The Ford Barn

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-   -   IL-2 and AA collison (https://www.fordbarn.com/forum/showthread.php?t=271214)

M2M 10-20-2019 08:55 AM

IL-2 and AA collison
 

https://www.worldwarphotos.info/wp-c..._19_GAZ-AA.jpg


https://i.pinimg.com/originals/d6/63...a02b2f8616.jpg

mike657894 10-20-2019 09:12 AM

Re: IL-2 and AA collison
 

Oh my. I would like to see the A after repair. Wondering if they found a carpenter and it looked nice or if it just got wood screwed over the holes.

wensum 10-20-2019 02:55 PM

Re: IL-2 and AA collison
 

Was the aircraft's motor still going at the time of the crash? It looks like the prop may have started chopping into the cab?

Jeff/Illinois 10-20-2019 03:20 PM

Re: IL-2 and AA collison
 

That AA was too high up:)

Looks like Soviet markings on the plane.

Railcarmover 10-20-2019 06:18 PM

Re: IL-2 and AA collison
 

Sturmovik,a plane that struck fear in the panzer corps..low level attack bomber famed for its tank busting capabilities.The bottom of the fuselage was lined with 1/4" plate to protect the crew from ground fire..Soviet pilots were absolutely fearless,they would skirt the tree tops at full throttle firing that cannon below the exhaust..

As for the accident seen,the Soviets were a hardy,crazy bunch..on the approach to Germany in '45 many of the peasant troops hadn't seen such luxury..they commandeered bicycles,and so many of them were crushed by their own tanks on the march a directive was mandated,bicycle riding by red Army soldiers was banned..If you broke the rules in the Red Army is often led to a penal 'straf' battalion,who were often lined up in rows and marched through suspected german mine fields..a rudimentary mine detector..

The AA and A Gaz were perfect for them,robust,simple to operate and maintain,as an all purpose light truck for combat duty it was hard to beat..Like the sturmovik and the T34,the Red Army had simple,hardy and lethal equipment to beat the most technologically advanced army in the world at the time..

ursus 10-23-2019 03:12 PM

Re: IL-2 and AA collison
 

I find your postings of GAZ car and truck photos to be interesting. My father took part in a number of US Army reconnaissance ventures into Czechoslovakia and Hungary during the few weeks of confusion following the end of WWII. He had a number of exchanges (some friendly and some a bit tense) with Soviet troops and was amazed at the large number what he called "Russian knock-offs of the Model-A truck".

M2M 10-23-2019 05:09 PM

Re: IL-2 and AA collison
 

Quote:

Originally Posted by ursus (Post 1813007)
I find your postings of GAZ car and truck photos to be interesting. My father took part in a number of US Army reconnaissance ventures into Czechoslovakia and Hungary during the few weeks of confusion following the end of WWII. He had a number of exchanges (some friendly and some a bit tense) with Soviet troops and was amazed at the large number what he called "Russian knock-offs of the Model-A truck".

https://www.history.com/.image/t_sha...elbe-river.jpg

ETAModel 10-23-2019 08:56 PM

Re: IL-2 and AA collison
 

I can just hear the pilot..."Who the F#$%@ left that D@$%&^ truck in the middle of the F*&#%@ing runway !!!

Railcarmover 10-23-2019 08:58 PM

Re: IL-2 and AA collison
 

The Soviets were skilled at taking propaganda shots..here's a real shot of Red Army infantry,captured in 1941..Mongols,Tartars,Asiatics,Slavic..peasants for the most part,who's sheer bravery led Russia to victory..less than one in ten captured by the Germans in 1941 survived the war..

https://i.imgur.com/U5Xy58U.jpg?1

https://i.imgur.com/Q9cZUEn.jpg?1

M2M 10-23-2019 09:13 PM

Re: IL-2 and AA collison
 

A more recent meeting! A US F-22 fighter escorts a Russian Tu-95 nuclear capable "Bear" bomber off the coast of Alaska (August 8, 2019)

https://image.businessinsider.com/5d...jpeg&auto=webp

barnstuf 10-24-2019 08:09 PM

Re: IL-2 and AA collison
 

Railcarmover and Ursus in their above comments hit the nail on the head. I was there as a United States Army Air Force soldier and was in an area of Germany assigned to the Soviet Union to be their Army of Occupation territory. Russian Infantry soldiers for the most part marched informally or rode bikes they liberated. They checked every farmhouse near the road in the rural area where my unit met them marching in. They took chickens to eat, bikes to ride. The only Russian vehicles I saw were the Model AA stake body trucks. Without us asking for help the Russian soldiers pitched in to help us get our very large C2 wrecker out of the river where it was too heavy for a pontoon bridge and was partly submerged in the river. Once the C2 was out of the river we drove for miles in the Russian Occupation Zone to reach the American zone . We had zero problems with the Russian infantry troops we encountered for around 75 miles of driving. My European service was in the US Army Infantry and the US Army Air Force.

Railcarmover 10-24-2019 09:56 PM

Re: IL-2 and AA collison
 

Barn,you mentioned all the ways they beat the nazis..they were resourceful,stole or commandeered anything that helped them and would work as a team without thought for gain.The political kommissar was as deadly to them as the germans,more than enough evidence of kommissar's forcing unarmed troops into direct battle,ordering them to pick up the guns of their dead comrades...at gun point..They drank anything remotely resembling alcohol off the march,in east prussia hundreds of the died or went blind from drinking wood alcohol and industrial solvent..tough,ruthless and callous,it is estimated a million babies were born to german mothers by rape from red army soldiers.They defeated the cream of the german army,over 200 divisions,the best the germans put afield..in contrast the rest of the allies combined defeated about 40..the simple tough easily cannibalised GAZ fit them like a glove..The germans considered them 'untermensch'..sub human,except the landsers,the front line german soldier..he respected Ivan, the frontoviki..

JollyRoger 10-25-2019 10:34 PM

Re: IL-2 and AA collison
 

That second photo isn't Red Army captives; rather; conscripted Eastern European and Mongolian troops in Wehrmacht uniforms. They wouldn't fare well once turned over to their countrymen....... Ivan often shot returned prisoners for cowardice and to negate the possibility of them bringing home any fascist ideologies. Effective.

M2M 10-29-2019 07:36 AM

Re: IL-2 and AA collison
 

Quote:

Originally Posted by JollyRoger (Post 1813971)
That second photo isn't Red Army captives; rather; conscripted Eastern European and Mongolian troops in Wehrmacht uniforms. They wouldn't fare well once turned over to their countrymen....... Ivan often shot returned prisoners for cowardice and to negate the possibility of them bringing home any fascist ideologies. Effective.


That's what I thought. Soldier behind them looks like from USA?

JollyRoger 10-29-2019 10:07 PM

Re: IL-2 and AA collison
 

Indeed. Hard to say what outfit, given his advanced age and weight (for the era; most combat GI's were barely in their 20's and had to be fit). Probably in his late thirties, and possibly a retread from WW1. Maybe Military Police, although he -should- be wearing armbands and stripe on helmet. Mustache is out of spec, though.

History 10-30-2019 07:26 AM

Re: IL-2 and AA collison
 

Quote:

Originally Posted by JollyRoger (Post 1813971)
That second photo isn't Red Army captives; rather; conscripted Eastern European and Mongolian troops in Wehrmacht uniforms. They wouldn't fare well once turned over to their countrymen....... Ivan often shot returned prisoners for cowardice and to negate the possibility of them bringing home any fascist ideologies. Effective.

There were a ton of soldiers returned to Ivan who surrendered and then fought for the axis. Id be suprised if any lived to be old. I ordered some equipment parts once and the fellow had an accent, I asked where he was from and his dad was Russian. He was also a Russian soldier who'd been capture and fought for the Germans. He was able to use a different identity somehow when captured and wasn't returned to certain death. The brits and the US sent a lot of men to their deaths.


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