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Old 10-11-2019, 03:57 PM   #1
Fourspd2quad
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Default Axle Quick fix seals which direction?

Which pic is correct? Either way the keyway interrupts the seal.
Thanks in advance.
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Old 10-11-2019, 04:13 PM   #2
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Default Re: Axle Quick fix seals which direction?

Never seen one quite like that, anyway the lip should go to the inside where the liquid grease is. The "fix it seals" I have do not interfere with the keyway and to not have that protruding part.
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Old 10-11-2019, 04:47 PM   #3
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Default Re: Axle Quick fix seals which direction?

Jim, Please post photo of Quick Fix seals you have. Never heard of them.
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Old 10-11-2019, 04:59 PM   #4
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Default Re: Axle Quick fix seals which direction?

I think the flange gets pushed in flush to the housing and the lip gets pushed in the gap between the axle and housing however it would be a pretty tight fit
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Old 10-11-2019, 05:12 PM   #5
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Default Re: Axle Quick fix seals which direction?

Like in the 2nd or right hand pic. In that pic it is not pushed all the way in, though. It wants to be pushed as far in as it will go.

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Old 10-11-2019, 06:13 PM   #6
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Default Re: Axle Quick fix seals which direction?

These are some pics from another source.

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File Type: jpg quick seal1.jpg (92.3 KB, 278 views)
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Old 10-11-2019, 06:23 PM   #7
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Default Re: Axle Quick fix seals which direction?

Awesome Thanks!
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Old 10-12-2019, 11:43 AM   #8
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Default Re: Axle Quick fix seals which direction?

Dont know what the deal is on my end but these are the National seal numbers 6510 marked on the box and gasket and they are way too tight a fit to the housing. I tried pulling it in with the hub and nut, tapping it in etc and starting to damage the seal. Looks like a no go.
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Old 10-12-2019, 12:15 PM   #9
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Default Re: Axle Quick fix seals which direction?

Here is the seal and box it came in.
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Old 10-12-2019, 04:43 PM   #10
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Default Re: Axle Quick fix seals which direction?

I have not had time to dig out my seals but will try to locate them tomorrow and take a pic.
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Old 10-12-2019, 06:10 PM   #11
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Default Re: Axle Quick fix seals which direction?

Thanks. My seals are about 1 3/8 diameter.
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Old 10-12-2019, 08:32 PM   #12
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Default Re: Axle Quick fix seals which direction?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Fourspd2quad View Post
Which pic is correct? Either way the keyway interrupts the seal.
Thanks in advance.
Either my eyes are deceiving me, or there already is a seal installed in the hub.
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Old 10-12-2019, 09:21 PM   #13
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Default Re: Axle Quick fix seals which direction?

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Originally Posted by 40 Deluxe View Post
Either my eyes are deceiving me, or there already is a seal installed in the hub.
Good catch, sorta looks like some kind of a seal to me also.
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Old 10-13-2019, 07:40 AM   #14
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Default Re: Axle Quick fix seals which direction?

Okay, I have a question... "Why not simply replace the factory installed seal"?
That seal does the job quite well. And, obviously - it fits.
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Old 10-13-2019, 09:45 AM   #15
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Default Re: Axle Quick fix seals which direction?

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Okay, I have a question... "Why not simply replace the factory installed seal"?
That seal does the job quite well. And, obviously - it fits.
Have to agree.
The instructions on the quick seal box indicate that the original seal/grease retainer has to be removed anyway to give access to the axle housing race.
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Old 10-13-2019, 10:03 AM   #16
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Default Re: Axle Quick fix seals which direction?

Mis information above, sorry.

Obviously, the advantage of the Quick seals is that they can be fitted without having to strip the rear end assembly down. The seal in the second pic in the first post is not the stock seal, but possibly another variety of quick seal.

To change the stock seals the whole rear end must be stripped down. They are fitted inside the axle casings.

The quick seals may not be as good as the stock seals, but they are really a lot easier to fit and quicker in a service scenario when time means money.

I'd use them if I could find a supply here in the UK.

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Old 10-13-2019, 10:14 AM   #17
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Default Re: Axle Quick fix seals which direction?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mart View Post
Mis information above, sorry.

Obviously, the advantage of the Quick seals is that they can be fitted without having to strip the rear end assembly down. The seal in the second pic in the first post is not the stock seal, but possibly another variety of quick seal.

To change the stock seals the whole rear end must be stripped down. They are fitted inside the axle casings.

The quick seals may not be as good as the stock seals, but they are really a lot easier to fit and quicker in a service scenario when time means money.

I'd use them if I could find a supply here in the UK.

Mart.
I understand Mart. However, I don't believe any of are any longer in a "service scenario" at this stage of life.
I dunno, I guess I just prefer doing it right the first time even if it takes a little longer to do so.
Pulling the axle housing(s) is not that big a deal.
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Old 10-13-2019, 10:57 AM   #18
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Default Re: Axle Quick fix seals which direction?

I looked really closer with a lens and there definitely isn't a seal in there. These are 35-36 bells on an otherwise '40 rear. I don't know if that changes the scenario any.
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Old 10-13-2019, 11:00 AM   #19
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Default Re: Axle Quick fix seals which direction?

I agree with Kube, by using a micrometer and replacing the banjo gaskets with exactly the thickness that was there, it doesn't take all that long if you have a good spring spreader. Granted, I have the KRW tools to achieve this which helps, but a home made tool could quickly be made to install the new seal. The old seal knock out easily toward the large end of the axle housing.

When I started working on cars at age 12, I thought that gear oil was there to lube the roller bearings on my 1930 Model A!!

Fourspeed, it is in there where you can't see very well, maybe 4 or 5 inches.
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Old 10-13-2019, 11:06 AM   #20
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Default Re: Axle Quick fix seals which direction?

Thisi thread really belongs on the HAMB as my car is a rod but I figured there would be more knowledge over here on this subject. That being said I have a lot going on in order to pull the axles off as my axle is tucked up into the trunk area. I have a spring spreader however and may just have to bite the bullet and replace the factory ones. It just puzzles me as to why these repair seals wont work in my application.
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Old 10-13-2019, 11:18 AM   #21
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Default Re: Axle Quick fix seals which direction?

Forespeed, Yeah those will keep the oil out of your drum for a while. Keep in mind those are a band aid kind of fix. I would use one on a road trip but I don't think any that you find would be less then 50 years old and probably would be temporary in nature.
But the short answer is yes they would "work".
P.S. I only have 1 car that is concourse judgeable.
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Old 10-13-2019, 11:25 AM   #22
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Default Re: Axle Quick fix seals which direction?

During the mid 50's and '60's the National external axle seal was a very common fix for worn out internal axle seals. I have a set in my '36 that have not given me any problems during all of the years they have been on the car.
The internal factory type seal does work well, however, they require a complete dis-assembly of the rear end in lieu of just slipping in the external seal..
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Old 10-13-2019, 11:28 AM   #23
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Default Re: Axle Quick fix seals which direction?

Fourspeed, if you do replace them and the axles have grooves where it rides, make a couple 3/16" spacers to move the seal slightly where it runs on the axle. That is easier then putting on a speedy sleeve or trying to find a NOS axle.

Only the axle housing has to come off. If you change both, you can pull the axles and ring gear out as a unit and put back in as a unit, the rest of the rear end banjo you leave alone. You just have to make sure the new gaskets are the same thickness as the old ones on each side as that is how the gear setup is set.

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Old 10-13-2019, 11:40 AM   #24
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Default Re: Axle Quick fix seals which direction?

Forespeed, they will work in your application, but someone has already fitted a seal in that location. That is not the factory seal. You need to dig out what has been fitted already so you can fit the new ones. As it is not possible to see what has already been fitted, it not possible to say whether just knocking it further in would be ok.

You have to understand that these are not the correct way to do it but a quick fix. If you can do it right, do it right, if you are happy to give the quick seal a go and maybe do it right when more convenient, then give it a go. You just need to get the existing non original seals out of the way first.

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Old 10-13-2019, 03:09 PM   #25
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Default Re: Axle Quick fix seals which direction?

I have some 40 bells that the seal fits fine into.
I am wondering if not all housings accept these seals.
I looked closely again and tried to displace something in that area but it appears to be all the hub. It is also seamless on the ID and i couldnt feel an edge using a thin piece of wire.
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Old 10-14-2019, 06:07 AM   #26
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Default Re: Axle Quick fix seals which direction?

The early axle ends have a smaller ID,
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Old 10-14-2019, 08:50 AM   #27
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Default Re: Axle Quick fix seals which direction?

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The early axle ends have a smaller ID,
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Thanks Lawrie. This confirms what I feared but at least I know the path forward.
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Old 11-07-2019, 01:02 PM   #28
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Smile Re: Axle Quick fix seals which direction?

Hi All,
I just wanted to wrap up this thread with what I learned via JM 35 Sedan. John sent me pics of '35 axles vs '37-40 axle housings that show how the repair seals don't fit in the earlier housing due to their hole being too small to accept the seal. The pics show used and unused seals. I can't confirm if there was an axle repair seal available that would work on the earlier axles but based on what I learned there certainly isn't much space between the axle and housing. Thanks everyone who contributed and especially John who took the time to take these pics and gave me permission to share them! Time to fix the leak the correct way!
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