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-   -   Ford V8-60 (https://www.fordbarn.com/forum/showthread.php?t=63570)

johnsor 02-27-2012 03:46 PM

Ford V8-60
 

I am thinking about installing a Ford V8-60 in my Model A PU. Is this practicle or advisable? As I have access to a nice V8-60 engine, it seems it would be lightweight, smoother and 20hp more than the Model A engine. Should I make the hook-up to the existing Model A transmission with an adapter plate, or find a 37 transmission and modify the U-joint/torque tube connection? What's been done before? Any advice would be appreciated.

1931 flamingo 02-27-2012 06:44 PM

Re: Ford V8-60
 

I've read where thisa isn't as good a swap as you'd think. Try posting this on the model A forum. Now when I transplanted a pont tempest 4 cyl into my 32, that worked almost as good as the olds I took out.
Paul in CT

TonyM 02-27-2012 06:53 PM

Re: Ford V8-60
 

There was a thread about this topic here on V-8 Ford Barn before but I can't find it.

Most were trying to convince the guy not to do it.

One guy said, "Why, are you tired of going fast?"
or something like that.

T

rotorwrench 02-27-2012 08:08 PM

Re: Ford V8-60
 

The V8 60 fits a Model A better than the larger V8 for sure but none of them are bolt ins per say. The Model A guys are not the ones to ask about such things. To most of them folks, it's downright blasphemy.

The miget racers of old nearly used up all the good V8-60 motors so there aren't as many as there used to be. Parts are a little harder to scrounge up too.

Roger W Gerow 02-27-2012 10:12 PM

Re: Ford V8-60
 

Two suggestions. The little v/8 60 is not endowed with very much lowend torque. With the normal 3.78 ring and pinion in the rear end you will be disappointed with the lack of get up and go. I would recommed and 4.11 ratio to help with that. 2nd. use the "'39" transmission and get the necessary adapters for lthe pedals and wishbone from Specialty Ford Parts of Rosemead, California, phone 626-288-2121. These adapters are very good.

columbiA 02-28-2012 01:14 AM

Re: Ford V8-60
 

The stock V8 60 does not have much torque at any RPM. I think it only has about 90-95 ft lbs with a fairly flat torque curve.You would need the 60 trans as it is different than the 85 case.It will bolt up to the A rear end.Put a model B engine in it & it would have much more power & torque.My 30 A coupe has a 33B with a 5.9 cyl head & it will pull a 6 % grade with a 2.94 ratio in overdrive without slowing down.I think the cars with the 60 used a 4.44 ratio & even then they were under powered.The B engine is easy to install in an A .To retain the A trans,you need to remove the lower flywheel hsg that is part of the B pan and use the A F-W hsg,or you could use the B trans case with 39-48 gears & 39-52 shift top.with the later trans you would needthe adapters for pedals,mounts wishbone etc.Much easier to retain the A trans,and to me,part of the charm of the A is the sound of the straight cut gears & the art of double clutching.

JM 35 Sedan 02-28-2012 01:50 AM

Re: Ford V8-60
 

I ran into a great deal on a very nice V8 60 HP engine and transmission that was being sold by a guy who was just about to drop it into his Model A but apparently 'saw the light' at the last minute and decided not to make this swap. I have also read posts here and articles published elsewhere on why this may not be the best swap to consider. The stories always seem to evolve to the point that you would be far better off with a beefed up A or B engine in that Model A than a little 60 HP engine.
Now on the other hand if you talk to a guy named Richard Willim or read his book 'The Mighty Little V-8 60 HP Powerhouse', he may change your thinking back to going with a little 60 HP in that Model A. IMO, if I were considering swapping a Model A engine with some other type engine it would have to be an 85/100 HP Flathead Ford V-8 engine. Probably not that much more difficult to do, if any, and a whole lot more potential for increased performance as compared to a 60 HP engine. Lots of How To's have been written on what's known the 'AV8'. The most well known of these books is The Bishop & Tardel book on how to built an AV8. The book that probably launched thousands of these AV8 projects. I would suggest carefully reviewing all the pros and cons of this swap before plowing ahead. Good luck!!

Flat Ernie 02-28-2012 07:42 AM

Re: Ford V8-60
 

Quote:

Originally Posted by columbiA (Post 375102)
You would need the 60 trans as it is different than the 85 case.

There are two 60 trans; passenger & commercial. The passenger trans is a tiny thing unique in all aspects to the 60. The commercial trans actually uses 85HP internals & shares many parts.

But a standard 85HP trans can be adapted - you just need to hole-saw a hole for the 60 starter bendix and fabricate a cover for it - something like a tuna can or cat food can works. And with that in mind, you can modify any of the adapters for the 85 as well, so you could put a T5 or any other adapter with the same modifications.

Hoop 02-28-2012 08:42 AM

Re: Ford V8-60
 

Some other things to consider.

Installing a V8-60 in a Model A PU should produce better results than installing one in a sedan. Ford introduced the V8-60 as a "thrifty" engine but used it in cars that got increasingly heavier. Weigh is a factor of performance.

Unless you specifically want a Model A transmission, the various V8 transmissions make driving a little easier with "synchroed" downshifts to 2nd when you need them. V8-60 transmissions varied by year. Early passenger transmissions were smaller than the commercial transmissions, but in 1940 the passenger model was full size like the 85hp and the commercial V8-60.

All will "bolt-up" to the Model A torque tube with the right mix of V8 parts, like the clamshell.

One advantage, as mentioned, of the larger transmission is the availability pedal, wishbone and e-brake adapters. You lose these when you change from the Model A transmission.

Engine mounts and a rear transmission mount must be added.

If it's most performance bang for the buck, the Model A can be made to really shine. Otherwise, a V8-60 project can be a slick and beautiful sounding attention getter. Speed parts for the 60 can get mighty expensive.



http://i158.photobucket.com/albums/t...e/MVC-021S.jpg

Kurt in NJ 02-28-2012 08:59 AM

Re: Ford V8-60
 

Having driven a 60hp car, and owning a stock A I would say that the A engine wants to be under 3000 rpm, the 60 wants to be over 3000 rpm

My 34 Ford 02-28-2012 09:14 AM

Re: Ford V8-60
 

In 1963 when I was 18 I did what you are thinking of doing with a 60 HP V8. I was working in a garage during the summers and after and school both high school and college. My car at the time was a nice 31 Model A Coupe with a worn out engine. One of the mechanics at the garage was a big time fabricator and had just acquired a nice 37 Ford with a smooth running 60 HP engine. He pulled the flathead engine to put a sbc engine in. The 60 HP was mine for the asking. This conversion was a no brainer for me and it did not take long with his help and the assets of the garage to have this engine in my 31 coupe. A very easy install as everything bolted up using the 37 engine and 39 transmission. Glass pack duels and I was a happy guy. The car ran great. I never won any races but it was a good performer for the 2 more years I had the car. Never had any problems with it. The engine was an easy fit and looked like it came from the factory that way. After this long story I would say do the engine swap if you want and I think you will find that it creates a lot of interest when you start it up, especially if your A looks stock. The 60 HP with glass packs had a sound of its own. I was able to get a little bit more speed in each gear using the A rear end. Best regards Dennis

professorpat 02-28-2012 10:44 AM

Re: Ford V8-60
 

Hope the v/8 60 is not the "tin side" engine. hard to repair leaks. otherwise a fun little conversion

MARVIN, CT 02-28-2012 11:36 AM

Re: Ford V8-60
 

1 Attachment(s)
I put a '37 60hp in my '52 MGTD a couple years ago, first with an 85hp 3-speed, then a Mustang t-5. I use a reduction-gear starter so no cutting of the bell housing is needed but did have to make an adaptor plate for the t-5. It's been a challenge to keep the body stock, but lots of fun to build, and a blast to drive. The back side is, I've found the 60hp's to be quite pricey, even for just a good rebuildable one (always looking). Marvin

Greg in Jax 02-28-2012 12:11 PM

Re: Ford V8-60
 

1 Attachment(s)
Hoop is right. An A with a V8-60 actually gets up and goes nicely. I had one in a '31 RPU and it had plenty of power. It is not a very hard installation to do.

Gary in MN 02-28-2012 02:00 PM

Re: Ford V8-60
 

3 Attachment(s)
I have been running a V8 60HP in my RPU for about 4 years. Runs great, draws a lot of attention. I have the low rear end and it is pretty quick, but I have model "A" with a HC Wieand head and downdraft carbs that will just plain kick the V8 60Hp to the curb. With that low rear end the V8 60 HP screams at 60 mph. It does help to reduce the weight of the vehicle as much as possible, see the attached picture. The steering column is very close to the exhaust manifold. It was a fun build and a blast to drive. Gary in MN [ATTACH][ATTACH]Attachment 75222[/ATTACH][/ATTACH]

Hoop 02-28-2012 02:20 PM

Re: Ford V8-60
 

By the way, that was my neighbor Greg's transmission in the above photo. Sorry about the Coors Light can ... we dug it out of another neighbor's trash. Life's too short for light beer.

johnsor 02-28-2012 03:37 PM

Re: Ford V8-60
 

Thanks for all the posts and experienced opinions, and as a result I'm going to go with a modified A engine like I have in my 30 Roadster. The Roadster engine has a considerably lightened flywheel (29 lbs.), late 30's Ford clutch & pressure plate, balanced, .060" overbored, a Model B carb with an enlarged manifold port, a lively Bill Sipe cam, Brumfield HC head and a 3:54 ring & pinion. It still looks, sounds and idles like a Model A and it has a smooth "sweet spot" at 60mph on the road. The 6:50x16's makes it handle nice on the road also. Of course the best part of the Model A engine is the availability of many and relatively cheap parts. Its always good to ask. Thanks, John

mananaba 02-29-2012 11:08 AM

Re: Ford V8-60
 

Thanks for choosing the Model A engine. That means more V8 60 engines, speed equipment and parts for the bunch of us that enjoy the 90-100 hp one can get out of these petite little flatheads. Not to mention the beautiful sight of a 60 with polished aluminum heads and two Stromberg 81's on top sitting in the engine bay.

Fred A 03-02-2012 11:25 AM

It's All In The Gearing!
 

I had a T coupe that had a 60 . Most such swaps of that era used 3.78 Model A rear with the toy size trans and was not all that bad. It was bad aerodynamics that limited the T/V8-60 at the top. The same rig with an open wheel roadster would have been much better and capable of freeway speeds. Light as possible a stripped down roadster could be great. The V8-60 in an A has been poorly done quite often, but seldom given the gear ratios and weight consideration. My current plan is for my '31 roadster with a '40 sixty. The 4.56 rear gear and the V8 16/28 Ford passenger trans plus a Mitchell OD. That would put the first gear ratio at 12.86, slightly lower than the Model A's standard 11.79 overall. The 4.56 ratio in the rear gives final in OD of 3.37 with the Mitchell. This is still a bit tall for the 60 but with the Ford V8 trans there are many gearset ratios to choose from, but 4.56 is the highest reduction I could find for the Model A rear. Hope that with reduced weight would make the top gear still work. I still would have the choice of tires to nudge the effective gearing. Engine mods are less effective short of a supercharger than the most ignored parameter which is gearing. Good Luck: Fred A

norma7982 12-05-2013 08:26 PM

Re: Ford V8-60
 

ok, I am new to the forum and have a question, I have a 1952 Ford Victoria and I need an adapter for 3speed transmission to install a 351W, can I get some info from anyone that can tell me where to get one.


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