Go Back   The Ford Barn > General Discussion > Model A (1928-31)

Sponsored Links (Register now to hide all advertisements)

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 01-30-2020, 12:30 AM   #1
warrene
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2019
Location: Milaca, MN
Posts: 16
Default Bearing fit ... engine oil gravity feed

Just finished my engine overhaul, new modern rings, valve job, new stainless steel valves, adjustable lifters. I fitted the mains and rods at .001 or less, I use 5W-20 oil same as your newer cars.
Thicker oil at low temp' can feed very slow or almost not at all down those 3 tubes to the mains, with thinner oil there's feed right away even in sub zero temps. Same goes for tranny and rear ends with this old 600 tar, until the grinding friction heats it up you have no lube on gears at all, this is what ruined tons of old cars years ago, cold weather the thick oils is a death sentence. Run 80-90 or universal tractor fluid, both are high EP lubes. Use the modern stuff, do your car a favor.

warrene
warrene is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-30-2020, 12:14 PM   #2
Jim Brierley
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: Temecula, CA
Posts: 3,139
Default Re: Bearing fit ... engine oil gravity feed

I agree, but like more clearance, .0015 minimum.
Jim Brierley is offline   Reply With Quote
Sponsored Links (Register now to hide all advertisements)
Old 01-30-2020, 12:21 PM   #3
kenparker
Senior Member
 
kenparker's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Van, Texas
Posts: 1,076
Default Re: Bearing fit ... engine oil gravity feed

i am with Jim on thsi one .0015 claearance.
kenparker is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-30-2020, 06:16 PM   #4
Chuck Sea/Tac
Senior Member
 
Chuck Sea/Tac's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Between Seattle & Tacoma
Posts: 1,829
Default Re: Bearing fit ... engine oil gravity feed

What’s your piston clearance?
Chuck Sea/Tac is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-30-2020, 07:00 PM   #5
Kurt in NJ
Senior Member
 
Kurt in NJ's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: on the Littlefield
Posts: 5,013
Default Re: Bearing fit ... engine oil gravity feed

The original bearings hold a lot of oil--- even years later there is enough in them to drip when taking apart ---
Kurt in NJ is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-30-2020, 09:02 PM   #6
Kohnke Rebabbitting
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: 60615,330th Ave.,Clare, Iowa, 50524
Posts: 1,454
Default Re: Bearing fit ... engine oil gravity feed

I agree with nothing, in post No. 1.

Herm.
Kohnke Rebabbitting is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-31-2020, 12:45 AM   #7
CWPASADENA
Senior Member
 
CWPASADENA's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: PASADENA, CA
Posts: 1,382
Default Re: Bearing fit ... engine oil gravity feed

I also agree with .0015 clearance in the bearings.


I am in Southern California and run 20/50 oil. 5/20 is way too thin when driving across the desert on a hot day.


My opinion,


Chris W.
CWPASADENA is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-31-2020, 03:14 AM   #8
28Danby
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2013
Location: Ripley, Ontario
Posts: 9
Default Re: Bearing fit ... engine oil gravity feed

Doesn't 600W in the transmission aid in shifting as it slows the gears enough to shift. Too thin of oil and your grinding gears. Correct me if I'm wrong though
28Danby is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-31-2020, 07:57 AM   #9
Patrick L.
Senior Member
 
Patrick L.'s Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Upstate NY and western Florida
Posts: 5,337
Default Re: Bearing fit ... engine oil gravity feed

Quote:
Originally Posted by 28Danby View Post
Doesn't 600W in the transmission aid in shifting as it slows the gears enough to shift. Too thin of oil and your grinding gears. Correct me if I'm wrong though


Thats correct. However some think that 600W is the weight of the oil. It isn't, its a designation. 600W is about 140-180 weight.
Patrick L. is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-31-2020, 08:26 AM   #10
Bob Bidonde
Senior Member
 
Bob Bidonde's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Long Island, NY
Posts: 1,633
Default Re: Bearing fit ... engine oil gravity feed

Bearing clearance should allow crankshaft to turn at about 75 lbs-ft of torque. I do not understand the logic of using 20W50 oil becuase at 50 viscosity, the oil flow is less than a SAE 30.
__________________
Bob Bidonde
Bob Bidonde is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-31-2020, 09:12 AM   #11
Patrick L.
Senior Member
 
Patrick L.'s Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Upstate NY and western Florida
Posts: 5,337
Default Re: Bearing fit ... engine oil gravity feed

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob Bidonde View Post
Bearing clearance should allow crankshaft to turn at about 75 lbs-ft of torque. I do not understand the logic of using 20W50 oil becuase at 50 viscosity, the oil flow is less than a SAE 30.


Bearing clearance should allow the crank to turn very easy. Ring tension is a different animal.

20W50 designation is a 20 weight oil with the film strength of 50.
Patrick L. is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-31-2020, 09:15 AM   #12
ryanheacox
Senior Member
 
ryanheacox's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2013
Location: Northwest CT
Posts: 809
Default Re: Bearing fit ... engine oil gravity feed

I'm not an engine builder but I am a mechanical engineer so if Herm or anyone else with experience corrects me I will yield but 75ft-lb just to turn the crank seems like way too much. Maybe on a fully assembled fresh engine in the car with new rings but even then it seems like too much.


When I went down to check the progress on my engine, the rebuilder had fit the crank and could spin it by hand with relative ease. Snug would be the word to describe it.
ryanheacox is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-31-2020, 12:22 PM   #13
katy
Senior Member
 
katy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2015
Location: Alberta, Canada
Posts: 2,338
Default Re: Bearing fit ... engine oil gravity feed

Quote:
I agree, but like more clearance, .0015 minimum.
Warrene's engine will open up to .0015" soon enough.
__________________
Play it again Sam.
katy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-31-2020, 12:34 PM   #14
Purdy Swoft
Senior Member
 
Purdy Swoft's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Alabama
Posts: 7,643
Default Re: Bearing fit ... engine oil gravity feed

It will probably run pretty warm until it does . I run two thousands clearance on the crankshaft bearings and run 20W50 oil
Purdy Swoft is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-31-2020, 12:59 PM   #15
Jim Brierley
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: Temecula, CA
Posts: 3,139
Default Re: Bearing fit ... engine oil gravity feed

I should be more clear on the subject. I personally run .002" clearance for street use, and .0035 piston clearance. .0025" and .008" on my race engine. 20-50 oil but synthetic racing for Bonneville. Modern oils in the gear boxes.
Jim Brierley is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-31-2020, 03:57 PM   #16
Synchro909
Senior Member
 
Synchro909's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2014
Location: Melbourne, Australia
Posts: 4,770
Default Re: Bearing fit ... engine oil gravity feed

Quote:
Originally Posted by katy View Post
Warrene's engine will open up to .0015" soon enough.
But in the mean time????
I once heard it said that there are plenty of cars running around out there with bearings that are too loose. There are no cars running around out there with bearings too tight.
I run a clearance of 0.002" and use 20W50 oil, like Purdy.
__________________
For the first half of our life we trade our health for wealth. For the second half, we trade our wealth for health.
Synchro909 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-31-2020, 05:09 PM   #17
Kohnke Rebabbitting
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: 60615,330th Ave.,Clare, Iowa, 50524
Posts: 1,454
Default Re: Bearing fit ... engine oil gravity feed

If your running a true .001 or less, on set up, the bearing has no choice but to Smear the first .010 of babbitt, or less, and that is a waste. Normal Rod clearance of a broke in engine is .002, to .003 thousandths, depending how much heat you crate, running at higher speeds.

All our bearings, we set our clearance to, .001 per inch of shaft, and always then plus a half, .000-50. So a shaft of 2.500 would get .003 thousandths clearance. Never had any problems.

We use straight 30Wt. Summer, Straight .20Wt. winter.

5-30's, and the like, do not have enough cushion of oil molecule to keep shaft, and Babbitt separated, very thin oil film.

Herm
Kohnke Rebabbitting is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-31-2020, 05:16 PM   #18
Benson
Senior Member
 
Benson's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2010
Posts: 1,979
Default Re: Bearing fit ... engine oil gravity feed

EDIT
Herm I did not see your post.

Last edited by Benson; 01-31-2020 at 05:43 PM.
Benson is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-31-2020, 05:46 PM   #19
Benson
Senior Member
 
Benson's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2010
Posts: 1,979
Default Re: Bearing fit ... engine oil gravity feed

Herm,


1. Is 20W50 oil too thick for a B Engine in Winter?


2. Too thick in Summer?


Sounds like you avoid Multi weight oils?
Benson is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-01-2020, 01:05 AM   #20
Kohnke Rebabbitting
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: 60615,330th Ave.,Clare, Iowa, 50524
Posts: 1,454
Default Re: Bearing fit ... engine oil gravity feed

Quote:
Originally Posted by Benson View Post
Herm,


1. Is 20W50 oil too thick for a B Engine in Winter? " End Quote "

It would be for me, in winter. I used 20-50 in my 1992 Ford truck, in summer, and 10-30, in Winter. It Broke a piston last fall, at 8,000 short of 400,000, it never had a wrench on it.

Had a 1967 Dodge Maxi van, that I pulled our band trailer with, and the band, of course. Had a valve go bad at 400,013 thousand, so I got a rebuilt engine from Gopher, in Minneapolis and put another 18,000 on that engine, and the crank broke, Diagonal, in the last Rod Pin. We were coming home from out in Nebraska, after playing a Bar, on Friday night, Wedding dance on Sat. night, and a Rodeo on Sunday after noon. Anyway, we drove somewhere around a 150 miles, at 30 miles an hour, and made it home, but it was really starting to pound. Gopher gave us another engine, and I sold it with 175,000 on that engine.

Had a 1974 Ford Maverick Grabber, Special order order paint, Dark Red, and White decals, only new vehicle I ever bought. After 451,000, I sold it to my girl friend, she put on 48,000, an sold it to a guy in Humboldt, Iowa. He drove it to his job at a Limestone Quarry for two years, and the driver door fell off, from rust, and he pulled the motor, and put it in a motorless pickup he had, in his back yard, and drove that to work. I never found out how many miles he put on, but his wife said that it still didn't use any oil. The Ford motors were 302's.



2. Too thick in Summer? No, I wouldn't think so.


Sounds like you avoid Multi weight oils?
" End Quote

Yes, for all the bearings we work with.

Take a little 5-30, or other multi oil, an warm some in a little saucepan, and and when you can touch it without burning yourself, put some between your index finger, and thumb, and rub them back and fourth, hard. Then do the same thing with 30-Wt., and see what you think.

I hope I didn't tell you more then I know!

Herm.
Kohnke Rebabbitting is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump

Sponsored Links (Register now to hide all advertisements)


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 11:33 PM.