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Old 02-24-2020, 11:22 AM   #1
Kube
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Default Now it's junk from Carpenter!

I have been a loyal customer and well, a fan, of Carpenter since 1973 or so.
It has become apparent that in the most recent years things are changing there.

Received a pair of hood supports for a '40 today. Vintique manufactured. Had I known that, I'd never have ordered them. As most of you seasoned V8ers realize, Vintique is synonymous with "junk".
The problem?
I am unable to swivel ANY of the pivot points. I may not be the strongest guy alive but Lord knows I should be able to move these.
I called Carpenter a moment ago and told them the issue. The fellow said they were aware of it. Really? And you still ship this garbage?
Got the return authorization but absolutely NO refund for my shipping fees to return.
So I am out $12 because they chose to ship a known bad product?

This is BS. My wife and I own a few businesses and on the rare occasion we "goof" we suffer ALL associated "damages". It is simply unfair for a client to lose a cent for our oversight.
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Old 02-24-2020, 11:28 AM   #2
Tim Ayers
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Default Re: Now it's junk from Carpenter!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kube View Post
I have been a loyal customer and well, a fan, of Carpenter since 1973 or so.
It has become apparent that in the most recent years things are changing there.

Received a pair of hood supports for a '40 today. Vintique manufactured. Had I known that, I'd never have ordered them. As most of you seasoned V8ers realize, Vintique is synonymous with "junk".
The problem?
I am unable to swivel ANY of the pivot points. I may not be the strongest guy alive but Lord knows I should be able to move these.
I called Carpenter a moment ago and told them the issue. The fellow said they were aware of it. Really? And you still ship this garbage?
Got the return authorization but absolutely NO refund for my shipping fees to return.
So I am out $12 because they chose to ship a known bad product?

This is BS. My wife and I own a few businesses and on the rare occasion we "goof" we suffer ALL associated "damages". It is simply unfair for a client to lose a cent for our oversight.

I've read how large companies run statistics on return calls on defective products vs. fixing the cause of the problem.

If their number crunchers think it's cheaper to deal with returns they don't make the change. If it starts costing them money, they will.

I'm sure someone like Carpenter realizes their volume is so low on these types of items/sales, they are willing to roll the dice and keep selling junk.

I agree, you were owed shipping reimbursement once they told you they realized the part was junk. Shame.

Last edited by Tim Ayers; 02-24-2020 at 01:02 PM.
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Old 02-24-2020, 11:33 AM   #3
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Default Re: Now it's junk from Carpenter!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kube View Post
I have been a loyal customer and well, a fan, of Carpenter since 1973 or so.
It has become apparent that in the most recent years things are changing there.

Received a pair of hood supports for a '40 today. Vintique manufactured. Had I known that, I'd never have ordered them. As most of you seasoned V8ers realize, Vintique is synonymous with "junk".
The problem?
I am unable to swivel ANY of the pivot points. I may not be the strongest guy alive but Lord knows I should be able to move these.
I called Carpenter a moment ago and told them the issue. The fellow said they were aware of it. Really? And you still ship this garbage?
Got the return authorization but absolutely NO refund for my shipping fees to return.
So I am out $12 because they chose to ship a known bad product?

This is BS. My wife and I own a few businesses and on the rare occasion we "goof" we suffer ALL associated "damages". It is simply unfair for a client to lose a cent for our oversight.
I'm with you KUBE. I just don't understand how people accept the way a lot of businesses handle their customers these days. Like you, I am VP of the company I work for, I had an issue from one of my suppliers getting material to my customer on time....I went to the local freight hub, picked the material up and drove it 5 hours south to the job site to make good on a promised delivery......MY EXPENSE!!!! Customer service
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Old 02-24-2020, 11:34 AM   #4
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Default Re: Now it's junk from Carpenter!

Yeah, if I get something and it comes in a Vintique package I don't even try to return it. I throw it in my plastic bins for my swap meet stalls. Don't even open it.
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Old 02-24-2020, 12:51 PM   #5
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Default Re: Now it's junk from Carpenter!

It seems I'm sensing that SOME of you folks are beginning to realize that even though many of these suppliers have invested an arm and a leg to bring us peons reproduction parts, the fact still remains that some parts of questionable or unacceptable quality just cannot be justified by rhetoric and other excuses. Like Kube notes above, if the mistake, inferior quality or other inequity is NOT the fault of the customer, the honorable and ethical thing for a supplier to do is absolve the customer from any remedial or superfluous costs, including return freight. Whatever happened to the long-standing premise that the (reasonable) customer is always right? DD
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Old 02-24-2020, 12:58 PM   #6
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Default Re: Now it's junk from Carpenter!

I learned a long time ago that the two most dangerous (because of misuse) words in the English language are "always" and "never". Sure, I have trashed some things from Vintique as from Drake and Carpenter as well, but some things they offer look right, fit right, and function correctly. And those that know me know that I am fussy about such things.
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Old 02-24-2020, 03:03 PM   #7
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Default Re: Now it's junk from Carpenter!

Quote:
Originally Posted by DavidG View Post
I learned a long time ago that the two most dangerous (because of misuse) words in the English language are "always" and "never". Sure, I have trashed some things from Vintique as from Drake and Carpenter as well, but some things they offer look right, fit right, and function correctly. And those that know me know that I am fussy about such things.
Dave, I know you and I believe you and I are pretty much on the same page.

My comments were not directed at Vintique. I know that for the most part, they peddle crap. As such, I chose not to purchase anything with their name upon it.
I bought the aforementioned hood supports from Carpenter expecting to receive the "typical" (from my extensive experience) quality part.
To top it off, the guy at Carpenter readily admitted they knew of the issue with the supports. Then, to NOT reimburse my return shipping?
Yeah, we all make mistakes and those of us that run ethical businesses accept the responsibility for said mistakes.
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Old 02-24-2020, 03:24 PM   #8
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Default Re: Now it's junk from Carpenter!

When I talked to the Carpenter guys at Hershey last October, it was obvious they were/are going through some changes. Their display had zero new parts (catalogues only)...only used parts on display. The "sales" guys had little (none?) knowledge of early Ford V-8 cars. Sure was a different scene!
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Old 02-24-2020, 05:17 PM   #9
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Default Re: Now it's junk from Carpenter!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tim Ayers View Post
I've read how large companies run statistics on return calls on defective products vs. fixing the cause of the problem.

If their number crunchers think it's cheaper to deal with returns they don't make the change. If it starts costing them money, they will.

I'm sure someone like Carpenter realizes their volume is so low on these types of items/sales, they are willing to roll the dice and keep selling junk.

I agree, you were owed shipping reimbursement once they told you they realized the part was junk. Shame.
Haha. I was just talking to a coworker on Friday about this. This is apparently how Volvo operates, which I'm guessing is par for the course in the automotive industry. Bean counters, lawyers, banks, and insurance companies have completely deconstructed what is is to be a human being.
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Old 02-24-2020, 06:08 PM   #10
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Default Re: Now it's junk from Carpenter!

I am not sure if this is true but I have heard Dennis Carpenter is having health issues and someone else is running the business now and it is not good.
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Old 02-24-2020, 06:29 PM   #11
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Default Re: Now it's junk from Carpenter!

My experience with Vintique is not poor quality. I bought the 40 Ford headlight surround chrome from Drake. Fit like crap. Sent them back and bought Vintique ones. Perfect fit and function. I see Drake as the worst quality of the 3 suppliers.
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Old 02-24-2020, 08:44 PM   #12
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Default Re: Now it's junk from Carpenter!

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Originally Posted by Ziggster View Post
Haha. I was just talking to a coworker on Friday about this. This is apparently how Volvo operates, which I'm guessing is par for the course in the automotive industry. Bean counters, lawyers, banks, and insurance companies have completely deconstructed what is is to be a human being.
Remember the Pinto gas tank problem? Ford figured it was cheaper to fight the lawsuits than fix the problem, IIRC.
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Old 02-24-2020, 11:04 PM   #13
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Default Re: Now it's junk from Carpenter!

Talk about misinformation!
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Old 02-25-2020, 08:13 AM   #14
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Default Re: Now it's junk from Carpenter!

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Originally Posted by DavidG View Post
Talk about misinformation!
Dave, this thread, like most others, has gotten completely away from the original post.
I often wish a person would read the entire thread before "piling on".
Or in the case of providing misinformation, a person would simply read beyond a headline.
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Old 02-25-2020, 08:17 AM   #15
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Default Re: Now it's junk from Carpenter!

Don't ya' just love posts that start out... "I haven't read the whole thread, but....."

It's especially common on the H.A.M.B.
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Old 02-25-2020, 08:31 AM   #16
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Default Re: Now it's junk from Carpenter!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kube View Post
Dave, this thread, like most others, has gotten completely away from the original post.
I often wish a person would read the entire thread before "piling on".
Or in the case of providing misinformation, a person would simply read beyond a headline.
Like talking politics on facebook. Sometimes the digression brings us to a better level but in most instances it involves misinterpretation or not carefully reading what was said.

A welcomed digression would be if someone said what they did to make them work. It's not what you asked but it is a solution.
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Old 02-25-2020, 08:46 AM   #17
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Default Re: Now it's junk from Carpenter!

Wonder where the parts will come from when DRAKE and Carpenter are gone?
Will that be the beginning of the end of restoring old Fords?
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Old 02-25-2020, 09:21 AM   #18
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Default Re: Now it's junk from Carpenter!

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Wonder where the parts will come from when DRAKE and Carpenter are gone?
Will that be the beginning of the end of restoring old Fords?

Look at that situation as an opportunity for a young, knowledgeable and good-lookin' rich guy like yourself to save the day for the rest of us! DD
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Old 02-25-2020, 09:23 AM   #19
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Default Re: Now it's junk from Carpenter!

Perhaps we have grown to expect excellence from the vendors. In restoring a 39 Ford Standard, I got two sets of used hood side panels (made by Ford) which differed by 1/4 of an inch so I mixed and matched to get the best fitting pair. In the late 50s most of the repro was poor quality from Argentina or functional stuff from vendors like Ricks. We made do as a NOS original was unobtainable. In restoring a 64 GTO, one vendor has noted that some of his products were not totally correct but the best he could get. So you were forewarned that some rework may be required should this be the best you can get. Maybe our V8 catalogs need such a disclaimer.
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Old 02-25-2020, 09:36 AM   #20
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Default Re: Now it's junk from Carpenter!

I wonder who made the good ones? Since 2008, a lot of restoration part and service companies have either died off or gone corporate. We all know what happens with the corporate world. It took a long time to build the restoration parts suppliers to the level that they were in 2008. It's just sad that it is now seeming to regress to what it was back in the 70s when they were few and far between. I remember the stuff available from South America back then.
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