The Ford Barn

JSeery · 03-16-2019, 09:27 AM

A photo of the battery would help.

rotorwrench · 03-16-2019, 09:52 AM

The battery conversions started with removing the tar and lead plates from the old original Ford battery cases them modifying them to hold a late type Optima 6 volt batteries. Later they started manufacturing new "look alike" cases for this purpose. I haven't seen one that was modified to 12-volt yet but who knows what can show up. This is what makes for the confusion.

There may be some small 12-volt batteries that have been disguised as a 6-volt.

Your radio may be polarity sensitive if it has been repaired with late type solid state components for positive ground. It would also need a voltage drop. If no radio, no problem. The ignition coil is also polarity sensitive but that can be overcome depending on what type of ignition the car has. The bulbs all have to be 12-volt and the gauges in the instrument panel need voltage reduction as well as heater motors and the like. The rest will likely function on 12-volt. Horns get pretty harsh sounding though.

The generator would have to be changed over to 12-volt field coils or an alternator could be used but would stick out like a sore thumb unless it had one of those iffy Power Gens or an alternator converted generator body. There are several ways to go 12-volt if you want to. You will have to check this stuff to see if it has already been converted or not.

Licensed to kill · 03-17-2019, 09:45 AM

Just to satisfy my own curiosity, the battery/voltage issue notwithstanding, why do you want to switch the polarity to negative ground?. Is there some advantage over positive ground?.

JSeery · 03-17-2019, 11:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Licensed to kill

Just to satisfy my own curiosity, the battery/voltage issue notwithstanding, why do you want to switch the polarity to negative ground?. Is there some advantage over positive ground?.

If the vehicle is original, no. If you are going to add modern devices that use negative ground, maybe. Don't really see any reason unless you were converting to 12v at the same time.

trentclark · 03-20-2019, 10:26 PM

Grouchy and ugly, you hit the jackpot of knowledge. these guys will help you get it figured out. they helped me with my fuel issues and other charging items a year of so ago. just be patient and send lots of pics. I ran my 47 truck for 20 years with positive ground and never had any issues. I finally decided to make the switch and its as simple as Red98 states. took me an hour or so and all was swapped. slow down, think it thru, use a voltmeter on everything and you will have it done. 6 volt battery with 13 volts is not possible. tubman figured it out.

grouchyandugly · 03-21-2019, 10:39 AM

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here are )NO( photos of my dumb dirtyword battery. it is a CARQUEST battery, part #1-30 with 640CCA …. just checked carquest.com, transferred to Advance, and this battery is available and is a 6V, not a 12V. and it is POSSIBLE because I have checked it and rechecked it for "voltage" (I was a Radioman in the Navy for years, so this is not something new for me). just checked my battery again, and it reads 12.96V. anyways, whatever, I will be changing it over to 12 volts because my original generator has a burnt out Amature, and I cannot afford those fantastic prices for a replacement 41 gen. stay safe. thanksxxxxx
DIRTYWORD.... PHOTOS WILL NOT UPLOAD....I reduced the size twice and still cannot get them accepted.

tubman · 03-21-2019, 11:37 AM

I'm sure that if you look around you will be able to find an auto electric rebuilder near you who can repair your existing generator. You might be pleasantly surprised at the cost. The pictures of your car show it to be a nice original. I hate to say this but "moredoors" are not very desirable and their appeal and desirability will decrease with every modification from stock original you make. Think twice about doing this.

Oh yeah, if that 6 volt battery is really putting out over 12 volts, I suggest you contact the Smithsonian or Ripley's "Believe it or Not" or some such. Too bad about the pictures. How about sending them to Charlie again?

grouchyandugly · 03-21-2019, 04:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tubman

I'm sure that if you look around you will be able to find an auto electric rebuilder near you who can repair your existing generator. You might be pleasantly surprised at the cost. The pictures of your car show it to be a nice original. I hate to say this but "moredoors" are not very desirable and their appeal and desirability will decrease with every modification from stock original you make. Think twice about doing this.

Oh yeah, if that 6 volt battery is really putting out over 12 volts, I suggest you contact the Smithsonian or Ripley's "Believe it or Not" or some such. Too bad about the pictures. How about sending them to Charlie again?

I did look/search around. found one in Live Oak. he called next day and said my armature was toast, and he was unable to locate a replacement.... and... sent photos of my dumb battery to Charles, so they should be up and visible shortly. hopefully he can tell me what to do or how to make my photos show up. pain. stay safe. thanks

grouchyandugly · 03-21-2019, 04:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by grouchyandugly

I did look/search around. found one in Live Oak. he called next day and said my armature was toast, and he was unable to locate a replacement.... and... sent photos of my dumb battery to Charles, so they should be up and visible shortly. hopefully he can tell me what to do or how to make my photos show up. pain. stay safe. thanks

yep, I know 4 doors are not popular, etc., but, (always a but), this is the year I popped out, and in great condition, so I latched onto it. stay safe.thanks

Charlie Stephens · 03-21-2019, 04:31 PM

Here is a photo of the battery. Looks like a standard auto parts store battery that hasn't been tampered with. It is probably just an optical illusion but the ground cable looks like it is incorrectly attached to the negative post (which is slightly smaller).

Charlie Stephens

Gary in La. · 03-22-2019, 08:41 AM

If you look close there is a negative (-) image on the case at the lower right connection. Thus making it a positive (+) ground.

54vicky · 03-22-2019, 09:43 AM

to my eyes the post with the shielded cable attached is on the bigger post if so it is hooked up as negative ground.with the bare cable(ground) not attached.it may be my eyes.the 3 caps were 6 volt on batteries I remember

grouchyandugly · 03-22-2019, 10:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Charlie Stephens

Here is a photo of the battery. Looks like a standard auto parts store battery that hasn't been tampered with. It is probably just an optical illusion but the ground cable looks like it is incorrectly attached to the negative post (which is slightly smaller).

Charlie Stephens

hi. the ground cable is disconnected from the Positive post... the Negative post cable loops around to the starter solenoid on the firewall just inside from the battery. stay safe. thanks

tubman · 03-22-2019, 12:29 PM

I have an armature for a pre-49 Ford generator in my stash back in Minnesota that I have no need for that I would send you for shipping. The problem is, I'm in Marathon until May.

grouchyandugly · 03-22-2019, 03:45 PM

heyyyy… just in time for my 78th Birthday!! (may)…. yes, I would take it and be happy to get it. (payment for shipping to me from me from you to me)
stay safe

today gots my one-wire 12V Alternator going, with some modifications on the mounting bracket. checked my SIX VOLT battery after i ran her for a while... it shows 13.14Volts !!! (eat your heart out!!). PO had to have replaced the headlights and the tail lights, as they did not burn out..... changed nothing, so it can be back to original.

thanks
G&U

grouchyandugly · 03-22-2019, 03:47 PM

me slow brain. but... will that armature from a pre 49 fit my dumb 41?? they changed some things before/after.... wheeeeee burp wheeeeeee

stay safe
thanks
G&U

cas3 · 03-22-2019, 05:27 PM

hmm...there's somthin funny goin on here

grouchyandugly · 03-22-2019, 06:59 PM

anybody/everybody is WELCOME to drop by and check out what I have typed.
stay safe
thanks
G&U

koates · 03-22-2019, 08:47 PM

Something funny going on here alright !! That is a 6 volt battery you have. Am curious as to the type of meter you are using to test the voltage. its most important to make sure the voltage scale knob is set correctly so that you are getting the correct reading and not double the correct reading. A photo of your meter would be good especially with it reading in operation. You are 78 so just wondering if your glasses are up to scratch ? Regards, Kevin.

JSeery · 03-22-2019, 09:13 PM

Koates, we have been through this, the claim is several different meters at different times, both analog and digital. My guess would be it is some type of strange 12v battery of three cells. It holds a charge at 13+ volts and it is being charged by a 12v alternator, to me, that makes it a 12v battery, LOL. Never seen or even heard of such a thing, but to me, regardless of it's appearance, it is a 12v battery.

03-16-2019, 09:27 AM	#21
JSeery Member Emeritus Join Date: Nov 2012 Location: Wichita KS Posts: 16,132	Re: positive to negative change A photo of the battery would help.

03-16-2019, 09:52 AM	#22
rotorwrench Senior Member Join Date: Jun 2010 Location: San Antonio, Texas Posts: 16,426	Re: positive to negative change The battery conversions started with removing the tar and lead plates from the old original Ford battery cases them modifying them to hold a late type Optima 6 volt batteries. Later they started manufacturing new "look alike" cases for this purpose. I haven't seen one that was modified to 12-volt yet but who knows what can show up. This is what makes for the confusion. There may be some small 12-volt batteries that have been disguised as a 6-volt. Your radio may be polarity sensitive if it has been repaired with late type solid state components for positive ground. It would also need a voltage drop. If no radio, no problem. The ignition coil is also polarity sensitive but that can be overcome depending on what type of ignition the car has. The bulbs all have to be 12-volt and the gauges in the instrument panel need voltage reduction as well as heater motors and the like. The rest will likely function on 12-volt. Horns get pretty harsh sounding though. The generator would have to be changed over to 12-volt field coils or an alternator could be used but would stick out like a sore thumb unless it had one of those iffy Power Gens or an alternator converted generator body. There are several ways to go 12-volt if you want to. You will have to check this stuff to see if it has already been converted or not. Last edited by rotorwrench; 03-16-2019 at 10:06 AM.

03-17-2019, 09:45 AM	#23
Licensed to kill Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2016 Location: Alberta Posts: 930	Re: positive to negative change Just to satisfy my own curiosity, the battery/voltage issue notwithstanding, why do you want to switch the polarity to negative ground?. Is there some advantage over positive ground?.

03-20-2019, 10:26 PM	#25
trentclark Member Join Date: Aug 2017 Location: Dallas TX Posts: 41	Re: positive to negative change Grouchy and ugly, you hit the jackpot of knowledge. these guys will help you get it figured out. they helped me with my fuel issues and other charging items a year of so ago. just be patient and send lots of pics. I ran my 47 truck for 20 years with positive ground and never had any issues. I finally decided to make the switch and its as simple as Red98 states. took me an hour or so and all was swapped. slow down, think it thru, use a voltmeter on everything and you will have it done. 6 volt battery with 13 volts is not possible. tubman figured it out.

03-21-2019, 10:39 AM	#26
grouchyandugly Member Join Date: May 2018 Location: N.E. FLA Posts: 57	Re: positive to negative change Sponsored Links (Register now to hide all advertisements) here are )NO( photos of my dumb dirtyword battery. it is a CARQUEST battery, part #1-30 with 640CCA …. just checked carquest.com, transferred to Advance, and this battery is available and is a 6V, not a 12V. and it is POSSIBLE because I have checked it and rechecked it for "voltage" (I was a Radioman in the Navy for years, so this is not something new for me). just checked my battery again, and it reads 12.96V. anyways, whatever, I will be changing it over to 12 volts because my original generator has a burnt out Amature, and I cannot afford those fantastic prices for a replacement 41 gen. stay safe. thanksxxxxx DIRTYWORD.... PHOTOS WILL NOT UPLOAD....I reduced the size twice and still cannot get them accepted.

03-21-2019, 11:37 AM	#27
tubman Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2013 Location: Minnesota, Florida Keys Posts: 10,312	Re: positive to negative change I'm sure that if you look around you will be able to find an auto electric rebuilder near you who can repair your existing generator. You might be pleasantly surprised at the cost. The pictures of your car show it to be a nice original. I hate to say this but "moredoors" are not very desirable and their appeal and desirability will decrease with every modification from stock original you make. Think twice about doing this. Oh yeah, if that 6 volt battery is really putting out over 12 volts, I suggest you contact the Smithsonian or Ripley's "Believe it or Not" or some such. Too bad about the pictures. How about sending them to Charlie again?

03-22-2019, 08:41 AM	#31
Gary in La. Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Louisiana Posts: 866	Re: positive to negative change If you look close there is a negative (-) image on the case at the lower right connection. Thus making it a positive (+) ground.

03-22-2019, 09:43 AM	#32
54vicky Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2011 Location: Oakville Ontario Posts: 586	Re: positive to negative change to my eyes the post with the shielded cable attached is on the bigger post if so it is hooked up as negative ground.with the bare cable(ground) not attached.it may be my eyes.the 3 caps were 6 volt on batteries I remember

03-22-2019, 12:29 PM	#34
tubman Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2013 Location: Minnesota, Florida Keys Posts: 10,312	Re: positive to negative change I have an armature for a pre-49 Ford generator in my stash back in Minnesota that I have no need for that I would send you for shipping. The problem is, I'm in Marathon until May.

03-22-2019, 03:45 PM	#35
grouchyandugly Member Join Date: May 2018 Location: N.E. FLA Posts: 57	Re: positive to negative change heyyyy… just in time for my 78th Birthday!! (may)…. yes, I would take it and be happy to get it. (payment for shipping to me from me from you to me) stay safe today gots my one-wire 12V Alternator going, with some modifications on the mounting bracket. checked my SIX VOLT battery after i ran her for a while... it shows 13.14Volts !!! (eat your heart out!!). PO had to have replaced the headlights and the tail lights, as they did not burn out..... changed nothing, so it can be back to original. thanks G&U

03-22-2019, 03:47 PM	#36
grouchyandugly Member Join Date: May 2018 Location: N.E. FLA Posts: 57	Re: positive to negative change me slow brain. but... will that armature from a pre 49 fit my dumb 41?? they changed some things before/after.... wheeeeee burp wheeeeeee stay safe thanks G&U

03-22-2019, 05:27 PM	#37
cas3 Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2011 Location: sw minnesota Posts: 4,571	Re: positive to negative change hmm...there's somthin funny goin on here

03-22-2019, 06:59 PM	#38
grouchyandugly Member Join Date: May 2018 Location: N.E. FLA Posts: 57	Re: positive to negative change anybody/everybody is WELCOME to drop by and check out what I have typed. stay safe thanks G&U

03-22-2019, 08:47 PM	#39
koates Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Melbourne Australia. Posts: 2,079	Re: positive to negative change Something funny going on here alright !! That is a 6 volt battery you have. Am curious as to the type of meter you are using to test the voltage. its most important to make sure the voltage scale knob is set correctly so that you are getting the correct reading and not double the correct reading. A photo of your meter would be good especially with it reading in operation. You are 78 so just wondering if your glasses are up to scratch ? Regards, Kevin.

03-22-2019, 09:13 PM	#40
JSeery Member Emeritus Join Date: Nov 2012 Location: Wichita KS Posts: 16,132	Re: positive to negative change Koates, we have been through this, the claim is several different meters at different times, both analog and digital. My guess would be it is some type of strange 12v battery of three cells. It holds a charge at 13+ volts and it is being charged by a 12v alternator, to me, that makes it a 12v battery, LOL. Never seen or even heard of such a thing, but to me, regardless of it's appearance, it is a 12v battery.