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ahshoe 04-17-2020 06:40 PM

Which PS fluid
 

I have a new rebuilt Eaton power steering pump and all new power steering stock items under my 61 Galaxie. Question : I have 2 different ATF quarts on my fluid shelf. I know both are for older Ford "automatic" trans. One says Type FA other says Type F. Which one should I use for my new Eaton PS system. Or is there no difference?

KULTULZ 04-17-2020 10:38 PM

Re: Which PS fluid
 

TYPE F fluid was not introduced until the 1968 model year. Original spec most likely called for TYPE A/TYPE A SUFFIX A which has evolved to DEXRON III.

Did the REMAN say what fluid to use?

oldbugger 04-22-2020 06:36 AM

Re: Which PS fluid
 

1968? really learn something new ever day

KULTULZ 04-22-2020 06:42 AM

Re: Which PS fluid
 

Well technically, 1967 as it was intended for use in the 1968 models.

Ole Don 04-22-2020 11:40 AM

Re: Which PS fluid
 

The system is so simple, I would think any clean ATF would work. If my memory serves me, I think my 55 with stock P/S has a little of each.

KULTULZ 04-22-2020 06:28 PM

Re: Which PS fluid
 

2 Attachment(s)
OP,

I don't think I would throw just anything into a PS SYSTEM, especially freshly rebuilt. There are different lubricity and additive package requirements.

Both ATF and PS fluid for this period was TYPE A - SUFFIX A. It has been upgraded (design progressions) many times over the years.

ahshoe 04-22-2020 08:32 PM

Re: Which PS fluid
 

Now I am more confused....type F or type FA.Anybodh just fill a nee Eaton pump Ford 60's system

KULTULZ 04-23-2020 02:33 AM

Re: Which PS fluid
 

Quote:

Originally Posted by ahshoe (Post 1878002)

Now I am more confused....type F or type FA.Anybodh just fill a nee Eaton pump Ford 60's system

DEXRON III or any GM SUGGESTED REPLACEMENT FOR DEXRON III

Buy it fresh and make sure the refiner has a license from GM - listed on bottle) to offer the correct fluid.

I never figured out what TYPE FA was.

FORD went to MERCON V and pulled the license for any previous MERCON oil. MERCON V is a synthetic blend and is suggested for all previous MERCON applications.

Be careful of imitations.

oldbugger 04-23-2020 06:19 AM

Re: Which PS fluid
 

Sooo, dextron III and type A are compatable?

KULTULZ 04-23-2020 08:28 AM

Re: Which PS fluid
 

Quote:

Originally Posted by oldbugger (Post 1878074)

Sooo, dextron III and type A are compatable?

TYPE A was discontinued decades ago. Progression development over the years has resulted in DEXRON III (GM) as the service replacement.

MERCON (FOMOCO) unique to FORD applications has resulted in MERCON V, a partial synthetic, called out for all previous MERCON applications.

Rule of thumb- TYPE F can be used in early GM DEXRON(S) application(s) but not visa-versa.

It is even more confusing now as TRANS are sourced from all over the world and require their own unique lubricants.

KULTULZ 04-23-2020 01:41 PM

Re: Which PS fluid
 

Maybe this will help understanding FORD ATF -

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MERCON..._%22A%22_Fluid

ahshoe 04-25-2020 09:10 AM

Re: Which PS fluid
 

I still hate to put the newest available PS fluid like Mercon V in a 1961 stock (rebuilt and NOS parts) system. So with what I have new quart wise on my shelf from awhile back are Type F and type FA...with that in mind which of these two would be best for my system?

KULTULZ 04-25-2020 10:25 AM

Re: Which PS fluid
 

Quote:

Originally Posted by ahshoe (Post 1879041)

I still hate to put the newest available PS fluid like Mercon V in a 1961 stock (rebuilt and NOS parts) system. So with what I have new quart wise on my shelf from awhile back are Type F and type FA...with that in mind which of these two would be best for my system?

Neither. How old is that oil?

DEXRON III (GM based) is the replacement. The only current use I know of for TYPE A (and this used whale oil until the use was outlawed) is for a gear box on certain bikes.

I can't help you any further. Maybe someone else can help you. Ol' Don had the answer, just dump anything into it.

ahshoe 04-25-2020 02:02 PM

Re: Which PS fluid
 

Thought anyone?

39deluxecp 04-25-2020 03:28 PM

Re: Which PS fluid
 

IHC hytrans fluid

rotorwrench 04-26-2020 12:21 PM

Re: Which PS fluid
 

Type F and Type FA are the same specification. Power steering likely won't care what's in there like a transmission would but I hesitate to mix ATF types. If it had type F (FA) then it would be wise to keep it that way unless it is completely drained. If the system is empty then you can use any type that is available to you.

KULTULZ 04-26-2020 12:51 PM

Re: Which PS fluid
 

Quote:

Originally Posted by rotorwrench (Post 1879603)

Type F and Type FA are the same specification.

On what do you base this claim?

KULTULZ 04-26-2020 06:17 PM

Re: Which PS fluid
 

Quote:

FA - FORD AUTOMATIC and POWER STEERING FLUID - PART NO. C1AZ 19582-A, C, D
FORD OIL AND LUBRICATION GUIDE - VOL 69-ST-15

(A-B-C-D) were TYPE A SUFFIX A FORD SPECIFIC blend progression in 1959-1960 - All were TYPE A)

In 1959, FORD blended it's own version of GM TYPE A SUFFIX A. I think it was called FA (I never saw that description) to differentiate it from GM TYPE A - SUFFIX A. Final version was D for the 1961 model run.

There was also an FA released in 1980 or thereabouts for the C5. It was backwards compatible with TYPE F but did not replace it as you can still buy it from FORD today.

EDIT -

The above statements are not correct. Please ignore. Source not verified.

I see FA on independent refiners packaging (and didn't pay any attention to it) but never saw it on FORD packaging.

While researching this, I came across some of the strangest stories and claims imaginable.

I hate 'OL WIVES TALES ... They just keep on going ...

rotorwrench 04-27-2020 12:11 PM

Re: Which PS fluid
 

The first time I ran into type F/A I was thinking, what the hell is this, so it checked further and it is a conglomeration of variations of the Type F. Type A and Type F are and have been considered obsolete for some time and as such, they are no longer regulated. In other words, you can mark them however you want to if your in the business of marketing ATF unless someone has a trademark on the type. I think it's an iteration of type F and type A grafted together but I can't prove anything since few even show the Ford specification numbers on them any more. They can avoid trademark infringement problems if they change the lettering.

The type F was developed as a high friction fluid for Ford transmissions that were manufactured before a certain date (replaces type A and type B) or those that have the ESW-M2C33-F spec stamped on the dip stick. It works well in certain type fluid pumps too. Any Ford transmission that has metal clutch plates can benefit from having a fluid with high friction characteristics. Some drag racers like to use it for harder lock up on launch in any transmission from GM to Mopar.

KULTULZ 04-27-2020 12:20 PM

Re: Which PS fluid
 

Quote:

The type F was developed as a high friction fluid for Ford transmissions that were manufactured before a certain date (replaces type A and type B)
TYPE F was not a replacement for any DEXRON (GM trade name) - MERCON based ATF.

KULTULZ 04-27-2020 12:29 PM

Re: Which PS fluid
 

Quote:

Originally Posted by KULTULZ (Post 1879780)
FORD OIL AND LUBRICATION GUIDE - VOL 69-ST-15

(A-C-D) were TYPE A SUFFIX A blend progression in 1959-1960 - All were TYPE A)

OK, got to wondering and what I read in the LUBRICATION GUIDE was explained in a footnote, KEY TO LUBRICANTS.

FA - FORD AUTOMATIC TRANSMISSION and PS FLUID.

Another example - ST - STANDARD TRANSMISSION LUBRICANT and so on.

FA does not stand for a type of fluid, at least in FOMOCO terminology.

I have seen on aftermarket fluids the description FA and I am now a$$-u-mine(ing) is just is a description of FORD AUTOMATIC.

rotorwrench 04-27-2020 05:42 PM

Re: Which PS fluid
 

It replaces type A & B for FORDS. GM products use the Dexron.

Mercon came later to merge type CJ and type H. Type F is named after the last dash letter of the original Ford specification. Type A no longer exists in its original form. No whale oil, no type A. Type B is gone as well. Dexron replaces that stuff in GM units. The type A & B are obsolete so anyone can claim a type A or B but that is just a claim it's not a fact.

Ford made the spec. It's not compatible with anything else but it is what it is. It was made to work in old Fords and later Fords just before the AOD family. We used it in all the old Fords with cruise-o-matics, FMX, and C4 transmissions. I would never use Dexron in those old transmissions. Ya'll can use what ever you want it's a free country.

KULTULZ 04-27-2020 06:29 PM

Re: Which PS fluid
 

Quote:

Originally Posted by rotorwrench (Post 1880235)

It replaces type A & B for FORDS. GM products use the Dexron.

Mercon came later to merge type CJ and type H.

It referring to TYPE FA?

Quote:

Valvoline Type FA is a high-quality transmission fluid specifically engineered to protect and prolong the life of automatic transmissions. It is designed for use where Ford specifications M2C33-F, M2C33-G and Ford Type F fluids are recommended."

Provides excellent resistance against clutch slippage for extended transmission life.

Provides excellent resistance to fluid oxidation/breakdown at high temperatures.

Approved for 1980 and earlier Ford, Lincoln and Mercury vehicles.

Approved for use in Mazda, Saab, Toyota, Volvo and other Japanese and European vehicles requiring a Type F fluid.

TYPE FA seems to be an aftermarket fluid designation only. There is no reference to the description in FORD literature and/or packaging. The above is VALVOLINE's statement, not FORD's.

If a person cannot ask a question and get a truthful and knowledgeable answer, this only becomes a bull-sh!at session.

BTW - You need to read the history of MERCON.

Quote:

Aftermarket Automatic Transmission Fluids -

For over 70 years, the oil aftermarket has produced both licensed, and non-licensed, formulations of automatic transmission fluid. Today, aftermarket fluids asserted by their manufacturers to be compatible for use in General Motors automatic transmissions continue to be sold under names such as Dexron/Mercon, Multi-Purpose, and Multi-Vehicle fluids.

Non-licensed fluid is typically less expensive, these fluids are not regulated or endorsed by Ford for use in their transmissions. Vehicle manufacturer approved and licensed fluids must have the license number printed on the product information label of the container or on the container housing. Non-Licensed fluids do not show a license number. Make sure the fluid to be installed into a transmission matches the recommended fluid in the specifications section of the vehicle's owner's manual.

This has been a lost exercise.

KULTULZ 04-28-2020 08:28 AM

Re: Which PS fluid
 

1 Attachment(s)
Quote:

It replaces type A & B for FORDS. GM products use the Dexron.
FORD used DEXRON and even had a license from GM to blend and sell it -

rotorwrench 04-28-2020 01:11 PM

Re: Which PS fluid
 

I have never used Ford branded fluids since they tend to charge more and it was more convenient to go to my Uncle's auto parts store. I've always purchased aftermarket lubricants.

When the C6 came out, it changed things at Ford. They were getting closer to being able to use the same fluids across the board since so many C6s were put into service. I've had my share of GM products and I use aftermarket Dexron labeled products in them. ATF products have changed about as much as motor oils and most folks don't know what motor oil to use either. Most all transmissions are made the same way now days. There are so many 4 & 5 speed electric automatics in service that they about have to use the same ATF. The foreign made cars are the ones you have to check now. There are some odd ball fluids for those. Even a lot of manual transmissions went to ATF.

If you want to see some BS just look up Dexron. It makes Mercon seem tame. It came out at the same time as Ford Type F.


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