Go Back   The Ford Barn > General Discussion > Early V8 (1932-53)

Sponsored Links (Register now to hide all advertisements)

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 05-11-2012, 07:20 PM   #1
Floyd
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 2010
Posts: 403
Default 32 grille teeth sea gull grey color

I know the color name and can get a number but I cannot find a color chip even online of approximately what shade of grey this is. Hate to buy a quart of paint from Autocolor just to paint the bars. I have rustoelum smoke grey which is used for Delta woodworking machines. It is a nice grey but do not know if it is close to the elusive "sea gull". Your thoughts please.
Floyd
Floyd is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-11-2012, 10:39 PM   #2
DavidG
Senior Member
 
DavidG's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2010
Posts: 7,477
Default Re: 32 grille teeth sea gull grey color

Here's a photo of grill painted with a gray matched to a NOS grill.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg sea gull gray-1.jpg (17.1 KB, 316 views)
DavidG is offline   Reply With Quote
Sponsored Links (Register now to hide all advertisements)
Old 05-12-2012, 12:37 PM   #3
Floyd
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 2010
Posts: 403
Default Re: 32 grille teeth sea gull grey color

Thanks Dave, the photo looks like a very light shade of grey, even after discounting the flash effect.
The original paint on my grille bars had been covered with multiple coats of hot rod black and red over the years. What remments of the original grey I could find had discolored with age. I will mix down the smoke grey with white and see how it looks.
Thanks again
Floyd
Floyd is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-13-2012, 10:56 AM   #4
nospartsman
BANNED
 
Join Date: May 2011
Posts: 409
Default Re: 32 grille teeth sea gull grey color

How close is Ford tractor gray from the 8n, 9n ?
nospartsman is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-15-2012, 09:15 AM   #5
deuce_roadster
Senior Member
 
deuce_roadster's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: Shelton, WA
Posts: 2,875
Default Re: 32 grille teeth sea gull grey color

The original 32 grill color was actually called "French gray" but that info doesn't do you any good because nobody has it. (Hirsh's is way off) If you really want it to be correct find a grille that still has good paint along the edge where it screws to the shell and has been protected from the elements an have that matched.
deuce_roadster is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-15-2012, 08:51 PM   #6
DavidG
Senior Member
 
DavidG's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2010
Posts: 7,477
Default Re: 32 grille teeth sea gull grey color

Sponsored Links (Register now to hide all advertisements)
Sorry, despite what is in the Ford marketing material, the Ford engineering drawings and release forms are unequivical, it was sea gull gray.
DavidG is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-18-2012, 01:02 AM   #7
true blue 32 man
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: West Allis Wisconsin
Posts: 132
Default Re: 32 grille teeth sea gull grey color

Hello I have frequently noticed that the original question gets lost as posts get added and the original question goes unanswered. Dave or anyone have a viable color formulation for the 32 grill bars ? french grey or sea gull grey is a mute point here. The correct color formula is the issue. most of us are just lucky to have an original grill & shell and very very few of these ever have original paint to get a match off of it. A great service would be rendered if once and forall the correct color formula could be posted for all of us to be able to get some paint mixed for our beloved 32 original grills. Thanks Pete
true blue 32 man is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-18-2012, 05:48 PM   #8
Floyd
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 2010
Posts: 403
Default Re: 32 grille teeth sea gull grey color

Being the guy that started this post, I am reporting my results since i just painted the grille bars/teeth today. The correct color of sea gull grey is not available. However Dave Rehor has stated before that the model A color french grey is close (enough?). The PPG paint guide and color chip book published some years ago for 1928 to about 1936 does have a color chip for french grey. I borrowed a copy of this paint chart from a friend. They are around, just check with your local old Ford friends. ( This chart also has a chip for Tacoma Cream for use on wheels also). The french grey chip is lighter than Rustoleum Smoke grey and darker than regular grey primer. The hooker is that this color is not just a shade of grey made from black and white. It actually has a yellow warm tint to it. Therefore I gave up and went to my local friendly Dupont auto paint dealer. We scanned it with the computer and the color is nowhere close to any color in the database. I was hoping it could be cross referenced to be close to some midern car color which could be obtained in touch up spray can form that anybody could obtain. However since that was not an option, I had him match the color to french grey and put it in a spray can. For $25 you get an exact match to french grey in a real automotive paint in a spray can (no cataylst) that will last a long time. The color is a beautiful grey, looks much better than just a cold looking grey made from black and white. So, the final recommendation I have is to look and ask around to borrow a copy of the old PPG Repaint Manual (still available from vendors for $30) and go straight down to your auto paint store and have them match the color french grey and make you a spray can. When you see the results, you will be very happy. You will also be a hero to some other local 32 guy that has just taken the 43 bars out of his shell to straighten and paint.
Just my opinion
Floyd
Floyd is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-18-2012, 08:51 PM   #9
DavidG
Senior Member
 
DavidG's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2010
Posts: 7,477
Default Re: 32 grille teeth sea gull grey color

Floyd,

Sorry, but I don't recall stating "Model A color french gray is close (enough)". Please refresh my memory.

I don't use it and would not recommend it to others to use given what I've seen in Ford's engineering records.

Dave
DavidG is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-18-2012, 09:30 PM   #10
DavidG
Senior Member
 
DavidG's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2010
Posts: 7,477
Default Re: 32 grille teeth sea gull grey color

Floyd,

I've now read what I wrote on page 5-33 of the book, which I should have done first. I did state that the colors are "...are very close to one another", which is true. What caught my attention was your addition of "(enough)".

Decades ago I used french gray, but I've used sea gull gray since I ran across Ford's "M" number paint list for 1932 which listed three types of sea gull gray and only one type of french gray (striping enamel) which confirmed what was stated in the George DeAngelis/Ed Francis book. I very recently saw the engineering drawings and releases that they based their statement on and those documents trump what is printed in the sales material of the period.

For those who like small details, sea gull gray lacquer was used on the grills in very early production superceded by the use of sea gull gray baking enamel. The use of baking enamel helps explain the high survival rate of grills with original paint on them.
DavidG is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-18-2012, 10:39 PM   #11
Jerry Parr WI
Senior Member
 
Jerry Parr WI's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2010
Posts: 619
Default Re: 32 grille teeth sea gull grey color

Not sure about the accuracy of the color but the Model A Paint & Finish Guide by Model A Ford Club of America has a chip for Seagull Gray. Quite a bit darker than French Gray. Excellent paint chip manual available from most Model A parts venders. Many colors continue into later years.
Jerry Parr WI is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-18-2012, 11:53 PM   #12
deuce_roadster
Senior Member
 
deuce_roadster's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: Shelton, WA
Posts: 2,875
Default Re: 32 grille teeth sea gull grey color

It doesn't matter what you call the color, arguing about the name is silly. The closest you will be able to do is match to a known source. Any old original formula (PPG, DuPont etc) you come up with is irrelevant due to the fact that those mixing and tinting bases have changed and are no longer available. I would think Dave Rehor is a better judge of such things then any of us who are posting our opinions. I helped a local V8er who owns many (27!) 32 Fords restore some grilles and he had the paint matched to the hidden portion of a very pristine one. Since it was hand matched, an exact formula isn't available like if it was computer matched.
deuce_roadster is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-19-2012, 09:11 AM   #13
rotorwrench
Senior Member
 
rotorwrench's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: San Antonio, Texas
Posts: 12,464
Default Re: 32 grille teeth sea gull grey color

When matching by eye, the person doing the mixing doesn't always carefully measure the amounts of different base colors that go into the end result. If that person did make carefull account of the tint bases for a given quantity, there would be a formula that could be replicated. It's too bad that someone hasn't taken on this task for some of the more popular colors of the more popular cars but this might be a daunting task even with a handfull of colors let alone the hundreds of different colors used between 1929 and 1959.

One thing that would help in making formulas would be to start with modern (as new as possible) chips in one brand of product and get close with chip formulas then add to the formula for a match taking account as the process progresses.

I just go through my Dupont (since that just happens to be what I'm used to using) chip charts and pick something that's close to the eye and that's what I use. At least I can get the stuff replicated if I have to do a repair later. This practice keeps me sane. Otherwise, my obsesive compulsive side takes over and I regress into a drooling idiot.
rotorwrench is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 05-19-2012, 06:45 PM   #14
Jerry Parr WI
Senior Member
 
Jerry Parr WI's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2010
Posts: 619
Default Re: 32 grille teeth sea gull grey color

Quote:
Originally Posted by rotorwrench View Post
When matching by eye, the person doing the mixing doesn't always carefully measure the amounts of different base colors that go into the end result. If that person did make carefull account of the tint bases for a given quantity, there would be a formula that could be replicated. It's too bad that someone hasn't taken on this task for some of the more popular colors of the more popular cars but this might be a daunting task even with a handfull of colors let alone the hundreds of different colors used between 1929 and 1959.

One thing that would help in making formulas would be to start with modern (as new as possible) chips in one brand of product and get close with chip formulas then add to the formula for a match taking account as the process progresses.

I just go through my Dupont (since that just happens to be what I'm used to using) chip charts and pick something that's close to the eye and that's what I use. At least I can get the stuff replicated if I have to do a repair later. This practice keeps me sane. Otherwise, my obsesive compulsive side takes over and I regress into a drooling idiot.
The Model A book that I reference above makes no attempt to provide formulas. It provides a chip that you have matched. Another great thing about it is it provides chips of all the odd paints like interior trim and base coats. The colors are much more accurate and far more complete than the old Ditzler paint manual. Could be a help for some of the colors that continued into the V8 era.
Jerry Parr WI is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-20-2012, 10:13 AM   #15
rotorwrench
Senior Member
 
rotorwrench's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: San Antonio, Texas
Posts: 12,464
Default Re: 32 grille teeth sea gull grey color

I've got some chip charts that are a little over 20 years old and I didn't take the protective measures I should have with them (I don't use that brand). They fade as bad or worse than the paint does. You have to be very protective of color chip charts or they will be worthless for matching. When I'm matching a color for a part replacement on a helicopter (finite life limited part), I try to take something that is at least large enough to get a favorable match. My best match man at the paint store likes it to be about the size of a gas door on a car. Helicopters have inspection panels that work well for this. Anything smaller and it's a gamble for a good eyeball match. If the whole thing is going to be painted then it's not such a big gamble but it might be doubtful that it's absolutely the correct color that left the factory. I have some original Dupont color chips for my 51 Mercs and they are too badly faded to get a match from. The paint in the trunk of the cars looks new compared to those chips and I'm sure it has faded too.

The bottom line is to get it as close as possible and go with it. It's not an exact science. My art teachers always told me you can mix any color with black, white, red, yellow, & blue and they were correct but to match a color is a whole different story and when you throw clear and metal powders in there it really gets complicated. Plain pastel colors aren't too bad but metalic poly paints get pretty rough. There are still quite a few colors that I've seen restoration folks fight over the exact hue.

Last edited by rotorwrench; 05-20-2012 at 10:27 AM.
rotorwrench is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 05-21-2012, 04:13 PM   #16
DavidG
Senior Member
 
DavidG's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2010
Posts: 7,477
Default Re: 32 grille teeth sea gull grey color

Sorry for the delay in posting this, but the PPG single stage urethane that we have been using is DCC 586 (which happens to be a relatively recent Chrysler color).
DavidG is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-17-2016, 10:10 AM   #17
hotcoupe
Senior Member
 
hotcoupe's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: imperial,mo
Posts: 582
Default Re: 32 grille teeth sea gull grey color

i know this is an old thread, but my PPG jobber could not come up with a listing for DCC 586. does anyone have the current paint code number or, the year and application for the aforementioned DCC 586 code?
thanx,
tom
hotcoupe is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-06-2021, 08:09 AM   #18
rockfla
Senior Member
 
rockfla's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2014
Location: Jacksonville FL
Posts: 2,178
Default Re: 32 grille teeth sea gull grey color

FOLLOWING, as I just recently dug up an original insert I would like to restore!! OR has this post obviously gone cold?
rockfla is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-06-2021, 12:25 PM   #19
whizzernick
Senior Member
 
whizzernick's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2013
Location: Hayward Ca
Posts: 516
Default Re: 32 grille teeth sea gull grey color

Is it possible that early 1933 grills had painted grill bars ? My original 1933 phaeton #82 seems to have painted (gray ) grill bars.
whizzernick is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-06-2021, 12:42 PM   #20
RB
Senior Member
 
RB's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: papillion nebraska
Posts: 300
Default Re: 32 grille teeth sea gull grey color

At one time I used Hirsch Auto finishes to match a color sample using their spectrometer system for a perfect match.

Last edited by RB; 01-06-2021 at 07:33 PM.
RB is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump

Sponsored Links (Register now to hide all advertisements)


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 05:56 PM.