Replacement Ignition Coil
 

The replacement ignition coil sold by Model A parts suppliers is a Standard Motor Products UC14T.
http://ecatalog.smpcorp.com/STD/#/ve...m/UC14T?type=s
Does anyone have the output voltage spec for this coil?

Re: Replacement Ignition Coil
 

Why would this be important ?

Re: Replacement Ignition Coil
 

Go with the Pertronix Flamethrower coil! You will be glad you did.....;).

Bob-A:D

Re: Replacement Ignition Coil
 

I agree with Bob-A, but be sure to order the epoxy filled coil.

Epoxy 1.5 ohm black coil = PN 40111
Epoxy 3.0 ohm black coil = PN 40611

Re: Replacement Ignition Coil
 

6V System
High-voltage output numbers are inconsistent on this forum. I seek the best 6V replacement coil which has the highest output voltage (highest turns ratio).

12V System
40611 Pertronix coils made in China have been recalled because they fail under load. There is another 40611 made in Mexico. There is also a report that some boxes have the wrong part number. What you actually get in the box is a mystery.

I bought a Bosch 00012 and it runs really well.

Re: Replacement Ignition Coil
 

I'm with Bob-A and AL in NY . I use the epoxy filled 3 ohm black coil= PN 40611 on my 12 volt roadster . These coils need no resister . Like Bob-A says you'll be glad you did . I get instant starts and improved power that you can feel . Better spark burns the gas better and gets more power from it. The first thing i did after installation was idel down the carbs.The engine ran so much better , it actually picked up quite a few RPMs .The coil is a 40.000 volt performance part but looks like any normal replacement coil . They even have a chrome version if you would like .

Re: Replacement Ignition Coil
 

Sorry Bob Bidonde, That hasn't been my experience With the Flame thrower coil .Do you actually have any experience at all with the 40611 coil . It wouldn't matter to me where it was made if it is good . Mine have all been made in Mexico . The 40611 coil that I installed on my roadster has performed flawlessly for the past 12 years . If you can't use it don't try it .

Re: Replacement Ignition Coil
 

I use an oil filled 1.5 Ω Pertronix Coil in my 6v Town Sedan. I do mount the coil with the high voltage terminal pointing up.

Re: Replacement Ignition Coil
 

Does this coil have a stock A look and where can I buy one like you installed? Thanks!

Re: Replacement Ignition Coil
 

Hi Purdy! Yes, I have a 40611 Flame Thrower, but it failed so I replaced it with a Bosch 00012 (Blue Coil).

Re: Replacement Ignition Coil
 

Contact Standard Motor Products they should have it.

Re: Replacement Ignition Coil
 

You guys need to read this post on the V8 forum........
www.fordbarn.com/forum/showthread.php?t=238737

Re: Replacement Ignition Coil
 

A lot of "thanks for the heads up" on the v8 forum but not much in the voltage (6v) or the output. Is it 40,000 or what? I would like to know if they are reliable, is the voltage for our 6v cars, and is the output 40,000 or so? Where do you buy them? I am guessing that the 1.5 ohm is for our 6v systems.

Re: Replacement Ignition Coil
 

Bob: we use Bosch like yours though turned terminals up as in post 8 for oil filled. We have an older tar filled (or whatever medium) 3ohm Bosch (German made) that works well also. The newer ones are supposedly made in Brazil. The oil filled coil we tried gets hot to the touch.

Re: Replacement Ignition Coil
 

Some have claimed that the epoxy filled flame thrower coils get too hot to touch . I have had no such problem with mine . I could use either the epoxy or oil filled version as long as they are mounted correctly. A high voltage performance coil will no doubt get warmer than a low voltage coil but not that hot . The epoxy version was recommended so I use it . No problems in 12 years .I can grab and hold mine with no discomfort . If others are having problems with the flamethrewer coil , there is no telling what their problem may be . A lot of people use them with results the same as mine .

Re: Replacement Ignition Coil
 

Our 12 volt new oil filled gets quite hot but not so much that one can't grasp it. It is cooler than the distributor housing on a warmed engine for reference. The STD UCT coils are made in China. We have also a new UCT15 with internal resistor that measures 4.4 ohms across the primary and 8100 at the secondary.

Re: Replacement Ignition Coil
 

Smog Tech,
Where'd you get the OHM symbol in your post?----Or is it a COIL BRACKET?
The Dog:cool: & I can't find one on our CHEAP Keyboard:confused:
Bill W. & Buster T.:cool:

Re: Replacement Ignition Coil
 

Bill,
On a MAC the Ω is option z.

Re: Replacement Ignition Coil
 

Answer: It depends!......Depends on how much voltage is needed to jump the plug gap. If only 5,000 volts will fire the plug, that is all the coil will put out. Even if you have a double super whammy "40,000 volt" coil it will still only build up secondary voltage to the point where the spark is strong enough to jump the plug gap, which will never reach 40,000 volts on a Model A, or any stock engine (unless you have totally burned out plug electrodes or open wires, etc.). An ultra high compression or supercharged engine running at wide open throttle may need this much voltage capability, though.
To test coil output, try a "Lisle #20700 Spark Tester". Or, go to a shop with a scope, hook it up and pull a plug wire off and watch the screen.

Re: Replacement Ignition Coil
 

I'm not sure if my original coil is reliable, as I'm still testing it. It's only been in use for 90 years.

Re: Replacement Ignition Coil
 

Tom,
After 90 years of service, what do you think the remaining life is? I hope you have a spare coil if you tour out of town in your Model A.

Re: Replacement Ignition Coil
 

About the only thing that effects original tar filled model A coils is carbon tracks that extend up to the metal tube housing. Carbon tracks can short the coil but can be scraped off . Carbon tracks are mentioned in the service bulletins . Like Tom , Ive never had a problem with an original , even if it was beat up and rusty .

Re: Replacement Ignition Coil
 

If this was really the case, no matter what coil or distributor that was used would increase the spark . This is really no so !!! I use a gap of .035 - thats thirty five thousants at the spark plugs . Running at idle speed is not an extra strain on the coil . Idle speed doesn't require extra voltage to jump the .035 gap at the spark plugs. If my Flame thrower coil doesn't increase the spark . Why would the idle rpm increase to the point that I had to readjust the idle speed . I have had similiar results with other performance coils like the 30.000 volt bee hive coils . These coils give performance that a person that has actually used one can't deny .

Re: Replacement Ignition Coil
 

I usually look at this forum several times a day . I haven't seen any inconsistant voltage ratings of the Flamethrower type coil that I use posted on this forum . I do remember a post where Mr HL Chauvin posted what one of the Pertronix engineers told him . There was no mention of a voltage difference between the 1.5 ohm and the 3.0 ohm versions of the flamethrower coils . The engineer hinted around that the 12 volt 3.0 version could be the better choice for performance . You question the voltage out put of the Flamethrower coil . What is the advertised voltage of the Bosch 00012 coil ??? If Flamethrower coils have been recalled, WHY hasn't my coil been recalled ? You mention and post a picture of the Bosch 00012 coil , mounted on your car . Post number 14 states that he uses a blue oil filled Bosch coil like yours . If your Bosch coil is oil filled you have yours mounted upside down . Oil filled coils that are mounted wrong usually fail early , no matter what brand that they are . If you used the lower priced oil filled Flame thrower coil and mounted it wrong, that could be the reason that it failed . The solid epoxy coil can be mounted as original , not necessarily so with the oil filled version .

I use the 40611 epoxy coil . Mine is the 3.0 ohm 12 volt version . I use the original model A distributor with original style points . Pertronix makes different coils for electronic ignition . Using the 40611 with electronic ignition could be a problem .

Re: Replacement Ignition Coil
 

Excellent post, this is the way I always remember it, using an oscilloscope can teach you much about the ignition system, spark plug cleaning machines had voltage testers built into them.

Re: Replacement Ignition Coil
 

So can the 40611 Pertronix coil, epoxy filled be used on a stock 6 volt system?

Thanks
paul

Re: Replacement Ignition Coil
 

From their web site, for 6 volt systems use part number 40111 1.5 ohm epoxy.

Re: Replacement Ignition Coil
 

jmeckel

Thank you

Paul

Re: Replacement Ignition Coil
 

Sparks must be really small, because I'd have thought that size can would have emptied out years ago. :D

Re: Replacement Ignition Coil
 

Tom's coil is authentic ..... "any color as long as it is black"

Re: Replacement Ignition Coil
 

The increase in idle speed was from opening the plug gap to .035". The increased gap allows for more fuel molecules to be available to be ignited by the spark, so idle speed increases (and emissions go down). In the '70's came stricter emissions laws. One way manufacturers met the standards was with leaner mixtures which required larger plug gaps to cut down on misfire. This required higher voltage coils and in turn better plug wires (most manufacturers went to 8mm wires). EPA also required cars to run longer without a tuneup so electronic ignition systems came into use. Ford went to about .050" gaps , most GM went to .045" gaps, and some Oldsmobiles used .080" for awhile.
Try setting two plugs in your A at .025" and two at .035" and hook it to a scope. Record the firing voltages. Then set the two plugs back to .035". You will see an increase in voltage on those two plugs. Next put on a stock A coil and see if the voltage changes from your 'hot' coil.
When the points open and voltage is induced in the secondary circuit, it only rises enough to jump the plug gap, no matter the coil's potential. With your A on the scope, pull the coil wire out of the distributor cap and watch the voltage rise on the scope as you hold the wire further away. In this case the 'hot' coil will produce a longer spark than the stock coil, because it has more voltage potential in reserve. In normal use, this higher potential is never reached.

Re: Replacement Ignition Coil
 

40 Deluxe is correct

Re: Replacement Ignition Coil
 

I believe that Ford increased spark plug gap to .035 before model A production ended ... Anyway , I have always set my spark plug gap at .035 on my model A's and most others with points ignition . Spark plug gap had nothing to do with the rpm increase after installing a performance coil . The reason being that the gap had allways been at .035 , not readjusted to .035 after the installation of the flame thrower coil .I agree that more spark plug gap , to a point better burns the fuel . I agree that spark plug gap increased with the introduction of electronic ignition . The coils would have had to have been improved to handle wider spark plug gaps . Standard , ( not necessarily brand) , replacement coils for points ignition will fail rather quickly If the gap is opened too wide ! I have used other performance coils and they all increased idle rpm and noticably improvement performance . This is my experience .

Re: Replacement Ignition Coil
 

your claim about better performance would not be measured by most by a change of rpm at idle, which isn't much of a yardstick.
Are there any dyno data to support this claim. What is happening at speed is the real measure.
Somehow 10K volt coils got us thru the first 80 years of the Model A, and suddenly they are inadequate?

Re: Replacement Ignition Coil
 

I figured that would be the next negitive comment . As I have said many times before , I have nothing to prove or gain here. Actually I never said that idle rpm was the test of increased power. Performance coils obviously are not for everyone . You could probably find a coil that would fill your needs , if you need one . at NAPA.

Re: Replacement Ignition Coil
 

already did, car runs fine

Re: Replacement Ignition Coil
 

My tudor has the coil that was on the car when I bought it 43 years ago. It runs fine.

Re: Replacement Ignition Coil
 

None of the model A's that I have now even had a coil when I got them .

Re: Replacement Ignition Coil
 

Now you've got my curiosity up! How much was the increase in idle RPM? I need to do some experimenting to see if I can duplicate your results.

Re: Replacement Ignition Coil
 

40 Deluxe, help me to understand what that would have to do with performance at speed, which is where the real money is

anyone got a dyno handy?

I suspect that somehow the timing was changed slightly