The Ford Barn - 1933 Dymaxion

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- - 1933 Dymaxion (https://www.fordbarn.com/forum/showthread.php?t=285532)

Re: 1933 Dymaxion

Love it. Thanks for sharing.

Re: 1933 Dymaxion

These are 'crazy-cool'. I believe at least three were built. DD

https://www.fordbarn.com/forum/attac...0&d=1597349803

https://www.fordbarn.com/forum/attac...1&d=1597349817

Don't know where this next pic was taken, but that appears to be a Sikorski S-38 Amphibian in the background.

https://www.fordbarn.com/forum/attac...4&d=1597349859

https://www.fordbarn.com/forum/attac...2&d=1597349832

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Re: 1933 Dymaxion

Hi Everyone, I found some interesting information on Wikipedia about these Dymaxions.

The Lane's replica is even mentioned near the bottom of the article.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dymaxion_car

Some of the articles in the references section are also intriguing.

The comments about the car being unstable are totally understandable. But it seems to me the 'death trap' rap is unfortunate and possibly from shabby or sensational reporting being repeated.

Somehow it smells like there is more story behind 'Chicago South Park Commissioner' who was a party to the death of Mr. Turner.

Re: 1933 Dymaxion

My experience has been that anything with rear steering is somewhat difficult to steer, think fork lift.

Re: 1933 Dymaxion

Quote:

Originally Posted by JSeery (Post 1919899)

My experience has been that anything with rear steering is somewhat difficult to steer, think fork lift.

Difficult to steer, yes. It becomes almost hypersensitive. I built this down hill kart with my son awhile back with similar design. Large fixed bike wheels in the front and a mini bike front wheel and forks in the rear to steer. The handles came from behind the driver up to your sides. It was a brain quiz every time you turned because it was backwards steering and the slightest turn was radical. Was fun but quickly revamped into the next idea....

https://www.fordbarn.com/forum/attac...1&d=1597384731

https://www.fordbarn.com/forum/attac...1&d=1597384731

https://www.fordbarn.com/forum/attac...1&d=1597384731

Very cool Dymaxion. Thanks for posting.

Re: 1933 Dymaxion

Quote:

Originally Posted by JSeery (Post 1919899)

My experience has been that anything with rear steering is somewhat difficult to steer, think fork lift.

J...…..You bring-up an interesting subject that just so happens, I know a little bit about. There is a very real reason for this unstable-steering phenomenon when moving forward in any vehicle with this "tail-wheel" steering configuration. The 'unstable' steering tendencies in a vehicle with this configuration is merely a result of physics, and if I had to guess, it probably falls under one of Mr. Newton's Laws.

Anyway, did y'all catch that "tail-wheel" thing I mentioned just above? This is the same phenomenon which pilots that have experience in taildraggers (like a DC-3 or a Piper Cub) know all about. Any time a tail-wheel-equipped airplane is moving forward with any speed at all while on the ground, and especially while landing or taking-off, the aircraft is susceptible to what is known as a "ground loop". A ground loop is the tendency for the tail of a tail-wheel-equipped airplane to swing either left or right, unstably, unless the pilot is vigilant and prepared to 'catch' and arrest the un-commanded swing with opposite rudder inputs. A taildragger pilot is always busy 'dancing' on the rudder pedals with small (or large) inputs when taking-off or landing. If he's not ahead of the airplane with the slightest deviation of the tail by correcting the beginnings of a swing with rudder input, the tail will gain momentum as it is allowed to swing farther and farther out of line with the desired direction of travel. Depending on the airplane involved, speed, possible crosswinds, and maybe even water on the runway, in the blink of an eye the tail can swing fiercely-around to a point that the airplane can be sliding sideways (or more), and even including leaning over onto the downstream wing tip causing damage there. The main landing gear can be damaged, or even sheared off of the aircraft. It CAN be a violent ride. Ground loops virtually NEVER occur in a nosewheel-equipped airplane. Watch how busy the pilot's feet stay on the rudder pedals during the last 25 seconds or so of this video while landing this small Luscombe taildragger....link below!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=faBwl8mEkc4

The 'physics' reason for this phenomenon occurring in vehicles (and airplanes) steering from the rear, like Will D's 3-wheeled terror, is because when traveling forward, the CG (center of gravity) is located BEHIND the two main (non-steerable) wheels. Once that CG really gets started on it's journey in a direction perpendicular to the direction the vehicle is traveling, momentum (remember Newton) builds to a point that the sideways movement (inertia) becomes too much to overcome....and you're destined for one of the rides of your life.

In the case of your childhood tricycle, forklifts DRIVEN IN REVERSE, and nosewheel-equipped airplanes, the CG is located IN FRONT of the two main wheels. Physics dictates that the CG of any moving vehicle is always trying to get in FRONT of, or to lead the two main wheels in the direction of travel. In any nosewheel-steering vehicle, the CG is ALWAYS in front of the two main (non-steering) wheels. Otherwise, if the CG was behind the main wheels, the vehicle (think airplane) would tilt back onto it's butt.

So, if Will D wants to turn the seat around in that racer and go the opposite direction, that thing ought to haul-buttsky STRAIGHT as an arrow down that hill! DD

https://www.fordbarn.com/forum/attac...1&d=1597384731

http://www.vintagewings.ca/Portals/0...0LoopTitle.jpg

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Re: 1933 Dymaxion

Quote:

Originally Posted by JSeery (Post 1919899)

My experience has been that anything with rear steering is somewhat difficult to steer, think fork lift.

I drive a forklift everyday and with two tons on the forks, at top speed (12mph), I’ve done a few of those “ground loops” Coopman mentions. Bottles of water go everywhere if you don’t back off on corners. You do have to pay attention to keep it going straight. I can’t imagine driving at road speed with rear steering.... Mark

Re: 1933 Dymaxion

When I was about 8 years old, we would walk the two blocks to the "68th street hill" (the biggest one in the neighborhood) and ride down it on anything available (bikes, scooters, coaster wagons, and even the older guys homemade "chugs"). One weekend, my uncle took us fishing in his 14 ft Alumacraft with a 10 HP Johnson. I was fascinated by how he steered the boat from the back. The next day, I took my Radio Flyer to the aforesaid hill and tried to go down backwards, using the handle like the tiller on the outboard.

I can attest to the fact that "anything with rear steering is somewhat difficult to steer". Make that extremely difficult. I spent the rest of the summer recovering from that experiment.:(

Re: 1933 Dymaxion

Quote:

Originally Posted by tubman (Post 1920099)

You use the same learning methods I do, trial and error and mostly error! :)

Re: 1933 Dymaxion

Coop, that was an excellent explanation and yes, you do know something about rear wheel steering!! Thanks for responding!!:)

Re: 1933 Dymaxion

As a short coupled airplane the Luscombe is a prime example. Having owned and flown a Luscombe 8A for several years I learned early on that a Luscombe had to be flown until the prop stopped. I never ground looped it but the guy I sold it to gound looped with in the first few weeks and took out the landing gear.