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Old 02-13-2020, 10:17 AM   #1
Cad5670
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Hello,

I am new to the Model A and the Ford Barn but have already found lots of info here. Got some other cars and bikes but no one seems so well explored as the Model A! I got my -31 Coupe a couple of years ago but haven't been able to start on the project until recently. It is fairly complete but missing some ignition parts and other stuff so I haven't started it yet. I purchased Les Andrews Mechanics Handbook which has been of great help but I still have lots of questions!
My current focus is to start up the engine, then look over brakes and chassie. The body is off so very easy to get to everything. Before trying to start up the engine I pulled the oil pan and that was lucky, what a mess! Saw the trick to drop the pan on the floor to release the baffle and that worked like a charm. But apart from the baffle there were also the spring under the oil pump, corroded in pieces and also another piece I don't know were it belongs, see pics.

So, some questions:


1. This little clip was found in the oil pan, what is it? See pics below.

2. The oil pump cover was heavily corroded at the outer dia, can that be ground down to the dia of the oil pump housing or does that affect the suction ability of the pump?

3. Same with the tin cover over the pump net, can it be shortened a bit to remove the corroded bottom part?

4. What is the thread size in the block just outside the oil pump? Les Andrews book says it is some strange thread I've never heard of.

5. Is there supposed to be gaskets at the oil pump bottom cover and at the tin cover where it attaches to the pump body?

6. One of the ears for the screw that secure the tin cover to the pump body is broken in half. It was a screw installed and it engages the threads in the piece that is remaining on the pump but didn't need much effort to remove. Can I leave this screw out or repair the pump with JB Weld or similar? Don't want to weld on the pump and don't want to drop a screw or have any JB Weld break off.

7. The valve clearance is from .030" to .040"(!) on all valves. I have inspected the cam from underneath and no wear on the cam, looks and feels good. It is non-adjustable lifters. What can cause this enourmous clearence?

8. Is "Emergency brake" the same as the parking brake? Is it really used as Emergency brake (ie. is the service brake that unreliable that an Emergency brake is needed?)?


Sorry, lots of questions but I am really thrilled by this little car, so simple and fun to work on.


Thanks,
Hans
Sweden
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Old 02-13-2020, 10:35 AM   #2
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Hello,
4. What is the thread size in the block just outside the oil pump? Les Andrews book says it is some strange thread I've never heard of.

Thanks,
Hans
Sweden
Could that be the plug on the outside of the engine? It is ⅛"-27 NPT pipe thread. Referred to ⅜-27F-PTF
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Old 02-13-2020, 10:47 AM   #3
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Trying to help where I can:


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Originally Posted by Cad5670 View Post

3. Same with the tin cover over the pump net, can it be shortened a bit to remove the corroded bottom part?


Probably, but you don't want to shorten it much. How much is a bit?


4. What is the thread size in the block just outside the oil pump? Les Andrews book says it is some strange thread I've never heard of.


I think you're talking about the 1/8" NPT plug in the side of the block?


5. Is there supposed to be gaskets at the oil pump bottom cover and at the tin cover where it attaches to the pump body?


There is a gasket there. You're talking about where the tin cover screws to the pump, correct?


7. The valve clearance is from .030" to .040"(!) on all valves. I have inspected the cam from underneath and no wear on the cam, looks and feels good. It is non-adjustable lifters. What can cause this enourmous clearence?


Sounds like regular wear and tear and time for some adjustable lifters. At least they're all even. How is the rest of the valve train?


8. Is "Emergency brake" the same as the parking brake? Is it really used as Emergency brake (ie. is the service brake that unreliable that an Emergency brake is needed?)?


It is the same. Unless you have an early '28 without the separate parking brake though, you don't want to use the parking brake as an "emergency brake". Good service brakes are very reliable.
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Old 02-13-2020, 11:36 AM   #4
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Original valve lash is .012 .013 so wear is responsible for the rest.
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Old 02-13-2020, 11:41 AM   #5
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The vendors have all the parts for the oil pump.
https://modelastore.com/engine/oil-pumps-pans-related


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Old 02-13-2020, 03:25 PM   #6
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The clip looks just like a glass to headlight housing or fog light clip on old Mercedes
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Old 02-13-2020, 04:52 PM   #7
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Original valve lash is .012 .013 so wear is responsible for the rest.
Usually normal wear causes the clearance to tighten.
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Old 02-13-2020, 05:12 PM   #8
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Guten Abend Hans.

I'm only guest here, but I think, you're at all welcome. - I can give you some answers:

The jacket of the oil pump ensures that no air is sucked in whenvI can give you some answers. The jacket of the oil pump ensures that no air is sucked in when drive during a corner or when the oil level is low. Shortening is not a good idea. I soldered the corrosion holes. Oil pump seals are not installed in my engine (1928).

Valve play increases due to the addition of oil carbon or wear.

The handbrake is designed to lock the car. In an emergency, also for hard blocking the brake shoe hits and bends. Therefore not suitable for braking while driving.


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Old 02-14-2020, 02:02 AM   #9
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Like others have said, the hand brake on all but the early 28's is not really an emergency brake as such. You can really turn your rear brakes into a mess by using the parking brake as an emergency brake while moving. It works great to secure a car at rest, but the bands and the supports for the parking brake lack totally in strength for a car in motion.
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Old 02-14-2020, 11:14 AM   #10
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Like others have said, the hand brake on all but the early 28's is not really an emergency brake as such. You can really turn your rear brakes into a mess by using the parking brake as an emergency brake while moving. It works great to secure a car at rest, but the bands and the supports for the parking brake lack totally in strength for a car in motion.
Yeah, I found that out the hard way, but at the time, it beat the alternative!
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Old 02-14-2020, 12:01 PM   #11
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Re the clip in the photos, not an A part unless it was part of a piston skirt expander of some sort. Look at the pistons and see if others have something like it installed. Otherwise, something that got dropped in the pan at some point and was not removed.
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Old 02-16-2020, 02:20 PM   #12
Cad5670
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Hello and thanks for the replies, much appreciated.

I cleaned out the oil pan and that was the worst mess I have seen in a oil pan! There were some pinholes in the pan and the bottom of the baffles dividers looked liked something had eaten on them. Must have been a really bad acid in that pan. So I have to tear the engine apart totally for a check. Another of the projects in bits and pieces...

I'll check the pistons for any signs of clips like the one found, otherwise I'll donate it to the local Mercedes club.

Yes, it is the plug on the outside of the block and it is confirmed 1/8" NPT, thanks. Never heard of it referred to as 3/8"-27F-PTF.

”A bit” is 3/8” in this case. It looks like the oil pan rat has chewed on the pump tin cover as well.

But no need to shorten the tin cover or other parts, I checked some US vendors and all parts seem to be available and to fair prices as well.

But how is quality?

My experience with aftermarket parts tells me most is junk and can maybe be used as raw material and needs adjustment or modification to some extent. Is that the same for Model A parts?

Werner, I see you are from Germany, do you know of any good parts supplier in Germany or within EU?
US currency exchange rates is quite bad now so if available in Europe I am glad for any hints.


And finally, this is my 3rd attempt to reply to this post, first disappeared when I previewed, the second just vanished in the middle of writing, is this a known bug or am I just out of luck (again…)?

Hans
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Old 02-16-2020, 02:50 PM   #13
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Guten Abend Hans.
The parts sold here in G. come from the USA dealers. I order there very often. The quality of the US products was good as it should be in 90% of the parts.
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