'29 A Engine Out, Now What?
 

Hi all. I'm new here. I have a '29 Coupe which my dad bought in the 1990s. It was stored in a barn since the 60s and already had a lot of bondo. I bought it from him when he got sick, took it apart (it ran/drove) in 1998, had all panels blasted/primed, bought new body parts and started reassembling it. Had 2nd kid in 2000 and all Model A work stopped. NOW 1st kid is 16, gung ho, and we are trying to finish the job!
We got enough body structure together to take it back off the chassis, and have been cleaning sludge off the chassis, bumper-to-bumper for the last 2 weeks. Nearly done, we took the motor out last night to clean that area and start blasting, priming, painting and putting parts back ON the chassis.
My Question Is: With the engine out, is there anything I should do with it or check on it that I will really wish I had done if I just put the engine back in and do nothing but clean it? It ran 12 years ago, but the last time it ran some sort of shear pin on the crank pully sheared. I never replaced it and haven't started it since. Does this indicate any major problems?
I've worked on cars most of my life as a hobby but other than a few books and looking at this car for a decade or so, I'm new to Model As.
Any advice would be appreciated.
Also, I've joined MARC and will attend a local meeting soon.

Marty

Re: '29 A Engine Out, Now What?
 

Welcome to the 'barn! I have a '30 std. coupe and have enjoyed it since 2000.
I have had a lot of fun with it ,BUT, I thought the new to me, rebuilt engine would really be the way to go. Removed the old engine, installed the new one and since have had it in and out at least 4 times due to knocks etc. So, I am not the one to help other than to say drop the oil pan and the dipper tray, and also the valve cover under and behind the intake/exhaust manifold and clean all of the areas and oil holes and then get the instructions to check the bearings and clearances needed for the adjustment of the main and rod journals. Also check the wrist pins for unusual side to side movement. Now would be the time to freshen up the water pump, clean any carbon from the head etc. etc. etc.
Don't ask me how I know to try these. And again, Welcome

Re: '29 A Engine Out, Now What?
 

I would check the frame for straightness especially near the motor mounts. I would also take off the motor mounts and clean them up and inspect them for cracks. Also install new rubber with the mounts.

Welcome to the forum!

Re: '29 A Engine Out, Now What?
 

Welcome, Marty!
Do you have an original two-blade fan? Replace it with an aluminum one. Easy to do before installing the radiator.

Re: '29 A Engine Out, Now What?
 

There is no shear pin on the crank pulley. I don't know what could have broken but it is not going to be good since there is nothing in that area that is expendable.

Re: '29 A Engine Out, Now What?
 

Thanks for the advice so far.
- I do have the 2-blade fan. I thought it looked sort of cool and original. What is better about the aluminum fan?
- On the crank pulley, as I rotate the pulley I can see 2 holes that are about 3/16" diameter, opposite each other in the pulley, and a matching hole cross-drilled thru the crank. Did someone add this? How is the pulley normally kept from rotating on the crank?
- Bogdonj, it definitely looks like original rubber on between motor mounts and frame (hard as a rock). I thought it also looked nostalgic and was going to leave it. Bad idea?
- The motor mounts have definitely matchboxed a little bit due to the engine weight. It was tight to get a socket on the bottom bolt due to interference with the bottom plate of the mount. I thought I'd give them a whack before painting and get them square again. I don't have frame straightness checks in the books I have: "How to restore your Model A Vol 1, 2 and 3" and "The model A as Henry Built It". Recommendation for this info? It seems REALLY flexible as we carry it around the barn. Rails don't look bent at all and it doesn't seem to be matchboxed. It this that important to worry about? This won't be a show car, I just want it to look nice and be drivable to work now and then.
- Say, on the subject of leaving original stuff, when I scraped the oil/etc. off the inside of the frame rails where the engine was, there was a thin black coating on the frame. It comes off with brakecleen in a big black puddle. I wondered if this could the original "asphalt" dip coating these had when new, and if so, should I leave it there?
- Russell, thanks for the tips. I didn't really want to hear all that. :) I'll look into all of it. Will replacement gaskets be easy to come by for head, valve cover and oil pan?
Thanks everyone.
Marty

Re: '29 A Engine Out, Now What?
 

There should not be a hole like you describe in the pulley. How about a picture.

Re: '29 A Engine Out, Now What?
 

FRAME!! Make it perfect, perfectly straight! If not, the problems with come back to haunt you down the road what with body alignment, lean etc etc.

Re: '29 A Engine Out, Now What?
 

Bogdonj, it definitely looks like original rubber on between motor mounts and frame (hard as a rock). I thought it also looked nostalgic and was going to leave it. Bad idea?


Yes it's a bad idea in my opinion replace while the engine is out and easy to do. If you install the engine with the old ones in you could get good vibration and it's always a pain pulling the engine again. Been there, don't that.

Re: '29 A Engine Out, Now What?
 

Hi Marty,
Welcome to the hobby! If your crank pulley/crankshaft was cross-drilled for a roll pin or some such, then I am seeing a very serious bunch of red flags raised on this engine. That pulley was designed to be held in place with a 5/8 bolt in the nose of the crankshaft. While your engine is out, remove the oil pan, clean it out with special attention to pieces of metal embedded in the sludge, and have an experienced engine machinist check for play in all of the bearings and other engine components. By just removing the oil pan, you are going to be able to see quite a bit, and make some very good guesses about the condition of the engine, as well as determining if any other repairs such as the cross-drilling have occurred to engine internals. Good Luck with your "new" Model A. PS I think volume 2 of the Les Andrews has a section on frame straightening...

Chris

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www.burlingtoncrankshaft.com

Re: '29 A Engine Out, Now What?
 

Definently check the frame as others have said. What "Looks" straight may be off only 1/4 inch ...but will equal 100 yards of frustration. The common a sag location is around drivers side motor mount. Looks great so far. Have fun!!

Re: '29 A Engine Out, Now What?
 

- I do have the 2-blade fan. I thought it looked sort of cool and original. What is better about the aluminum fan?

The new two blade won't break like the original one, and it will break
one day.

Bob

Re: '29 A Engine Out, Now What?
 

They look the same to the none judge eye.

Re: '29 A Engine Out, Now What?
 

Hi all. Here are some pictures of my crank pulley.
I forgot to look for a 5/8 bolt on the end of the crank but the nature of this pulley doesn't seem to want to be held by anything on the end. Comments?

I've also attached some frame photos. I'm sure there's some measurement methods I need to learn and use, but just eyeballing this frame it's hard to imagine I could do anything that doesn't make it worse than it is. It looks pretty straight to me. Any comments will be greatly appreciated.

Re: '29 A Engine Out, Now What?
 

You have the 5/8 bolt in the front of the crank,it is the ratchet for the hand crank.It is a 5/8 thread,not a 5/8 hex size.That is not a factory pulley,it looks like an old pressed tin aftermarket piece.Are you positive the crank is drilled also?I have the remains of one that was a two piece.The inside slid on and the outside threaded over it and was locked in place with set screws through the side like yours shows.If it is drilled right through,it ain't good.Ford 8N tractors were notorious for the front pulley loosening up and being run for ages before anybody noticed.That was a popular fix for them,bore a hole and run a pin through it.It was no loss to the tractor,the crank and pulley were already ruined and if you could get a few more years out of it with the hack fix,good.

Re: '29 A Engine Out, Now What?
 

You need to pull a string tight across the top of the frame
and check for sag near the motor mounts.

Bob

Re: '29 A Engine Out, Now What?
 

What you have is a junk aluminum pulley and it should NOT have a pin through it. I would remove the pulley and buy a new one and a new crank pulley bolt. Also, remove the timing cover and make sure the slinger is on the crank behind the pulley. It will look like a round piece of metal cupped and keyed to the crank. Old builders would sometimes leave these off and the pulley would sit too far back on the crank and the bolt would not tighten up on the pulley resulting in a loose pulley. If it is missing, make sure you replace it before you install the new pulley. Hopefully the crank has not been drilled even though it probably won't matter with a new pulley.

Re: '29 A Engine Out, Now What?
 

To check the frame, stretch a piece of string the full length of the rail on top and put a 1/2" block under each end. Use another 1/2" block to measure the string to frame at various places on the frame. The most common sag will most often be at the motor mount at the flywheel housing.

Re: '29 A Engine Out, Now What?
 

also measure the frame diagonally to make certain it is square.

get your motor mount rubber pads from someone like Brattons, Snyders or Berts so they will fit like they should. and don't leave out the sleeves around the frame-to-motor mount bolts......

how about putting your city & state in your posts?
the same goes for all of the rest of you who have neglected to do so!

Re: '29 A Engine Out, Now What?
 

Not to hijack this thread, but I think that should be required in order to sign up, like your alias.

Regarding parts, Marty: While you're getting stuff, buy a copy of The Service Bulletins and Les Andrews book, Vol I. These will prove invaluable as you work on the car, and will be references you use for as long as you have a Model A.