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-   -   Gas tank seeping. (https://www.fordbarn.com/forum/showthread.php?t=253819)

Len Mendonca 10-27-2018 03:12 PM

Gas tank seeping.
 

My 1931 model A pickup truck gas tank is seeping where the steering wheel shaft attaches to the bottom of the tank. I am looking for an easy way out, like something you put into the tank. I suspect the previous owner used a pour in sealer. I have owned this 1931 Model A pickup truck for 2 years and I saw evidence of a leak but now it is more obvious. I understand ethanol eats away at some of the pour in sealers.

Is there an easy way out for this?

100IH 10-27-2018 03:34 PM

Re: Gas tank seeping.
 

No easy way out unless you live in Tennessee. All sealers should be considered bad. Some may work but if they fail you have a bigger problem. If sealer works now, realize that alcohol content is going up. Many posts on tanks. it is the big problem facing every Model A. Welcome to the Barn Len.

Synchro909 10-27-2018 04:18 PM

Re: Gas tank seeping.
 

The first thing to do is install the 1931 steering column support like Ford used. They are available from the vendors. I make a RHD version and I've seen cases where simply installing the bracket was enough to stop the leak. Others have used an epoxy putty applied to a thoroughly cleaned underside of the tank and got a seal. The worst cases had to use a sealer. There are plenty of those and I'd advise not skimping when making your selection and following the manufacurer's instructions carefully. There are plenty of sealers that are alcohol proof and if applied properly, won't come adrift

30 Closed Cab PU 10-27-2018 04:25 PM

Re: Gas tank seeping.
 

For my info - thought I read that on 31s it attaches to the bottom of the dash?


Was moved to the dash because of this problem, people using the steering wheel to help getting in sand out of the model a, loosening the rivets.

1929 10-27-2018 04:52 PM

Re: Gas tank seeping.
 

When I saw a Model A owner get in my car by pulling on the steering wheel, I immediately took it off the tank, and changed to the 31 bracket to the dash board as Synchro states. I had a minor leak at the shut off valve and put some epoxy there, no leak in over 2 years.

37 Coupe 10-27-2018 05:10 PM

Re: Gas tank seeping.
 

Quote:

Originally Posted by 1929 (Post 1690002)
When I saw a Model A owner get in my car by pulling on the steering wheel, I immediately took it off the tank, and changed to the 31 bracket to the dash board as Synchro states. I had a minor leak at the shut off valve and put some epoxy there, no leak in over 2 years.

I saw a Zenith carb on Ebay a month or so ago and it had a red spot on it. I asked the seller what it was and he said it was something called Red Seal or something,he said it was temperature and fuel proof.I have yet to search and find a product like this with the word red in it and he did not give me anymore info.

eagle 10-27-2018 05:49 PM

Re: Gas tank seeping.
 

Years ago I bought a two-part epoxy tank sealer from Napa that went on the OUTSIDE of the tank to fix rust through, I have the same problem with the steering bracket seeping on my 29 Fordor. I've been going to try the sealer. It stayed somewhat flexible but was paintable. For the time being I just wrapped a rag around it but it does smell like gas in the car sometimes.

Tom Wesenberg 10-27-2018 10:27 PM

Re: Gas tank seeping.
 

Quote:

Originally Posted by 30 Closed Cab PU (Post 1689988)
For my info - thought I read that on 31s it attaches to the bottom of the dash?


Was moved to the dash because of this problem, people using the steering wheel to help getting in sand out of the model a, loosening the rivets.

Yes, it was moved away from the tank, but not until about April or May of 1931. My 31 Town Sedan is still tank mounted.

daveymc29 10-27-2018 11:40 PM

Re: Gas tank seeping.
 

Buy the 31 mount that moves the brace away from the tank. On some cars you will have to make an adapter to make it do the job, but it is easily done with common tools and no welding, just drill some holes in a bar to match the dash support and the column support, buy a few nuts and bolts and a couple of hours work you are done. Do not reattach the column down by the tank and center the column so that it doesn't touch the old mount on the tank. You will have to remove the dash rail and reinstall it, not a hard job at all. I made one for my 29 roadster and it has functioned well for several years now, since I first read about the leaking problem and looked at how the column is mounted to the tank. If it doesn't leak, it is just a matter of time until it will. Mine didn't but why wait until gas is dripping on your legs to try to be safe?

GerryAllen 10-28-2018 11:17 AM

Re: Gas tank seeping.
 

I did what Synchro909 did and no more problems
Gerry Birch Bay WA

Badpuppy 10-28-2018 02:08 PM

Re: Gas tank seeping.
 

Per Steve Plucker's site, about mid-1930 the tank bracket was shortened and the column lengthened for more legroom. That's what the 31 bracket will fit. For the earlier tanks, you'll need to fabricate a spacer of some sort.

BRENT in 10-uh-C 10-29-2018 12:14 AM

Re: Gas tank seeping.
 

I was kinda holding off on giving my opinion on this, but I think if you add sealer to the tank, you can pretty much plan on a failure due to the previous owner installing a sealer that is not working. Sealers will not bond to other sealers, especially when they have started degrading. Additionally, the sealer would need to be sloshed and drained which typically requires removing the tank from the vehicle. IMO, there really isn't an easy way except to sell the vehicle to someone else who can deal with the problem. Otherwise, you need to remove the tank, soak it in hot caustic to soften the sealer, -then remove the sealer by scraping followed by removing the bracket, welding up the rivet holes and redrilling new ones to rerivet the bracket back on.

JOHN CT 10-29-2018 05:58 AM

Re: Gas tank seeping.
 

I had a leak around the shut off valve. I cleaned the area and cleaned the area again then applied JB Weld for gas. So far no leaks for 2 years!
If the leak comes back I’m going to have to fix it the proper way by removing the tank, and welding it up.

BillEbob 10-29-2018 07:53 AM

Re: Gas tank seeping.
 

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tom Wesenberg (Post 1690082)
Yes, it was moved away from the tank, but not until about April or May of 1931. My 31 Town Sedan is still tank mounted.

Now Tom, are you talking about your "SteadyBreaker" or an actual Model "A" Ford? LOL 😂

Bill

woodiewagon46 10-29-2018 10:31 AM

Re: Gas tank seeping.
 

Everything that Brent states is correct. I am in the process of sealing my gas tank, but that's another story. A couple of weeks ago at Hershey I had a conversation with the Bill Hirsch people about gas tank sealers. He sells a sealer that they claim to be impervious to ethanol fuels. If you used the sealer that was used in the '70s and '80s, it's only a matter of time that the ethanol gas will break down the sealer. There has been a lot of talk on a couple of other car related sites about people having clogged fuel line and finding out it was the sealer.

37 Coupe 10-29-2018 11:09 AM

Re: Gas tank seeping.
 

It kinda is a shame the Model A gas tank is where and what it is.Before I get chastised let me explain.As the Model A is in its 90th year to me it seems the only thing that will hold it back for another ninety or mayby even 50 more years is metal fatique in the fuel tanks.This would be a great item to reproduce or even come up with some sort of a replacement but I doubt anyone will want to invest in the project as it could even be a legal nightmare. Reproducing a tank that was deemed unsafe almost 90 years ago,even somesort of plastic tank with a steel dash and cowl the new manufacturer would most likely be liable in an accident that mirrored one years ago. Point has been seen just recently with early Mustang fuel tanks,the fuel tank that was actually the trunk floor.Lawsuits against Ford in rear end accidents in 1965-66 Mustangs that were restored went to go against the restorer and the tank reproductions even though the original design was Fords.I still only have one worry about my '31 Ford future and that is the gas tank,mainly though it is how am I going to match up the color. I do have some first had knowledge about aforementioned Mustang rear end damage.I was sitting at a stop light in my brand new 1965 Ford Mustang with for sale signs on it,(Vietnam) and was hit full bore by a Comet Caliente,55mph in a 35 zone. crunched flat all the way to the rear window,no explosion.

rogerkb1936 10-29-2018 11:22 AM

Re: Gas tank seeping.
 

I ain't recommending this procedure for everyone, it did work for me. shortly after restoring my roadster 32 years ago, my column bracket started to seep. not wanting to remove the tank and damage the paint, I did the following: sandblasted the area around the bracket without damaging the surrounding paint (not easy). ran a hose from another cars exhaust into filler hole, a needed safety measure. with a common propane hand held torch, heated area til old solder ran out. did this twice. resoldered with with acid core, keeping heat mainly on bracket to draw solder in. cleaned up area carefully, and repainted with rattle can. over 33000 mi and still ok. this was a desperation effort, but it worked.

BRENT in 10-uh-C 10-29-2018 11:32 AM

Re: Gas tank seeping.
 

Quote:

Originally Posted by 37 Coupe (Post 1690609)
It kinda is a shame the Model A gas tank is where and what it is.Before I get chastised let me explain.As the Model A is in its 90th year to me it seems the only thing that will hold it back for another ninety or mayby even 50 more years is metal fatique in the fuel tanks.This would be a great item to reproduce or even come up with some sort of a replacement but I doubt anyone will want to invest in the project as it could even be a legal nightmare. Reproducing a tank that was deemed unsafe almost 90 years ago,even somesort of plastic tank with a steel dash and cowl the new manufacturer would most likely be liable in an accident that mirrored one years ago. Point has been seen just recently with early Mustang fuel tanks,the fuel tank that was actually the trunk floor.Lawsuits against Ford in rear end accidents in 1965-66 Mustangs that were restored went to go against the restorer and the tank reproductions even though the original design was Fords.I still only have one worry about my '31 Ford future and that is the gas tank,mainly though it is how am I going to match up the color. I do have some first had knowledge about aforementioned Mustang rear end damage.I was sitting at a stop light in my brand new 1965 Ford Mustang with for sale signs on it,(Vietnam) and was hit full bore by a Comet Caliente,55mph in a 35 zone. crunched flat all the way to the rear window,no explosion.




The reason that Model-A tanks are not reproduced is not due to a legal issue, -it is a simple financial feasibility issue. To manufacture tanks to fit all the Model-A needs, tooling would be required to manufacture 5 different tanks. The ROI would never support that. In addition, there really is not a need for tooling-up as there are plenty of existing original tanks that can be properly restored to fill the needs of current & future restorers.


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37 Coupe 10-29-2018 12:45 PM

Re: Gas tank seeping.
 

Wonder if any NOS tanks show up or ever did? Probably not in last 50 years.

BRENT in 10-uh-C 10-29-2018 03:00 PM

Re: Gas tank seeping.
 

Quote:

Originally Posted by 37 Coupe (Post 1690647)
Wonder if any NOS tanks show up or ever did? Probably not in last 50 years.



Yes, I have been involved in the hobby for about 50 years and can recall seeing one or two NOS tanks. And likely some NOS have been used which no longer makes them NOS. Again, what do you think is gained by using an NOS vs. a restored tank?


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