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Old 07-27-2019, 03:46 PM   #1
woofa.express
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Default Take a gander at this.

My buddy Phillip is in Oshkosh at the world renowned airshow. Here are 2 pictures he sent me. You will recognize the engine.
I don't understand why the builder of this aeroplane, serial number 0000000001 has positioned the radiator in the line of sight. His or her neck must be sore by the time they reach their destination from craning to see in front.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg model a engine 1.JPG (52.0 KB, 1019 views)
File Type: jpg model a engine 2.JPG (53.6 KB, 890 views)
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Old 07-27-2019, 04:28 PM   #2
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Default Re: Take a gander at this.

That airplane is a Pietenpol Air Camper. Was one of the early home built experimental aircraft circa 1932. Bernard Pietenpol, the original creator of this design, first had a single place model circa 1929 that used a Model T engine.
These aircraft have been built from plans and still are today, ever since Pietenpol started selling the plans way back when.
Most of these aircraft run more modern 4 cylinder opposed light aircraft engines. But the purist, prefer the original Model A engine with a high compression head. The radiator is positioned out of neccesity and is the original setup. Makes for a very warm ride in the summer!
Below is a pic of my Grega GN1 which is a modification of the same aircraft. I will probably go with an engine from a 1940's light aircraft vs. the Model A engine.
On the other side of my hangar is a pic of my 1946 J3 Cub and my Van's RV4.
Not only addicted to cars, I like airplanes too!
My wife tells me it would be easier to collect motorcycles. Please don't get me started.
Tom L.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg Pietenpol.jpg (58.8 KB, 607 views)
File Type: jpg RV4 J3.jpg (51.0 KB, 574 views)

Last edited by Dirtrack49; 07-27-2019 at 04:50 PM. Reason: year model
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Old 07-27-2019, 04:30 PM   #3
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Default Re: Take a gander at this.

Love to see more pics of the engine area. There doesn't seem to be a fan so is there an auxiliary pump. Also the exhaust is intriguing. Why does number 4 only appear to have a muffler.
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Old 07-27-2019, 04:48 PM   #4
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Default Re: Take a gander at this.

I helped a friend with a Pietenpol and offered him an A engine. He chose a C series Continental which I think was a good choice, all things considered. As reliable as we know the A engine is, I doubt I'd strap my fanny in one with that engine.
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Old 07-27-2019, 04:59 PM   #5
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Default Re: Take a gander at this.

Most guys put Continental A65, A75, or C85 engines in these aircraft. However, there are several with Corvair engines and just about anything else you can think of. I happen to have a Franklin 90hp that may end up in mine.
I live in the mountains and the density of altitude can be pretty scary in the summer. The more power the better.
Here's another pic of an A engine installation.
Tom L.
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File Type: jpg Piet rt ft.jpg (80.8 KB, 479 views)
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Old 07-27-2019, 05:02 PM   #6
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Default Re: Take a gander at this.

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dirtrack49 View Post
That airplane is a Pietenpol Air Camper. Was one of the early home built experimental aircraft circa 1932. Bernard Pietenpol, the original creator of this design, first had a single place model circa 1929 that used a Model T engine.
These aircraft have been built from plans and still are today, ever since Pietenpol started selling the plans way back when.
Most of these aircraft run more modern 4 cylinder opposed light aircraft engines. But the purist, prefer the original Model A engine with a high compression head. The radiator is positioned out of neccesity and is the original setup. Makes for a very warm ride in the summer!
Below is a pic of my Grega GN1 which is a modification of the same aircraft. I will probably go with an engine from a 1940's light aircraft vs. the Model A engine.
On the other side of my hangar is a pic of my 1949 J3 Cub and my Van's RV4.

Not only addicted to cars, I like airplanes too!
My wife tells me it would be easier to collect motorcycles. Please don't get me started.
Tom L.



Hi Tom, that was great. I have never seen even a picture of one in the past. I'd never even heard of one. I had assumed it was a recent build by "Uncle Guru", have I got the name correct. Donald Duck's uncle.? I had a beautiful Cub, gave it to my son and he traded it for a C180. I was disappointed but kept that to myself, after all I did tell him it was his aeroplane. I think the RV series are the best private planes in the world. My favourites being the 7 and 9. I have had 15 aeroplanes, mostly ag but have sold them all. My licence expires in 3 weeks and I don't plan on renewing it. I've had 51 years of cropdusting and feel I've had sufficient. Maybe I should start an album in this forum.
thanks for that welcome information on that Pietenpol. gary
Attached Images
File Type: jpg cub6.jpg (19.0 KB, 157 views)
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Old 07-27-2019, 05:12 PM   #7
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Default Re: Take a gander at this.

Quote:
Originally Posted by flatford39 View Post
Love to see more pics of the engine area. There doesn't seem to be a fan so is there an auxiliary pump. Also the exhaust is intriguing. Why does number 4 only appear to have a muffler.

Hi Flat ford. you will notice the engine is facing rear to the front and what you figured was a muffler was a hot air catchment and I figure it was for the carby to prevent or clear carb icing. It certainly wouldn't be for pilot heating for as Tom said it's fairly warm sitting directly behind the radiator.
Did you see Tom had one hanging up in his shed along with 2 other going aeroplanes. I just hadn't expected to learn of any others apart from the display at Oshkosh. That's amazing.
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Old 07-27-2019, 05:23 PM   #8
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Default Re: Take a gander at this.

Gary, don't stop flying!
I have been doing it for over 50 years and I am now 70. Hope I can go at least another 10 years.
I once met a fellow at Santa Monica airport circa 1970's, that flew in "on" a 1917 Curtis Pusher. He was 93 years old at the time!
Below some more pics. One looks like it is running a Corvair engine. The Brit plane is running what appears to be a Continental.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg Pietenpol lake.jpg (60.1 KB, 301 views)
File Type: jpg Pietenpol.air.camper.g-buco a.jpg (34.0 KB, 280 views)
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Old 07-27-2019, 05:24 PM   #9
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Default Re: Take a gander at this.

Fantastic! Do the planes running other type engines have a radiator? [Is it necessary in a small plane?]. The A engine was apparently used because of the low rev. torque but you would need fail safe/back up ignition system!
Re not being able to see ahead, Charles Lindberg could not see directly ahead in Spirit of St Louis, tricky on take off & landing but he was a superb pilot. Cheers.
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Old 07-27-2019, 05:47 PM   #10
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Default Re: Take a gander at this.

Yet another Model A "Piet".
The only ones I have seen with radiators are with a Ford Model A engine producing hopefully 50 h.p. at sea level with a high compression head. At my altitude, I would never get off the ground in the summer. Even with a Continental A65 it would be scary. My Cub is running a C85 which can get me out of most mountain strips. Most everyone with old planes here in the mountains run at least 85 hp engines.
Tom L.
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File Type: jpg Piet Model A eng.jpg (74.0 KB, 392 views)
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Old 07-27-2019, 06:10 PM   #11
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Default Re: Take a gander at this.

The Model T Ford Club of America has a Model T version in their museum.
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Old 07-27-2019, 08:49 PM   #12
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Smile Re: Take a gander at this.

Dose any one know what type magneto the pilot has on the motor.I would dearly love to get one for my Speedster build. I would also like the plans to the motor mods as they have a modified oil pressure system. There is one been built in Northern part of the state with a two spark plug head. I too am an aircraft owner / nut owning a English Auster Series J1, a small three seat ex army obvservation aircraft of 1946 vintage, and have a 1917 Henderson motorcycle under a slow rebuild. Wife says no more..... one aircraft-two Vintage cars-two motor bikes, and a couple of hit and miss motors....she may be right.
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Old 07-27-2019, 08:57 PM   #13
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Default Re: Take a gander at this.

Go on to the Pietenpole website: can purchase plans, etc. and get a lot of info.
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Old 07-27-2019, 10:45 PM   #14
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Default Re: Take a gander at this.

Quote:
Originally Posted by 1946 View Post
Dose any one know what type magneto the pilot has on the motor.I would dearly love to get one for my Speedster build. I would also like the plans to the motor mods as they have a modified oil pressure system. There is one been built in Northern part of the state with a two spark plug head. I too am an aircraft owner / nut owning a English Auster Series J1, a small three seat ex army obvservation aircraft of 1946 vintage, and have a 1917 Henderson motorcycle under a slow rebuild. Wife says no more..... one aircraft-two Vintage cars-two motor bikes, and a couple of hit and miss motors....she may be right.


write a private message to me with your phone number. My son Dennis's in the process of overhauling a six cylinder continental and his old ones, which performed well are being replaced. I'll give you Dennis's phone number. I suspect they will be Bendix.
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Old 07-27-2019, 11:23 PM   #15
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Default Re: Take a gander at this.

His or her neck must be sore by the time they reach their destination from craning to see in front
You don't look "out the front" you look along the side and downward when taking off or landing. Nothing to see directly ahead and above you except blue sky...if the ground is that direction you're in big trouble. I've flown behind an A engine in an old Piet. Plenty of leaking oil, JB weld on a frost crack etc. Plenty of power/lift. Best sounding airplane engine EVER.
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Old 07-28-2019, 01:09 AM   #16
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Default Re: Take a gander at this.

This Model A had quite a significant racing history hereabouts in the day. It is stillabout and has twin ignition - magneto and coil.
https://www.justcars.com.au/cars-for...ter/JCM1461460
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Old 07-28-2019, 05:59 AM   #17
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Default Re: Take a gander at this.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dirtrack49 View Post
Gary, don't stop flying!
I have been doing it for over 50 years and I am now 70. Hope I can go at least another 10 years.
I once met a fellow at Santa Monica airport circa 1970's, that flew in "on" a 1917 Curtis Pusher. He was 93 years old at the time!
Below some more pics. One looks like it is running a Corvair engine. The Brit plane is running what appears to be a Continental.

Ernie Smith, Red Oak, Iowa, at 100 still had his license and and was flying. He is now in Assisted Living and has gave up flying. That was a couple of years ago. He was the oldest licensed pilot in US.



About 60 years ago, he took me up in my "47 J3 Cub and did a loop, scared the heck out of me.
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Old 07-28-2019, 06:25 AM   #18
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Default Re: Take a gander at this.

delete

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Old 07-28-2019, 11:43 AM   #19
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Default Re: Take a gander at this.

The Piet was built during the depression years, engine choice was because of cost and availability, plus it runs happiest in the right RPM's for prop efficiency. His first version was the 2-place "air camper", later built the single-place "Scout" version, Model T powered, because of requests for one that could be built even cheaper. You think it scary to fly? these engines were raced, as synchro said, successfully and reliably for many years, even at Indy, with a T powered entry finishing in 5th place one year!
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Old 07-28-2019, 02:16 PM   #20
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Re: Take a gander at this.
His or her neck must be sore by the time they reach their destination from craning to see in front
You don't look "out the front" you look along the side and downward when taking off or landing. Nothing to see directly ahead and above you except blue sky...if the ground is that direction you're in big trouble



I question my technique ?
maybe I've been doing it wrong all my life. I always figured if the trees are getting bigger I am descending and if they are getting smaller I'm ascending. it's always worked for me.
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Old 07-28-2019, 02:32 PM   #21
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Default Re: Take a gander at this.

A thankyou to both Dirtrack and Gary for your encouragement to continue flying. I have done 51 years of cropspraying and other associated agricultural jobs and I feel I'd like to quit. I've seen several crop pilots crash in their older age simply because they didn't know when to retire. Yes I still enjoy was is a fairly demanding job and I get pleasure in passing my knowledge onto the younger generation. I taught my sons to fly and they are now senior captains in airlines with names you all know and my grandson who is a trainee in the military. I have contributed to the skill of others. I will renew my licence only to teach my granddaughter Amelia. you know where that name comes from don't you. She would be the 7th in my family to fly.
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Old 07-28-2019, 06:02 PM   #22
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Talking Re: Take a gander at this.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dirtrack49 View Post
Most guys put Continental A65, A75, or C85 engines in these aircraft. However, there are several with Corvair engines and just about anything else you can think of. I happen to have a Franklin 90hp that may end up in mine.
I live in the mountains and the density of altitude can be pretty scary in the summer. The more power the better.
Here's another pic of an A engine installation.
Tom L.
What years is the Franklin, how many cylinders, and how much does it weigh?
At least you wonít have a radiator in your way!
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Old 07-28-2019, 08:26 PM   #23
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Default Re: Take a gander at this.

Chuck, I am thinking the Franklin is from the 40's. Most likely late 40's when the aircraft boom came after WWII. The log book entries I have on this boat anchor, show 1952. It might be the second log book or who knows. The books show that it was overhauled in 1964 with currently 60 some hours since major overhaul. Sounds a little scary, however, my buddy who is in his late 80's tells me to throw a somewhat balanced 2x4 on the prop hub and see if it will kick to life!
Here is another pic of a Piet. And yes, a 1917 Curtis Pusher. Seeing that Pusher come in at Santa Monica Airport circa 1974, with the 93 year old pilot, was by far the best experience in a long aviation background. I looked at my log books, and I was there at that time renewing my Flight Instructor Certificate at the old GADO office. Funny thing, the examiner, refused to go out in the aircraft I brought, a 1943 Aeronca L-3. Told me he was not about to get in something that old! Good thing is, he still renewed my certificate.
Tom L.
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File Type: jpg 1917 Curtis Pusher.jpg (44.1 KB, 96 views)
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Old 07-28-2019, 08:27 PM   #24
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Default Re: Take a gander at this.

Take a close look at Woofa's picture. It actually has 2 plugs per cylinder. One mag replaced original distributor and the 2nd mag is driven by the crank on what was the front (now back) of the engine. I saw it at Oshkosh last week.
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Old 07-28-2019, 08:42 PM   #25
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Default Re: Take a gander at this.

Dean, you have it right! Interesting observation.
A lot of guys on experimental aircraft these days, like my RV4, use one mag and one auto electronic ignition on the other set of plugs. They claim that the engine runs more efficient and you still have the redundancy.
Chuck, the 90 hp Franklin is a 4 cylinder flat opposed engine like the Continentals and Lycomings of the same era. Probably weights....I don't know off hand. Maybe 230 lbs. if I were to guess.
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Old 07-29-2019, 11:29 PM   #26
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Default Re: Take a gander at this.

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That is such a wild aircraft.

I found a video of one in flight here.

Thanks for sharing.
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Old 06-03-2020, 01:24 PM   #27
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Default Re: Take a gander at this.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dirtrack49 View Post
That airplane is a Pietenpol Air Camper. Was one of the early home built experimental aircraft circa 1932. Bernard Pietenpol, the original creator of this design, first had a single place model circa 1929 that used a Model T engine.
These aircraft have been built from plans and still are today, ever since Pietenpol started selling the plans way back when.
Most of these aircraft run more modern 4 cylinder opposed light aircraft engines. But the purist, prefer the original Model A engine with a high compression head. The radiator is positioned out of neccesity and is the original setup. Makes for a very warm ride in the summer!
Below is a pic of my Grega GN1 which is a modification of the same aircraft. I will probably go with an engine from a 1940's light aircraft vs. the Model A engine.
On the other side of my hangar is a pic of my 1946 J3 Cub and my Van's RV4.
Not only addicted to cars, I like airplanes too!
My wife tells me it would be easier to collect motorcycles. Please don't get me started.
Tom L.
Hi Tom. It was nearly a year ago that you spoke about your part built Grega. How's it going. I have owned many aeroplanes, the Bonanza my favourite. The turbine Airtractor my favourite ag plane. I did like the radial AgCat as well.
I now have none and when my licence expires in few months I shan't renew it. I've done enough. However if I was to buy an aeroplane again it would be an RV, probably the 9. They are delightful. I mention this because I see you have one. My Cub was okay but probably the best pilot trainer there is. I see you have one too. Your wife says it would be easier to collect motorbikes. My wife says Model A's are expensive but more affordable than aeroplanes.
Do get back with a details and perhaps a photo of your Grega. cheers, gary
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Old 06-03-2020, 01:31 PM   #28
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Default Re: Take a gander at this.

That's not a radiator, that's the screen for the inflight movie.
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Old 06-03-2020, 01:41 PM   #29
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Default Re: Take a gander at this.

But seriously, was that really the best place to mount the radiator? Does not make sense.
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Old 06-03-2020, 04:18 PM   #30
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Default Re: Take a gander at this.

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But seriously, was that really the best place to mount the radiator? Does not make sense.
Also, what is the reason the engine was mounted backwards? It seems like the radiator would be less obtrusive if mounted in front and provide better air flow.

David Serrano
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Old 06-03-2020, 10:44 PM   #31
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Default Re: Take a gander at this.

Quote:
Originally Posted by flatford39 View Post
Love to see more pics of the engine area. There doesn't seem to be a fan so is there an auxiliary pump. Also the exhaust is intriguing. Why does number 4 only appear to have a muffler.
Here are some pics from a few years back taken at the Brodhead WI Airport

I worry about keeping my A running on the ground....LOL

ENJOY
Attached Images
File Type: jpg Pit Plane 0001.jpg (58.2 KB, 83 views)
File Type: jpg Pit Plane 002.jpg (61.6 KB, 77 views)
File Type: jpg Pit Plane 003.jpg (45.3 KB, 75 views)
File Type: jpg Pit Plane 004.jpg (73.2 KB, 73 views)
File Type: jpg Pit Plane 005.jpg (28.1 KB, 71 views)
File Type: jpg Pit Plane 006.jpg (34.6 KB, 62 views)
File Type: jpg Pit Plane 007.jpg (55.1 KB, 64 views)
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Old 06-04-2020, 08:05 AM   #32
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Default Re: Take a gander at this.

Those old planes are def. cool! However I think you guys are crazy to fly them, LOL. I never had the flying bug, my son does and I keep telling him to take lessons so he wont regret not doing so later in life. Pop was always keen on flying (I guess thats where my son gets it), as his older brother (my uncle) was a flyer during the war and later a commercial pilot. I suppose that had a big influence on him. My brother and myself had an antique motorcycle collection at one time of about 30 bikes. They packed tightly into a 2 car garage. One of the comments we would make was that it is so much easier to house M/C's than cars!
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Old 06-04-2020, 08:13 AM   #33
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Default Re: Take a gander at this.

Quote:
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Also, what is the reason the engine was mounted backwards? It seems like the radiator would be less obtrusive if mounted in front and provide better air flow.

David Serrano
You donít want to drive the prop off the front pulley.
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Old 06-04-2020, 10:45 AM   #34
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Default Re: Take a gander at this.

Years ago a friend had a snowplane w/a Model A engine and prop at the back.
Something like this one:
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Old 06-04-2020, 12:27 PM   #35
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Default Re: Take a gander at this.

A few years back - I saw A Pieten-pole being built....as it ended up, a pilot friend bought it and finished building it. In a few test flights some how he lost engine fuel and had a forced landing. He, my pilot friend told me the Pietenpole used the Ford Model B engine most of the time and of which is what he had.
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Old 06-04-2020, 04:56 PM   #36
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Default Re: Take a gander at this.

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Originally Posted by flatford39 View Post
Love to see more pics of the engine area. There doesn't seem to be a fan so is there an auxiliary pump. Also the exhaust is intriguing. Why does number 4 only appear to have a muffler.
That is not a muffler, it is heat for the carburetor to keep it from frosting up.
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Old 06-04-2020, 05:22 PM   #37
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Default Re: Take a gander at this.

There was an article in the Secrets of Speed a while back showing one with engine
up side down but no one could tell anything about the oil dropping into the pistons.
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Old 06-04-2020, 08:22 PM   #38
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Default Re: Take a gander at this.

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Love to see more pics of the engine area. There doesn't seem to be a fan so is there an auxiliary pump. Also the exhaust is intriguing. Why does number 4 only appear to have a muffler.

No fan??? Well then, what is that thing right there on the front of the aircraft?
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Old 06-05-2020, 10:39 AM   #39
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Default Re: Take a gander at this.

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Years ago a friend had a snowplane w/a Model A engine and prop at the back.
Something like this one:
Hi Katy.
Pusher Propellers.

During my training as pilot I was always told pusher props (rear mounted) are more efficient that tractor props (forward mounted). I have never had the opportunity to fly a pusher and form an opinion for myself.

There is only 1 aeroplane manufactured today that is pusher, the Italian Piaggio. It’s very slick and has a small wing forward of the cockpit. It’s not selling well. The popular American manufacturer Beech also made one but pulled its production. It was too radical, too ahead of its time, too expensive to operate and it was a mechanics nightmare to really become a successful product to market.
The last picture is of a German short landing aeroplane. One of the difficulties for the pilot was to extract himself after releasing his seat belt.

Rutan, the man who designed the around the world without a gas stop designed a home built. The veriezi range.
A WW1 aeroplane was a pusher so as the gunner could fire away without shooting the prop off.
Of course one of the most well-known and successful aeroplanes first flew in 1903 at Kittyhawk, South Carolina.

I checked on the web and many have been designed, some built. Twin tail booms found on many tractor props add complexity and cost to the design.
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Old 06-05-2020, 10:57 AM   #40
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Default Re: Take a gander at this.

Let's not forget the Cessna Skymaster, aka the push me pull me:
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Old 06-05-2020, 11:03 AM   #41
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Default Re: Take a gander at this.

GPierce has it right, the engine is installed "backwards" so the prop is driven off the back of the crank, as in the Model A car. I think more A engines were used, because of costs, back in the day. A friend of mine had a 'T' powered Piet, the mag was driven by a bicycle chain, directly off the crank. Mags are designed with internal reduction gears, for increased RPM for their generator.
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Old 06-05-2020, 11:10 AM   #42
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Default Re: Take a gander at this.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=In406br33C4


Neat video on the oldest flying Air Camper.
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Old 06-05-2020, 05:33 PM   #43
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Default Re: Take a gander at this.

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Originally Posted by ryanheacox View Post
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=In406br33C4


Neat video on the oldest flying Air Camper.
the first I ever saw of a Pietenpol was a photo sent to me by my buddy who took the shot at a recent Oshkosh airshow. Whilst they are not numerous it would appear there are several in the USA and in flying condition. It is pleasing that enthusiastic people who care and maintain old aeroplanes and also those who build and rebuild them today.
Also too Ryanheacox, what a nice neat airstrip and hanger.
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Old 06-05-2020, 06:03 PM   #44
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Default Re: Take a gander at this.

Why was the direction of rotation changed?

I donít know but maybe a reader might inform me. When I crank my Model A the engine rotates in a clockwise direction. I speak about viewing them from the front. Likewise for all the tractors I drove. All the American IH Farmalls, and English Fergusons. They remain the same today. But why do American aeroplanes all rotate anti clockwise with the one exception that I know of. Itís the Garret turbine. There could well be more but they havenít come to my attention.
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Old 06-05-2020, 06:57 PM   #45
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Why was the direction of rotation changed?

I donít know but maybe a reader might inform me. When I crank my Model A the engine rotates in a clockwise direction. I speak about viewing them from the front. Likewise for all the tractors I drove. All the American IH Farmalls, and English Fergusons. They remain the same today. But why do American aeroplanes all rotate anti clockwise with the one exception that I know of. Itís the Garret turbine. There could well be more but they havenít come to my attention.

Not sure which engines you mean with your question about direction of rotation. The Model A in a Pietenpol rotates the same direction as any other A, but I don't know about other aircraft engines. The answer would be found in the earliest years of powered flight, I'm sure.
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Old 06-05-2020, 07:16 PM   #46
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Not sure which engines you mean with your question about direction of rotation. The Model A in a Pietenpol rotates the same direction as any other A, but I don't know about other aircraft engines. The answer would be found in the earliest years of powered flight, I'm sure.
morning Deluxe. Yes the Pietenpol is the same direction as the A and all other motor car engines and the English aeroplane engines but not the American aeroplane engines with the exception of the turbine garret. P&W,Lycoming and continental all rotate anti clockwise, ie oppersite to all these other engines, cheers, gary
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Old 06-05-2020, 08:29 PM   #47
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...
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Old 06-05-2020, 09:16 PM   #48
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Default Re: Take a gander at this.

My finances have changed or I would have one of these https://youtu.be/vyAGbf_hUds as I'd want a little more flexibility due to where and how my property lies.
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Old 06-06-2020, 12:16 PM   #49
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Default Re: Take a gander at this.

I've watched these things takeoff, fly and land but.......not sure I ever want to be in one.......
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Old 06-06-2020, 05:28 PM   #50
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I've watched these things takeoff, fly and land but.......not sure I ever want to be in one.......
yeh, me too. I'd be content to stand on the ground and watch it fly.
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Old 07-12-2020, 03:34 PM   #51
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Default Re: Take a gander at this.

Hi Gary,
Thanks for the PM. I had not been on the forum for many months. Got sidetracked working on my RV4 and other projects. Below is a pic of my Grega GN1 Aircamper. Don't know if it will ever get done. Should sell it to someone to finish.
I hope you don't stop flying. You will regret it in short order. Find yourself a Van's RV of any type and you will certainly enjoy it.
My health is deteriorating, so I may not make it to 80 flying. Will see.
Tom L.
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Old 07-14-2020, 06:21 AM   #52
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Hi Gary,
Thanks for the PM. I had not been on the forum for many months. Got sidetracked working on my RV4 and other projects. Below is a pic of my Grega GN1 Aircamper. Don't know if it will ever get done. Should sell it to someone to finish.
I hope you don't stop flying. You will regret it in short order. Find yourself a Van's RV of any type and you will certainly enjoy it.
My health is deteriorating, so I may not make it to 80 flying. Will see.
Tom L.
Hi Tom. It would be nice to finish your GN1. If you feel you won't get it finished, it would be nice to sell it to someone who will have it flying in your lifetime. That's so you can have some pleasure from it too.

It's 2120 here in the east of Au. I am watching Andrea Rieu on YouTube. His music is so exciting and exhilarating. Do you ever watch him. Such talent in his orchestra. cheers, gary
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Old 08-14-2020, 04:52 PM   #53
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Default Re: Take a gander at this.

you won't believe this unless you see it for yourself. It features things that neither you or I would never have thought about. Most features I would not want. To maintain it or service or repair it would be a nightmare. Probably best to return it to Germany for any of those requirements. But do open the clips below and it will blow your mind.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ii4HKg7hw18

there are other clips on this motor car and other futuristic motors as well.
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Old 08-14-2020, 05:17 PM   #54
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Default Re: Take a gander at this.

Glen Curtiss ? I see his name mentioned. My Grandfather and Mr Curtiss were friends. I've always thought he was a great man and did more for aviation then anyone of the time. His airplanes[ NC] made the first Atlantic crossing. I've always liked his stuff especially the Robin and the motorbikes. I helped with the moving of the museum.
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Old 08-15-2020, 09:02 PM   #55
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This is a responce to Patrick L. The previous story in this thread.

Yes it was a Curtiss aeroplane which made the first Atlantic crossing. An NC4, the N for navy (and it was built for the US navy and they crewed this flight) and C for Curtiss. The date May 1919. A 19-day flight from New York to Lisbon, Portugal. Yes Patrick, Curtiss made a very substantial contribution to early aviation and including military aeroplanes in both wars. To have a connection with Mr Curtiss would be pleasing.

The first non-stop Atlantic crossing was by a British crew, Alcock and Brown in June 1919 in a Vickers Vimy. They made an unceremonious landing - having a mishap on landing in Ireland. Four entrants were competing, departing from New Foundland. One Australian, well known Harry Hawker who suffered engine cooling failure 7 hours after takeoff and ended up in the drink.

The well known aviator who crossed the Atlantic is of course Charles Lindbergh. His claim to fame is the flight which lasted for 33 hours was solo. He would have been a very tired fellow when he landed.

I did know some of this history but needed to consult Wikipedia for details. If this information contradicts any readers opinion or knowledge it is okay by me to say so. I shan’t be offended.

pictures in order. CN4, Victers Vimy, Sopwith Atlantic and the slick Ryan built flown by Lindbergh.
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Old 08-16-2020, 05:43 AM   #56
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Default Re: Take a gander at this.

Many think that Lindberg was the first to cross the Atlantic and try to argue with you about it. He was the first to do it solo which was quite an accomplishment. The Ryan built craft was so full of fuel tanks that a periscope was needed for what little forward vision there was. Lindberg had a lot of influence in aviation after that including WW2 military flight, he advocated running lean of peak which was pretty much taboo at the time.

The first transatlantic flight was made by either 3 or 4 NC [ Navy Curtiss ] aircraft in 1919. Mr Curtiss wanted to make the flight earlier but wasn't allowed because there was a war going on at the time. One aircraft finished the flight, I think it was NC4.

Mr Curtiss first became famous thru racing motorbikes. He built great engines at the time and then realized aviators would pay 3 to 4 times more for his engines than bikers.

The Wrights were very secretive about their doings, Curtiss was not. Curtiss first flight was in Pleasant Valley and the public was welcome. Curtiss airplanes also took off under their own power, no catapults were needed as with the Wright aircrafts.

I used to enjoy working at both the Curtiss museums but have not been there for quite some time.
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Old 08-16-2020, 09:58 AM   #57
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Default Re: Take a gander at this.

Don't forget the Australian, Gordon Taylor, who pioneered a lot of trans oceanic flights. I may be wrong but I seen to recall that he was later knighted.
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Old 08-16-2020, 03:11 PM   #58
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I should have or wished I knew of Mr Taylor especially since his first name was Patrick. He was quite a guy that died too soon.
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Old 08-16-2020, 03:21 PM   #59
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Default Re: Take a gander at this.

I see a few posts about Piper Cubs. I learned in a metal spar J3 with an A65, later C85.
But regardless,
A friend has a J2 powered by a Continental single ignition 37 HP. Not much of a climber on a warm day. Wouldn't want to see 2 people in it.
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Old 08-17-2020, 11:51 AM   #60
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Default Re: Take a gander at this.

Lindberg's claim to fame (and fortune) was the prize (put up by a newspaper) for being the first to fly non-stop New York to Paris. Flying solo was his idea, it was not required for the prize.
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Old 08-17-2020, 12:20 PM   #61
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Lindberg's claim to fame (and fortune) was the prize (put up by a newspaper) for being the first to fly non-stop New York to Paris. Flying solo was his idea, it was not required for the prize.



Did some research: The prize was $25,000, put up up by a hotel owner named Orteig, not a newspaper. Going non-stop was the only rule. A lot of attempts were made by tri-motor planes with 3 and 4 man crews. Some failed due to hissy fits and cat fights among crew members and sponsors. Others crashed. Lindberg went solo with a single engine plane to save weight for more fuel. He also went without a radio and parachute to save weight, but did have an inflatable raft.
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Old 08-17-2020, 12:57 PM   #62
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Default Re: Take a gander at this.

OMG it must be a disease....lol. My father in his youth in WV bought an arm surplus Jenney JN-4 in the early 30's and the grass field he flew it out of is STILL in use today. I flew control line model airplanes all my life and still do occasionaly. I always wanted to get my pilots license but being red/green color blind would probably have prevented it but I still have the urge. About 10 years ago I ALMOST bought an ultra-light plane from a club member at that field in WV but at 67 then I thought better of it. Who knows what tomorrow brings. It is also ironic that two years ago we took off from Florida in our MH and went west to California, up the Coast to Oregon, then back to New England to visit out kids. We whent over the Tehachapi loop! What an experience with a 42' MH towing a Ford Explorer!! Gonna go take a ride in my 29 Roadster....lol.
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Old 09-24-2020, 05:26 AM   #63
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I see a few posts about Piper Cubs. I learned in a metal spar J3 with an A65, later C85.
But regardless,
A friend has a J2 powered by a Continental single ignition 37 HP. Not much of a climber on a warm day. Wouldn't want to see 2 people in it.
I understand the first Cub, which may have been a Taylorcraft, was powered by a 28 hp engine. It was said to be underpowered, and that be an understatement, and the engine was replaced by a 37 or 38 hp engine. That was then said to be overpowered. Now that wasn't an understatement.

I had a 150 hp. My observation or experience was- the more gas you fed it didn't relate to more airspeed. I learned in a 90 hp Cub. A lot less fuel burn for a comparable airspeed to the 150hp model.
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Old 09-26-2020, 02:19 PM   #64
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With apologies to you Katy.

Hi Katy. I apologies for taking so long to respond to your question about Gordon Taylor, who yes was knighted becoming Sir Gordon Taylor.
Originally declined by the Australian Air Force as a pilot he travelled to England and was accepted by the Royal Air Force returning to Australia when the war ended.
I had heard and read of the co pilot who flew with Australian aviator Sir Ross Kingsford-Smith who, in flight, climbed out on the strut and drained oil from a failed engine into a thermos flask and transferred it to the second engine which was overheating. I didnít know the fellows name but it was indeed Gordon Taylor.
I canít tell you much more apart from quoting from Wikipedia so I have provided the link below so as you can check it out. Yes, he was an aviator of notoriety and it is worth a read.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gordon_Taylor_(aviator)
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Old 09-27-2020, 10:26 AM   #65
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His book "The Sky Beyond" is a good read.
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Old 10-24-2020, 09:05 PM   #66
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Just ran across this video of an engine warm up, watch close as it appears it was ready to pull the two guys across the hanger floor. And to think I worry of an engine fail when I'm on the ground...LOL

https://www.facebook.com/KelchAviati...1659278276273/
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Old 10-25-2020, 09:16 AM   #67
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Default Re: Take a gander at this.

There is a small airport in Brodhead, Wisconsin that hosts annually a Pietenpol Aircraft reunion a week before the big annual EAA fly in up at Oshkosh, Wisconsin. Pilots fly their Pietenpols in from all over the country. Their motto is low and slow.

Lots of pictures at this site: https://www.pinterest.com/modelacoup...pol-airplanes/
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Old 10-25-2020, 12:11 PM   #68
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Those old planes are def. cool! However I think you guys are crazy to fly them, LOL. I never had the flying bug, my son does and I keep telling him to take lessons so he wont regret not doing so later in life. Pop was always keen on flying (I guess thats where my son gets it), as his older brother (my uncle) was a flyer during the war and later a commercial pilot. I suppose that had a big influence on him. My brother and myself had an antique motorcycle collection at one time of about 30 bikes. They packed tightly into a 2 car garage. One of the comments we would make was that it is so much easier to house M/C's than cars!
Good advice to your son. My dream to fly in the military started at age 12 and ended at age 16 when I failed the vision test for a driver's license. After that I knew I couldn't afford it as a sport--3 kids and a modest income. I spent my last 2 years in the Navy on an aircraft carrier, 9 months in the Mediterranean. Watching flight ops certainly helped to fight off the boredom.
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Old 12-19-2020, 06:58 PM   #69
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Mr Haszard enquired about a Cessna 180. I replied in other threads but incase you miss it here it is again. You may of course not care to read it and that's okay.

Cessna 180.

Yes Mr Hazard. In answer to your question on 06 Dec 2020. Yes, I had ad C180-J, VH-BBF. It was a good utility aeroplane. It was useful insofar as it would always get airborne regardless of what was loaded into it. We did many trips in it, self, wife Patsy and 4 kids. I taught my 2 sons to fly in it, all off country ag strips and roads. Not an easy aeroplane in ground handling or takeoff and landing but they werenít to know this. They went on to tow gliders and were very popular with the towplane owners.
One son accrued nearly 5,000 and crashed it; not looking where he was going. I did not rebuild it.

It was not an aeroplane I enjoyed flying. Heavy on controls particularly elevator. The later (mine) was slightly concaved on the underside of the wing - about 10 inches aft of the leading edge. I did once get to fly an earlier model with the short cabin and original Cessna type wing. Light on controls, faster roll and it was fun to fly. Totally different aeroplane.
I much preferred to fly the Bonanza but the C180 had 1 great advantage. It was cheap to operate. I also liked the engine. A Continental o-470. Sweet running and did a lot of work on a gallon of gas. Lycomings are more popular engines but that Continental O-470 is a beaut.

To fly agriculture in Australia one is required to undergo specialized training and is then issued an ďag ratingĒ. My training was done in a C180 spreading super phosphate. We carried either 7 or 9 cwt and spread 7 or 9 ton an hour, I donít recall which. That was 1968. To understand my uncertainty do read my signature below this story, the third line.
For Christmas Iíd take farmers and the farm community for a fly. Here is one such occasion. I had to think who they were since this shot was 35 years ago. Theyíve all aged. The young one in the aeroplane is David Link who has gone on to be a hot-shot police helicopter pilot. His story is number 117 on 26 June 2018 and is well worth a read. I had the aeroplane repainted and trimmed in maroon with grey to support the maroon. It was a head turner.
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I know many things,
But I don't know everything,
Sometimes I forget things.

And there are times when I have a long memory.
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