembled it? It definitely seems dusty/gritty. I was thinking to disassemble it and clean it with the kerosene first because it simply isn't worth the risk of damaging it. Thanks for the detailed help!

Dave in MD · 07-25-2015, 09:37 AM

It appears that at least some of the cylinders have been sleeved. Are there any marks on the top of the pistons to indicate their size?
Dave

31pickup650 · 07-25-2015, 09:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dave in MD

It appears that at least some of the cylinders have been sleeved. Are there any marks on the top of the pistons to indicate their size?
Dave

They're 0.060" over.

Rowdy · 07-25-2015, 09:47 AM

I would do a general clean up with mineral spirits, check clearances, possibly take it to a machine shop and have it balanced, lube it well and put it back together. As long as nothing strikingly big seems wrong I would run it. Rod

Bruce Adams · 07-25-2015, 09:58 AM

Don't forget to put some Marvel Mystery Oil in the spark plug holes to pre lube the rings and walls a day before starting, if the cylinders have been a while without moving.

mshmodela · 07-25-2015, 10:43 AM

Nice motor! wish I had a spare in which appears in that good of shape.

31pickup650 · 07-25-2015, 11:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mshmodela

Nice motor! wish I had a spare in which appears in that good of shape.

It's brand new, technically. Never been run since the rebuild.

BILL WILLIAMSON · 07-25-2015, 11:21 AM

31,
If you have great faith in your Dads' knowledge & workmanship, just clean it up & RUN IT!!
Bill W.

31pickup650 · 07-25-2015, 11:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BILL WILLIAMSON

31,
If you have great faith in your Dads' knowledge & workmanship, just clean it up & RUN IT!!
Bill W.

I do. I am just concerned with amount of grit/dirt in there and the possibility of the dried out grease.

Chuck Sea/Tac · 07-25-2015, 12:26 PM

I'd be worried the pre lube has congealed in the bearing feed holes.

Brentwood Bob · 07-25-2015, 04:00 PM

As for the cooling system: There is the likelihood of scale in the water jacket, so include that in your cleanup. Remember that when the water circulates into the radiator it will plug up the radiator.
And part of my personal protective equipment is safety shoes, or at least clean cotten soxes.
Bob

C26Pinelake · 07-25-2015, 04:15 PM

It might well be worth enlisting the help of a local Model A club expert! He would gave a good idea what to look for and what to do before and during the. Startup stage! Good luck and keep grandpa involved because I am sure if will be good for his ego! Wayne

Mike V. Florida · 07-25-2015, 11:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chuck Sea/Tac

I'd be worried the pre lube has congealed in the bearing feed holes.

I would take it apart, clean out the dust, check out the feed holes, and apply new prelube when reassembling the motor. It cannot hurt, you will not be changing anything your family did, it take only a few hours to get it done.

Why take a chance of failure in the work your Dad did for a few hours of taking things apart and putting them together again.

40 Deluxe · 07-26-2015, 04:56 AM

Have your Grand dad "supervise" the cleanup. I'm sure he'd love it as well as fill you in on a lot of history, as watching the disassembly and reassembly will trigger a lot of memories! If he doesn't live close, take a lot of videos.

07-24-2015, 09:42 PM	#1
31pickup650 Member Join Date: Oct 2013 Location: Akron, OH Posts: 71	Rebuilt Engine Question Hey guys. I have a rebuilt engine that has never been run since it was rebuilt 50 years ago. It sat in a garage without a head on it. I got it up onto the stand and pulled the pan. Theres definitely some dust in there. What's the best course of action from here? Thanks. __________________ -Noah 1931 Model A Pickup My Model A : https://www.fordbarn.com/forum/showthread.php?t=173024

07-25-2015, 12:12 AM	#2
40 Deluxe Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: now Kuna, Idaho Posts: 3,779	Re: Rebuilt Engine Question I think it would be very interesting for one of the current rebuilders to tear it down for a complete inspection. See what they did for Babbitt, etc. in 1965. Was this a factory rebuild (if I remember, in 1965 you still could buy reman A engines (even from Sears or Monkey Wards))? Or was it a local garage or local machine shop overhaul? Seems like most parts stores also had machine shops back then (one here in Flagstaff still does).

07-25-2015, 01:24 AM	#3
burner31 Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2014 Location: Shawnee, Ok Posts: 3,471	Re: Rebuilt Engine Question Give everything a good check, clean it up, assemble and start her up, see what happens. If it's good, your golden, if not, you're out a little time and some gaskets. __________________ Keith Shawnee OK '31 SW 160-B

07-25-2015, 06:32 AM	#4
Bruce Adams Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Northport, NY Posts: 1,597	Re: Rebuilt Engine Question I guess you know to pre lube everything already. Will you do a compression test prior to putting much more time into it?

07-25-2015, 08:33 AM	#6
Chris in CT Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Connecticut Posts: 272	Re: Rebuilt Engine Question Sponsored Links (Register now to hide all advertisements) Hi Noah, I notice you've got 20 posts above. Did anyone welcome you to Fordbarn? If not, welcome. If you think the interior of the engine is really dirty - and perhaps gritty would be the best description - then I think you should attempt to clean it out. If it is just congealed oil, then it might be best to leave it alone and use the procedures I would suggest below. If gritty, turn the engine on its side with the crankcase turned slightly down, and wash it out with kerosene. Do not use anything more aggressive than the kero. Use a squirt bottle or can, and don't get near any source of combustion. Collect the kerosene run-off with pans or shop towels and dispose of safely and legally. In any case, when you have re-assembled your engine, fill it with 20 weight oil for the first few break-in runs, and use standard break-in procedures for the Model A engine. Oh! Do not forget to put 2 quarts of oil in the crankcase, and two quarts down the distributor hole to fill the valve galley and main bearing feed tubes with oil before you attempt to start the engine. After about ten hours of the break-in procedure, drain the 20 weight and refill with 30 weight. Addendum: The first few times you start your engine, let it run at a fast idle until it gets hot (steam first beginning to appear at the radiator neck) then shut it down. When the engine can run at a fast idle without getting hot (steam appearing) then you can begin to take it on drives not faster than 35-40 mph. This will also allow you to snug down the head bolts several times after you re-install the head with that new head gasket.

07-25-2015, 09:37 AM	#8
Dave in MD Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Posts: 175	Re: Rebuilt Engine Question It appears that at least some of the cylinders have been sleeved. Are there any marks on the top of the pistons to indicate their size? Dave

07-25-2015, 09:47 AM	#10
Rowdy BANNED Join Date: May 2010 Location: Gothenburg Nebraska Just off I-80 Posts: 4,893	Re: Rebuilt Engine Question I would do a general clean up with mineral spirits, check clearances, possibly take it to a machine shop and have it balanced, lube it well and put it back together. As long as nothing strikingly big seems wrong I would run it. Rod __________________ Do the RIGHT thing - Support the H.A.M.B. Alliance!!!!

07-25-2015, 09:58 AM	#11
Bruce Adams Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Northport, NY Posts: 1,597	Re: Rebuilt Engine Question Don't forget to put some Marvel Mystery Oil in the spark plug holes to pre lube the rings and walls a day before starting, if the cylinders have been a while without moving.

07-25-2015, 10:43 AM	#12
mshmodela Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2014 Location: Cleveland, Ohio Posts: 2,763	Re: Rebuilt Engine Question Nice motor! wish I had a spare in which appears in that good of shape. __________________ -Mike Late 31' Ford Model A Tudor, Miss Daisy I don't work on cars --I'm learning about my Model A. Cleveland, Ohio

07-25-2015, 11:21 AM	#14
BILL WILLIAMSON Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2010 Location: FRESNO, CA Posts: 12,560	Re: Rebuilt Engine Question 31, If you have great faith in your Dads' knowledge & workmanship, just clean it up & RUN IT!! Bill W. __________________ "THE ASSISTANT GURU OF STUFF"

07-25-2015, 12:26 PM	#16
Chuck Sea/Tac Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Between Seattle & Tacoma Posts: 2,354	Re: Rebuilt Engine Question I'd be worried the pre lube has congealed in the bearing feed holes.

07-25-2015, 04:00 PM	#17
Brentwood Bob Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: brentwood, ca Posts: 4,244	Re: Rebuilt Engine Question As for the cooling system: There is the likelihood of scale in the water jacket, so include that in your cleanup. Remember that when the water circulates into the radiator it will plug up the radiator. And part of my personal protective equipment is safety shoes, or at least clean cotten soxes. Bob

07-25-2015, 04:15 PM	#18
C26Pinelake BANNED Join Date: May 2010 Location: Michigan / Ontario border, Sarnia, Ontario. 50 miles from Detroit and 150 from Toronto. Posts: 5,800	Re: Rebuilt Engine Question It might well be worth enlisting the help of a local Model A club expert! He would gave a good idea what to look for and what to do before and during the. Startup stage! Good luck and keep grandpa involved because I am sure if will be good for his ego! Wayne

07-26-2015, 04:56 AM	#20
40 Deluxe Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: now Kuna, Idaho Posts: 3,779	Re: Rebuilt Engine Question Have your Grand dad "supervise" the cleanup. I'm sure he'd love it as well as fill you in on a lot of history, as watching the disassembly and reassembly will trigger a lot of memories! If he doesn't live close, take a lot of videos.