Temp sender for 5 Bird

[KULTULZ]

The sensor(s) would have to be either in the cyl head or intake manifold water jacket before direction flow reaches the thermostat.

The coolant temp in the WP is much less as it is drawing cooled coolant from the radiator. You could use a brass TEE in the normal sensor outlet and use both electrical and mechanical sensors there or mount the mechanical sensor on the opposite head. If not tapped (showing welsh plug) it would have to be tapped.

[dmsfrr]

Originally Posted by KULTULZ

..... or mount the mechanical sensor on the opposite head. If not tapped (showing welsh plug) it would have to be tapped.

The temp sensor hole in the head on the driver's side takes a press-in bushing that has internal threads for the sensor. Part # 10911 (see links below)
The plugged matching hole on the passenger side looks to be the same size and may accept one of those bushings directly, but I don't have an easy way to measure them.

Sensor thread size:
'55 / '56 and earlier = 3/8 'pipe thread'
'57 and newer is 1/4 pipe thread.

http://www.classictbird.com/Bushing-...ctinfo/10911A/

http://www.classictbird.com/Bushing-...ctinfo/10911B/

.

[KULTULZ]

Originally Posted by dmsfrr

The temp sensor hole in the head on the driver's side takes a press-in bushing that has internal threads for the sensor. (see link below)

The plugged matching hole on the passenger side looks to be the same size and may accept one of those bushings directly, but I don't have an easy way to measure them.

Sensor thread size: '55/'56 = 3/8 'pipe thread' and '57+ is 1/4 pipe thread.

http://www.classictbird.com/Bushing-...ctinfo/10911A/

Did not know that... THANX!

[dmsfrr]

Originally Posted by KULTULZ

Did not know that... THANX!

It was one of many unplanned 'learning opportunities' with my retirement project.
'58 heads with the small thread bushing trying to be mixed with the larger size '55/'56 temp sensor, in a 12v converted '55 needing an oem style dash temp gauge.


.

[miker98038]

I can’t remember why I got into it (not surprising these days), but I think I verified once that the same bushing would go in the pass side head. Clearance will be a problem past the dizzy, almost certainly with a capillary gauge. Anytime I have the intake off, I drill a hole right up by the thermostat on the drivers side. I’ve used direct mount temp gauges and sensors for electric fans there. It does read a little different, you can see that with an infrared thermometer.

[KULTULZ]

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Hey Guys,

Since I have not been around a Y-BLOCK since 1969..

Are these holes at either end of the head or at just one end?

Wondering In W(BY GOD)V...

[dmsfrr]

Originally Posted by KULTULZ

Hey Guys,
Since I have not been around a Y-BLOCK since 1969..
Are these holes at either end of the head or at just one end?
Wondering In W(BY GOD)V...

Both ends. At the front they are part of a water crossover thru the intake manifold. In the rear one is for the temp sensor and the other is plugged. When new the heads are not specific to the right or left side of the engine, but...

Left and right hand heads.
Although all Y-Block heads can be installed on either side of the block, after years of exposure to coolant the .906" holes at the front of the intake surface will not accept a freeze plug. When choosing heads to be rebuilt be sure you have a usable left and right.

http://www.ford-y-block.com/assemblyerrors.htm
.

[KULTULZ]

Originally Posted by dmsfrr

Both ends.

1) At the front they are part of a water crossover thru the intake manifold.

2) In the rear one is for the temp sensor and the other is plugged. When new the heads are not specific to the right or left side of the engine, but...

Left and right hand heads.

Although all Y-Block heads can be installed on either side of the block, after years of exposure to coolant the .906" holes at the front of the intake surface will not accept a freeze plug. When choosing heads to be rebuilt be sure you have a usable left and right.

http://www.ford-y-block.com/assemblyerrors.htm

MORE EXCELLENT INFORMATION!

I am learning ...

When I was dealing with fifties cars (late sixties), the Y-BLOCK was pretty much old tech compared to where the SBC had evolved and the first thing you did was look for a cheap take-out FE.

It is amazing (to me anyways) how far this engine series has progressed from 1957.

[KULTULZ]

I stumbled across this-

Small Cylinder Head Plug The right hand (passenger side) cylinder head on all 292/312 engines have a cupped plug pressed into the rear of the head . The 1949-1959 FORD CAR PARTS AND ACCESSORIES TEXT CATALOG list it as P/N EAN 6052-A- cup type-.914"/.920"O.D.-.32"overall length.

It has not been available for several years from FoMoCo dealers. I have received several calls recently about the availability of this plug. It can be obtained from most parts dealers such as NAPA. It is made by CLEVITE Engine Parts, ,Collierville TN P/N 219-3077.

SOURCE- https://www.ctci.org/gilsgarage/Smal...erheadplug.php

Gil's Garage
Gil Baumgartner
CTCI Authenticity Chairman
Small cylinder head plug

[quinn-grant]

I hope this isn't considered a necro-post, but i just found this thread and am having a related issue. I purchased a B6C-10884 sender online and received the one pictured below. It has 5/8" threads instead of the 3/8" I need for a '56 thunderbird.

Is the B6C-10884 different than the B6C-10884-A? Maybe I got something intended for a truck or other passenger car. In any case I'll be returning this unit. Thank you for any advice!

[dmsfrr]

Originally Posted by quinn-grant

I hope this isn't considered a necro-post, but i just found this thread and am having a related issue. I purchased a B6C-10884 sender online and received the one pictured below. It has 5/8" threads instead of the 3/8" I need for a '56 thunderbird.
. . .

Are you measuring the outside diameter of the male threads and getting approx 5/8 inch?
If yes it is the correct one for a '56. Those threads are tapered *NPT/pipe thread* and not measured the same way as bolt threads. Pipe thread is a plumbing thing, measured by the inside diameter of the pipe not the dia of the threads.
A 5/8 dia for the threads is the correct 3/8 'pipe size' for a '56 T-Bird temp sensor.

Did you compare the new one to the existing temp sensor in the head?
Is it the same size? IIRC there are only 2 sizes for Ford Y-block engines.
If the one in the head is the smaller size (photo #1 below) it's probably a '57+ head.

http://www.ford-y-block.com/cylinderheadchart.htm
.

[quinn-grant]

Originally Posted by dmsfrr

Are you measuring the outside diameter of the male threads and getting approx 5/8 inch?
If yes it is the correct one for a '56. Those threads are tapered *NPT/pipe thread* and not measured the same way as bolt threads. Pipe thread is a plumbing thing, measured by the inside diameter of the pipe not the dia of the threads.
A 5/8 dia for the threads is the correct 3/8 'pipe size' for a '56 T-Bird temp sensor.

Did you compare the new one to the existing temp sensor in the head?
Is it the same size? IIRC there are only 2 sizes for Ford Y-block engines.
If the one in the head is the smaller size (photo #1 below) it's probably a '57+ head.

http://www.ford-y-block.com/cylinderheadchart.htm
.

You called it. Pulled the sender and it's exactly like the small one in your picture. Looks like whoever did the unleaded valve seat conversion back in '99 got lazy and grabbed some heads with already hardened seats. Thanks for your help!!

[dmsfrr]

Originally Posted by quinn-grant

. . . Looks like whoever did the unleaded valve seat conversion back in '99 got lazy and grabbed some heads with already hardened seats. . . .

Maybe just an over the counter 'swap' from the machine shop and the prev owner accidentally got back a newer / '57+ set?
If you're curious what year heads you've got...
http://www.ford-y-block.com/cylinderheadchart.htm

There is no temp sensor that fits into the smaller hole that will let an oem '56 temp gauge work right.
A '56 gauge & sensor need to be a year matched pair to have any chance of indicating the temp correctly.
Been there, done that. (reply #24 above)
It is possible to re-thread the bushing in the head to fit the larger ('56) temp sensor.

Was an incorrect or a non-existant temp reading your original "related issue" ?

[quinn-grant]

Originally Posted by dmsfrr

Maybe just an over the counter 'swap' from the machine shop and the prev owner accidentally got back a newer / '57+ set?
If you're curious what year heads you've got...
http://www.ford-y-block.com/cylinderheadchart.htm


It is possible to re-thread the bushing in the head to fit the larger ('56) temp sensor.

Was an incorrect or a non-existant temp reading your original "related issue" ?

My original issue was difficult starting after running for long periods, which I assume is just a hot starter. That led me to noticing that the temp gauge never moved (other than going from H to C when ignition was on).

So the fun continues! Received my '57 sender in the mail, and even it is way too large to fit! Finally doing what I should have done first, I measured the sender from the car -- according to NPT guidelines it's a 1/8" NPT. Using a magnifying glass, I found "TS-17" stamped on the sender bolt head. According to the Interwebs, this is a replacement for anything from a '63 Ranchero to a '71 Pinto!

The Good news is I now know exactly what I need to order. The bad news is I have no Earthly idea where these heads came from, and there's no easily viewable stamps without removing valve covers and/or exhaust manifold.

Thank you for all your help! Your engine looks gorgeous by the way -- mine, not so much!

Regards,
Matt Reeves

[dmsfrr]

Originally Posted by quinn-grant

. . . I measured the sender from the car -- according to NPT guidelines it's a 1/8" NPT. . . .
The bad news is I have no Earthly idea where these heads came from, and there's no easily viewable stamps without removing valve covers and/or exhaust manifold.

Thank you for all your help! Your engine looks gorgeous by the way -- mine, not so much!

Regards,
Matt Reeves

Is there a reducer bushing or something to get it to that smaller size?

Depending on what year the heads are, and if you've got a small mirror, you might find the casting numbers here (yellow circles, photo 1). The numbers on these heads are also in the same spots on the rear of the heads.

Thanks, it took me long enough.
The previous photo and these two are about 2 yrs old, and took a bit longer to get this far.
Keep working on it, you'll get there.
.

[quinn-grant]

Originally Posted by dmsfrr

Is there a reducer bushing or something to get it to that smaller size?

Depending on what year the heads are, and if you've got a small mirror, you might find the casting numbers here (yellow circles, photo 1). The numbers on these heads are also in the same spots on the rear of the heads.

.

The hole for the sender appears to be stock. The only numbers on the heads where you indicate are "6090-D", which apparently is just the standard Ford designation for cylinder heads. I'm afraid the casting numbers will be behind the exhaust manifolds, and I'm not up for that just yet!

So I got the new sender installed, but no change. I shorted the connector lead directly to ground, and the needle goes from H to C in less than 5 seconds when I turn up the ignition. When connected to the sender, the needle takes well over a minute to go down to C. Maybe need to clean the block grounding strap (if there is one)? The new sender came with thread tape on it, so maybe I need to cut some of that off as well. I'll keep playing around with it. Thanks again for all your advice!

r/
Matt

[KULTULZ]

Originally Posted by quinn-grant

So I got the new sender installed, but no change. I shorted the connector lead directly to ground, and the needle goes from H to C in less than 5 seconds when I turn up the ignition. When connected to the sender, the needle takes well over a minute to go down to C. Maybe need to clean the block grounding strap (if there is one)? The new sender came with thread tape on it, so maybe I need to cut some of that off as well. I'll keep playing around with it. Thanks again for all your advice!

r/
Matt

The 56 FORD/BIRD had a unique wiring system which has been described very well within this thread.

If the replacement sender you have received requires a CONSTANT VOLTAGE REGULATOR within the circuit, it will not give a correct reading.

Only the B6C 10884-A sender will work.

The only choice I see is to install the correct bushing and that may require more effort and money that you want to deal with.

The bushing, while fairly easily replaced, may have corrosion damage in the head at the bushing and when pulled out may not reseal properly requiring an overbore and OS bushing (removing head).