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Old 10-14-2019, 04:09 PM   #1
Werner
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Default I need help to overhaul 7-tooth steering

Help to overhaul 7-tooth steering.

I have some questions about the renovation of the steering gear.

1) Is it normal that the splines of the steering wheel shaft show such extreme deformations?

2) The plain bearing seat of the steering wheel shaft is very rough. Is that also usual? I think that should be a very smooth surface.

I thank you in advance for any helpful advice!
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Ford Model A Roadster, 1928
Citroen 11 CV, 1947
Honda CB 450 K 1, 1968
Hercules Wankel Rotary Engine, 1976 (Canadian version)
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Old 10-14-2019, 11:41 PM   #2
Russ/40
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Default Re: I need help to overhaul 7-tooth steering

Your first photo looks like the splined area on the steering shaft for the worm gear. They usually are not that bad when removing the worm gear. You can probably clean that up a lot, but dont go so far as to make a tight fitting new worm impossible. The wear on the bottom bearing surface is typical. You can get an undersize bushing for that, and you will need to turn the shaft on a lathe to fit the new bushing.
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Old 10-15-2019, 10:54 AM   #3
burner31
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Default Re: I need help to overhaul 7-tooth steering

Damn, posted wrong one...hang on

Try this link for the seven tooth
https://1929modelaford.blogspot.com/...ven-tooth.html
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Last edited by burner31; 10-15-2019 at 11:03 AM.
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Old 10-15-2019, 11:44 AM   #4
denniskliesen
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Default Re: I need help to overhaul 7-tooth steering

Consider how much the cost for machine work as opposed to a new shaft with worm gear installed. The bottom end of the shaft wear is usually from contamination and or loss of lubrication. Machining welding has to be extremely precise otherwise you will have tightness or loose as the steering shaft is turned. The 7 tooth is a leaker and you must check it often. Considering how much money you can spend on these 7 tooth, I’d strongly recommend a Randy Gross steering box if you plan on driving it much.
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Old 10-15-2019, 03:45 PM   #5
Werner
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Default Re: I need help to overhaul 7-tooth steering

Good evening all together.

Hallo Russ. I equalized the splines of teeth a bit. The old worm glides easily, the new worm is probably only by vigorous pressing on the splined shaft. Question: Does the worm have to be mounted sliding, or does it have to be stuck at the end?


Hallo Burner. The link is known to me. It is a citizen of Switzerland. But unfortunately he is answering something silently.


Hallo Dennis. I am redoing all bearings. Wherever the material thickness of the bearing bushes allows, I also leave the rough bearing seats of the spindle fine lathe. In addition, I let drill the outer bearing seat of the segmentwell in order to use the Simmering there. I drive about 3000 ml a year with the Little Green Roadster.
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Honda CB 450 K 1, 1968
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Old 10-15-2019, 09:36 PM   #6
Rich in Tucson
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Default Re: I need help to overhaul 7-tooth steering

The new worm should be a press fit. I use a 20 ton press that is barely adequate to remove old gears but has no problem installing new ones. The gear is pressed on beyond the groove in the splines which is for a circular keeper which is covered by the recess in the gear. Your lower bearing surface looks better than that on a NOS shaft I have!
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Old 10-16-2019, 12:25 AM   #7
Tudortomnz
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Default Re: I need help to overhaul 7-tooth steering

Werner, you probably do not have it, but I would recommend Les Pearsons book 'The Complete Model A Ford Restoration Manual which you should be able to get from the US A parts vendors. It has a very complete section on the 7 tooth steering box, also the 2 tooth Gemmer types. [Photos, text]. These 7 tooths require a concentric bush to remove wear/ play . I know the author but do not benefit from sales!
Cheers.
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Old 10-16-2019, 11:53 AM   #8
Russ/40
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Default Re: I need help to overhaul 7-tooth steering

Hallo Russ. I equalized the splines of teeth a bit. The old worm glides easily, the new worm is probably only by vigorous pressing on the splined shaft. Question: Does the worm have to be mounted sliding, or does it have to be stuck at the end?

Yes, the new worm needs to be a press fit on the old shaft. Some judgement needed there to assure it will not move after it is positioned. Locktight it if in doubt.
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Old 10-18-2019, 09:52 AM   #9
M2M
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Default Re: I need help to overhaul 7-tooth steering

Quote:
Originally Posted by denniskliesen View Post
Consider how much the cost for machine work as opposed to a new shaft with worm gear installed. The bottom end of the shaft wear is usually from contamination and or loss of lubrication. Machining welding has to be extremely precise otherwise you will have tightness or loose as the steering shaft is turned. The 7 tooth is a leaker and you must check it often. Considering how much money you can spend on these 7 tooth, Id strongly recommend a Randy Gross steering box if you plan on driving it much.



So what is the price difference between rebuilding a 7 tooth with new parts and the Gross box?
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Old 10-18-2019, 10:03 AM   #10
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Default Re: I need help to overhaul 7-tooth steering

Depends on whether you would be doing the (substantial amount of) machining yourself, paying someone local to do it, or having one of the Model A vendors do it.
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Old 10-18-2019, 02:53 PM   #11
Werner
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Default Re: I need help to overhaul 7-tooth steering

Thank you for the many hints!

I know the rebuilt with eccentric brass bearing. But the conversion to eccentric bearings is not possible for my self. But to make that from a foreign company is too complicated, too uncertain and very expensive.

The steering spindle for the lower and upper surface for the bronze bearings is now made fine-turned, otherwise the new bushings are quickly worn.

The new worm tooth wheel I will additionally impress with Loctite "super tight".

I do not know yet how the segment wave becomes tight. The Simmerring offered by Don Snyder III is too large in outside diameter, the milling of the seat could weaken the housing there. Maybe I'll turn in a groove for an O-ring.

I will continue to report.
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Ford Model A Roadster, 1928
Citroen 11 CV, 1947
Honda CB 450 K 1, 1968
Hercules Wankel Rotary Engine, 1976 (Canadian version)
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