The Ford Barn

Byron Warwick · 10-15-2018, 10:54 AM

I am experiencing some exhaust gasses in the radiator. I suspect it is from the right side of my 8BA engine. what experiences have Barners had like this.
What areas do I look at when I remove the head to change the gasket(s)?
Which of the head bolts go into the exhaust area?
I do not get any water or anti freeze in the exhaust manifold, nor steam/water vapor, in the tail pipe.
Cold season arrives soon so I may wait until spring, but I need your help.
Cheers, Byron.

51 MERC-CT · 10-15-2018, 11:28 AM

Of the two center most bolts, the top one goes into the center exh. port and the one below it is blind.

G.M. · 10-15-2018, 11:36 AM

Fill the radiator with water so you can see it good and you can see which side the bubbles are coming from. I would tighten the bolts and add a can of block sealer and see if it stops. G.M.

ford38v8 · 10-15-2018, 01:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by G.M.

Fill the radiator with water so you can see it good and you can see which side the bubbles are coming from. I would tighten the bolts and add a can of block sealer and see if it stops. G.M.

I disagree. Tightening the bolts will spread the crack open wider, and "block sealer" won't keep exhaust from blowing into the cooling system.

JSeery · 10-15-2018, 01:32 PM

First thing I would do is a leak-down test on each cylinder and locate the cylinder or area of the block the leak is located in/at.

Byron Warwick · 10-16-2018, 11:04 AM

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I am reasonably sure it is in the right side.
I want to pull the head to see what I can, but have not yet found a source of gaskets. I've heard of Best but where to get them? I will try in Port Huron MI, not available in Ontario.
I have tried Iron Tight, but no help.
Byron.

motordr · 10-16-2018, 12:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Byron Warwick

I am reasonably sure it is in the right side.
I want to pull the head to see what I can, but have not yet found a source of gaskets. I've heard of Best but where to get them? I will try in Port Huron MI, not available in Ontario.
I have tried Iron Tight, but no help.
Byron.

Yes, you have a great Ontario supplier of Best gaskets: Al Lambert of Gasket City in Hamilton Ontario. 1-800-335-4686. [email protected]
Ted

JSeery · 10-16-2018, 12:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Byron Warwick

I am reasonably sure it is in the right side.
I want to pull the head to see what I can, but have not yet found a source of gaskets. I've heard of Best but where to get them? I will try in Port Huron MI, not available in Ontario.
I have tried Iron Tight, but no help.
Byron.

Why pull a head until your sure what your dealing with?

Byron Warwick · 10-16-2018, 03:05 PM

I know that when running even at my regular 170 to 180 deg temp, that when I stop the antifreeze is foaming enough to run out the overflow. Recently, I left it running and the temp rose to 200+ deg, and the coolant was boiling vigorously and coming from the Right side.
I have expected this for some years and I usually run only water in the summer, so I don't lose coolant. I am a driveway repairer, and don't have access to the test equipment JSeery mentioned. I'm just trying to get some experienced answers/or guesses . Byron.

revkev6 · 10-16-2018, 03:18 PM

call around to local autoparts stores. here in new england we have autozone which will let you rent a tool for free with a credit card to hold it. just get a leakdown tester and find the bad cylinder. even a compression tester should tell you the bad cylinder.

I've had this happen before and it wasn't a head gasket. I thought it was, until I pulled the head. just to be safe, i pressure tested my block and found an exhaust port on each side of the motor was leaking exhaust pressure into the coolant. block had frozen long ago and actually had about 30" of weld in the pan rail.

JSeery · 10-16-2018, 03:43 PM

My concern would be being able to ID where the leak might be after pulling the head. It may or may not be obvious to the eye.

Byron Warwick · 10-20-2018, 11:02 AM

I read recently, that if you have exhaust gasses in the coolant, to change the head gasket.
Yesterday I brought Merlot home and ran the engine at idle . There were bubbles coming from the RHS cylinder bank. I kept it going until it was a rolling boil, and then measured the temperatures of the outside of the heads with my Laser gauge.
The right bank was running 210 to 214 Deg F, and the left bank was 10 Deg less or more.
Now what to think; first thought is right water pump is not as efficient as the LHS, and not pumping enough coolant to keep the temp in line. When running on the road the normal operating temp is 170 to 180 degrees.
Any more ideas from the Barners?
Thanks, Byron.

blucar · 10-20-2018, 11:17 AM

I think the obvious has been overlooked.. The rear exhaust bearing has failed.

JSeery · 10-20-2018, 02:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Byron Warwick

The right bank was running 210 to 214 Deg F, and the left bank was 10 Deg less or more. Byron.

Very common for flathead v8s to run several degrees different between the right and left bank. 10 deg difference would not be uncommon.

ford38v8 · 10-20-2018, 04:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by blucar

I think the obvious has been overlooked.. The rear exhaust bearing has failed.

That's not so far off the wall as you might think! Doesn't a supercharged engine have something of the sort?

marko39 · 10-21-2018, 11:28 AM

i would try flushing engine and see how much crap comes out. then see if it runs any cooler.

deuce_roadster · 10-21-2018, 11:46 AM

I believe because the center exhaust port on the block services 2 cylinders on each side, the center part of the block up by the ex valves gets hotter then either end and that is why most (not all) of the ex valve pocket and deck cracks are in the center 2 cylinders, either side.
If this was my engine I would pull the head and if no cracks are found, cross my fingers and put a new head gasket on and see if the problem goes away. Cast iron heads torque hot, aluminum heads torque cold and retorque after hot cold cycles at least 3 times until the nuts or bolts quit moving. Good luck and keep us informed.

Byron Warwick · 10-21-2018, 02:24 PM

Thanks for all your responses. I will try the Look for something after pulling the RHS head.
Still have to order the gasket. I may not get to it until Spring, when I can leave it for a time after opening. In case I have to shave the head. Winter approaches, and we have had hail yesterday, and I will have to complete my winterizing, before they close the garage. Cheers, Byron.

JSeery · 10-21-2018, 02:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by deuce_roadster

Cast iron heads torque hot, aluminum heads torque cold and retorque after hot cold cycles at least 3 times until the nuts or bolts quit moving.

I have never heard on any engine head torque specification calling for a head bolt/nut being torqued hot. Do you have a reference for that?

1934 · 10-23-2018, 04:01 PM

Byron, I've read your posts and the responses but am still a bit confused. How did you determine that you had exhaust gas in the radiator? I have a plastic bottle at the end of my overflow tube and, although it doesn't spit out any coolant, it does make a lot of "glug, glug" noises after a good run. Is that normal or maybe a sign of exhaust in the radiator?
Thanks, Doug.

marko39 · 10-24-2018, 07:43 AM

an exhaust gas analyzer ?

Byron Warwick · 10-26-2018, 11:30 AM

Yes, I used a gas analyzer, and it showed the presence of hydrocarbon vapoursin the top of the rad.
Byron.

10-15-2018, 10:54 AM	#1
Byron Warwick Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Corunna, Ontario, Canada Posts: 309	Exhaust gas in the radiator I am experiencing some exhaust gasses in the radiator. I suspect it is from the right side of my 8BA engine. what experiences have Barners had like this. What areas do I look at when I remove the head to change the gasket(s)? Which of the head bolts go into the exhaust area? I do not get any water or anti freeze in the exhaust manifold, nor steam/water vapor, in the tail pipe. Cold season arrives soon so I may wait until spring, but I need your help. Cheers, Byron. __________________ IT'S NOT YOUR AGE, IT'S YOUR ATTITUDE !

10-15-2018, 11:28 AM	#2
51 MERC-CT Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: East Hartford, Ct Posts: 5,898	Re: Exhaust gas in the radiator Of the two center most bolts, the top one goes into the center exh. port and the one below it is blind. __________________ DON'T RECALL DOING SOMETHING FOR MYSELF BASED ON SOMEONE ELSE'S LIKES OR DISLIKES

10-15-2018, 11:36 AM	#3
G.M. Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Florida and Penna. Posts: 4,471	Re: Exhaust gas in the radiator Fill the radiator with water so you can see it good and you can see which side the bubbles are coming from. I would tighten the bolts and add a can of block sealer and see if it stops. G.M. __________________ www.fordcollector.com

10-15-2018, 01:32 PM	#5
JSeery Member Emeritus Join Date: Nov 2012 Location: Wichita KS Posts: 16,132	Re: Exhaust gas in the radiator First thing I would do is a leak-down test on each cylinder and locate the cylinder or area of the block the leak is located in/at.

10-16-2018, 11:04 AM	#6
Byron Warwick Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Corunna, Ontario, Canada Posts: 309	Re: Exhaust gas in the radiator Sponsored Links (Register now to hide all advertisements) I am reasonably sure it is in the right side. I want to pull the head to see what I can, but have not yet found a source of gaskets. I've heard of Best but where to get them? I will try in Port Huron MI, not available in Ontario. I have tried Iron Tight, but no help. Byron. __________________ IT'S NOT YOUR AGE, IT'S YOUR ATTITUDE !

10-16-2018, 03:05 PM	#9
Byron Warwick Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Corunna, Ontario, Canada Posts: 309	Re: Exhaust gas in the radiator I know that when running even at my regular 170 to 180 deg temp, that when I stop the antifreeze is foaming enough to run out the overflow. Recently, I left it running and the temp rose to 200+ deg, and the coolant was boiling vigorously and coming from the Right side. I have expected this for some years and I usually run only water in the summer, so I don't lose coolant. I am a driveway repairer, and don't have access to the test equipment JSeery mentioned. I'm just trying to get some experienced answers/or guesses . Byron. __________________ IT'S NOT YOUR AGE, IT'S YOUR ATTITUDE !

10-16-2018, 03:18 PM	#10
revkev6 Senior Member Join Date: Nov 2012 Location: western Mass Posts: 365	Re: Exhaust gas in the radiator call around to local autoparts stores. here in new england we have autozone which will let you rent a tool for free with a credit card to hold it. just get a leakdown tester and find the bad cylinder. even a compression tester should tell you the bad cylinder. I've had this happen before and it wasn't a head gasket. I thought it was, until I pulled the head. just to be safe, i pressure tested my block and found an exhaust port on each side of the motor was leaking exhaust pressure into the coolant. block had frozen long ago and actually had about 30" of weld in the pan rail.

10-16-2018, 03:43 PM	#11
JSeery Member Emeritus Join Date: Nov 2012 Location: Wichita KS Posts: 16,132	Re: Exhaust gas in the radiator My concern would be being able to ID where the leak might be after pulling the head. It may or may not be obvious to the eye.

10-20-2018, 11:02 AM	#12
Byron Warwick Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Corunna, Ontario, Canada Posts: 309	Re: Exhaust gas in the radiator I read recently, that if you have exhaust gasses in the coolant, to change the head gasket. Yesterday I brought Merlot home and ran the engine at idle . There were bubbles coming from the RHS cylinder bank. I kept it going until it was a rolling boil, and then measured the temperatures of the outside of the heads with my Laser gauge. The right bank was running 210 to 214 Deg F, and the left bank was 10 Deg less or more. Now what to think; first thought is right water pump is not as efficient as the LHS, and not pumping enough coolant to keep the temp in line. When running on the road the normal operating temp is 170 to 180 degrees. Any more ideas from the Barners? Thanks, Byron. __________________ IT'S NOT YOUR AGE, IT'S YOUR ATTITUDE !

10-20-2018, 11:17 AM	#13
blucar Senior Member Join Date: Jul 2010 Location: Ventura, CA Posts: 2,464	Re: Exhaust gas in the radiator I think the obvious has been overlooked.. The rear exhaust bearing has failed. __________________ Bill.... 36 5 win cpe

10-21-2018, 11:28 AM	#16
marko39 Senior Member Join Date: Oct 2016 Location: harpursville ny Posts: 1,040	Re: Exhaust gas in the radiator i would try flushing engine and see how much crap comes out. then see if it runs any cooler.

10-21-2018, 11:46 AM	#17
deuce_roadster Senior Member Join Date: Oct 2011 Location: Shelton, WA Posts: 3,799	Re: Exhaust gas in the radiator I believe because the center exhaust port on the block services 2 cylinders on each side, the center part of the block up by the ex valves gets hotter then either end and that is why most (not all) of the ex valve pocket and deck cracks are in the center 2 cylinders, either side. If this was my engine I would pull the head and if no cracks are found, cross my fingers and put a new head gasket on and see if the problem goes away. Cast iron heads torque hot, aluminum heads torque cold and retorque after hot cold cycles at least 3 times until the nuts or bolts quit moving. Good luck and keep us informed.

10-21-2018, 02:24 PM	#18
Byron Warwick Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Corunna, Ontario, Canada Posts: 309	Re: Exhaust gas in the radiator Thanks for all your responses. I will try the Look for something after pulling the RHS head. Still have to order the gasket. I may not get to it until Spring, when I can leave it for a time after opening. In case I have to shave the head. Winter approaches, and we have had hail yesterday, and I will have to complete my winterizing, before they close the garage. Cheers, Byron. __________________ IT'S NOT YOUR AGE, IT'S YOUR ATTITUDE !

10-23-2018, 04:01 PM	#20
1934 Senior Member Join Date: Jul 2010 Location: Quebec, Canada Posts: 415	Re: Exhaust gas in the radiator Byron, I've read your posts and the responses but am still a bit confused. How did you determine that you had exhaust gas in the radiator? I have a plastic bottle at the end of my overflow tube and, although it doesn't spit out any coolant, it does make a lot of "glug, glug" noises after a good run. Is that normal or maybe a sign of exhaust in the radiator? Thanks, Doug.

10-24-2018, 07:43 AM	#21
marko39 Senior Member Join Date: Oct 2016 Location: harpursville ny Posts: 1,040	Re: Exhaust gas in the radiator an exhaust gas analyzer ?

10-26-2018, 11:30 AM	#22
Byron Warwick Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Corunna, Ontario, Canada Posts: 309	Re: Exhaust gas in the radiator Yes, I used a gas analyzer, and it showed the presence of hydrocarbon vapoursin the top of the rad. Byron. __________________ IT'S NOT YOUR AGE, IT'S YOUR ATTITUDE !