I’m sure it’s been asked but I need help with removing valves
 

I’m really not trying to overwhelm the board with questions but i’m stuck.

I’m trying to remove the valves from my 40 block and after 2 hours have had zero luck. I’ve read books, I’ve watched videos Etc but I’m stuck so I come to you.

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Do I remove #1 clip first? I have the pickle fork to pry on the springs. If so, what’s the trick? I’ve removed all tension from the spring (I think) and it won’t budge. I tried making a hook tool to hook into the hole and pull, no dice. I’ve put vice grips on it and pulled, no dice.

Or do I pry the other way and remove #2 first? I watched a video where he took the lower clip out first then kinda pried the spring out. It didn’t seem right.

And as a worst case scenario, if I don’t plan on reusing the valves, guides and springs, is it a bad idea to just cut them out?

Re: I’m sure it’s been asked but I need help with removing valves
 

https://www.fordbarn.com/forum/attac...2&d=1669844836

https://www.fordbarn.com/forum/attac...3&d=1669844836

Re: I’m sure it’s been asked but I need help with removing valves
 

clip 1 is what holds it all in there and by the look of them they have been in there a long time your on the correct track force the spring toward the cam untill you see a small gap between the spring and the seat and pull out the retainer clip then valve spring and guide should be able to be withdrawn away from the cam [I SAID SHOULD} reality they get stuck Ford made a tool to pull them out as an assembly 50/50 dextron/diesel mix will help loosen them up but patience is required by the bucket load

Re: I’m sure it’s been asked but I need help with removing valves
 

Patience is no joke. Being one not to give up, I gave it another hour and got ONE lower clip (#2 in my photos) and spring out. Wahoo! But #1 is still stuck. I saw a video where the guy mentioned using a drum brake spring tool (with hook on the end) and a slide hammer. I have both tools but need to come up with a clever way of attaching the two so I can slide hammer it out (unless that’s a bad idea?).

Re: I’m sure it’s been asked but I need help with removing valves
 

The crucial bit of info that you might be missing is that you have to move the guide down first. That will free up the uppermost clip. Once the clip is removed the whole assembly can be removed in an upwards direction.
The problem is that the guides are so tight that the normal pickle fork valve tool can't get enough grip on them to pull them down.
I have had good luck using a tyre iron down the intake ports to push the guides down. Horseshoe clips are then removed and the valve removed upwards as stated.

If you can't move the guides down you can try lifting the spring and removing the valve retainer. then lift the valve as far as it will go and yank the spring out of there. Then you use an "onion" tool to go around the valve head and knock the guide down.
Yank the horseshoe clip out and either push the guide up or sometimes you can continue knocking the guide all the way down until the two halves fall out below.

You need a selection of valve compressor tools, pickle fork levers, onion tools, hooks, plus I also have a specific flathead valve removal tool. That is like a big C clamp. It still relies on the horseshoe clip being removed though.

There is also a special spike that is used to yank the horseshoe clips out but that can be hit and miss.

First and foremost try a tyre lever down the intake ports, it is a great labour saver.

If any of the videos you watched were from Mart's Garage that was me.

I have showed valve removal many times.

Some people just launch straight in with the cutting torch but I try and save what I can.

Good luck with it.

Re: I’m sure it’s been asked but I need help with removing valves
 

Thanks Mart! On the one valve I’ve gotten free (spring removed) there is no notch for
My pickle fork to grab to push the guide down. It’s just smooth. Does that make sense? I’ll try and grab a photo.

Edit, here’s a photo. No groove for the pickle fork to grab?
Attachment 504407

Re: I’m sure it’s been asked but I need help with removing valves
 

I just watched a couple of videos and jeezus there is some really bad info being spouted.

You need to lift the valve as far as it will go and get something around it to knock the guide down.

There are two schools of thought. First is to try and save as much as possible. The other is to trash everything because it will all be replaced. The videos I saw seem to favour the latter.

Edit: Just saw the pic. The grooves have broken out the end of the guide halves. Your only option is to knock the guide down from above. As it is an inlet try a tyre lever first.

I've got to turn in now as it is late here in the UK. I will check back in the morning. Don't panic or feel like you have to rush anything. Check some of my videos. I have showed it quite a few times.

Re: I’m sure it’s been asked but I need help with removing valves
 

Hey Mart, what is your YouTube name? I’ll be sure to check out your videos. Also, what’s an onion tool?

Re: I’m sure it’s been asked but I need help with removing valves
 

Yeah, you need the correct tools. here's two different types of the driver to get the guide down, and on the right the pry bar to remove the clips

Re: I’m sure it’s been asked but I need help with removing valves
 

Thanks cas. That helps a lot. I’m a visual person. I finally got one out! But it was not pretty and won’t be reusable. Since I was going to buy new springs and valves and all that jazz anyway (3-4 are stuck, lotta rust etc). I think the time to cut the rest out has come. I don’t want to damage the block by prodding and prying on parts that I’m going to replace anyway. So, what’s the best way to cut these out? Plasma cutter? Dremel? Cutoff wheel? I have all of the above. Can I cut springs and valves or should I remove springs first?

Re: I’m sure it’s been asked but I need help with removing valves
 

I have a tool that looks like a C clamp that reaches in and after the big horseshoe clip has been removed, pulls the valve, valve guide and spring all out as 1 unit. I have never found a guide that was too rusted to be pulled with this puller. Tomorrow I will put pictures of this tool in my MISC folder.

Re: I’m sure it’s been asked but I need help with removing valves
 

If you are planning on all new, then, yes many folks just cut all the springs with a torch, and then pry the valves up , cut the heads off, and drive the guide and stem down into the valve chamber. Depends on if you are just trying to freshen up an old motor, or a complete rebuild. Mart has several videos on his youtube site about tearing down stuck motors. I saw your posts at the hamb, nice car you got, post some pics for the guys here

Re: I’m sure it’s been asked but I need help with removing valves
 

Since the clip & guide are usually bonded to each other and the block, a drift like Mart's or cas3 easily releases the clip without busting a guide lip trying to pry it down.

To complete the job, insert shims between spring coils with valve closed. Slowly turn crank a bit to let the camshaft push the guide up just enough so that a thick shim will fit between the lifter & mushroom.


Then back off the cam, remove coil shims & insert thick shim. Stick a catch bucket over the valve head. Turn the crank to fully depress the spring.Then walk away & let spring tension & penetrating oil do their magic.After a few hours. the whole valve assembly will often be found in the catch bucket.

Re: I’m sure it’s been asked but I need help with removing valves
 

https://www.fordbarn.com/forum/pictu...ictureid=45164

OK, This is the tool that has always worked for me. Note the notch at the small end of the tool, that goes into a groove at the small end of the guide. At the top the part that gives the valve head room to come up is on a swivel. Once the large horseshoe clip that holds the guide in the block is removed this tool forces the guide, spring and valve out as a unit. I have only had to put a cheater bar on the handle once but it has always worked.
Picture is also in my MISC album.
I just looked and there are several of these K&D 918 valve guide tools on Ebay now.

Re: I’m sure it’s been asked but I need help with removing valves
 

^^ I have one of those tools and it has saved my bacon a few times. The notch at the small end (of mine at least) is sized to go around the valve stem diameter. It would not go into the grooves on the guide.

I never know whether the small blade is supposed to go against the end of the guide halves or whether it is supposed to just pull up on the spring until it goes coilbound and pushes the guide up.

It was a very lucky swap meet find here in the UK.

Mart.

Re: I’m sure it’s been asked but I need help with removing valves
 

I guess it fits some guides and if not, will push on the bottom after clearing the valve stem. Either way it is a great tool.

Re: I’m sure it’s been asked but I need help with removing valves
 

You like pictures, some more tools. The clamp thingy is like Deuce posted, its a K&D 918 valve guide puller. The center tool is a tire spoon I cut a notch in to fit around the valve stem and pry up the spring to get the keepers off, and on the right is the real tool for that, that I just bought at a swap meet last year and have not used it yet. Note the is a big and small size notch, not sure why. That tool is a Lectrolite model 500 made in USA. I believe Speedway sells them new, or a chinese copy anyway

Re: I’m sure it’s been asked but I need help with removing valves
 

I have the All Power removal tools. One is used to lock onto the tongue of the retailer clip and pry it out and the other is a wedge tool with a slide hammer to drive the valves up from the bottom.

The 8BAs are easier due to removable keys to get the valve out of the guides. The mushroom tip stems usually require a driver or puller like the KD type. I've had some stuck bad enough to pull the crank and cam out first and then drive them out from below. Where there is a will, there is a way. If all else fails the cut the valve stems.

Re: I’m sure it’s been asked but I need help with removing valves
 

I also have the All Power tool to get the keepers out. You must clean the tab of oil and sludge so the knurled part can bite into it. You insert the tool and slide the keeper tang into it. There is a lever to release spring tension. I would highly recommend picking one of these up if you see one for sale. Close up of knurled part that grabs the tang

[IMG]https://www.fordbarn.com/forum/pictu...ictureid=45165[/IMG]
https://www.fordbarn.com/forum/pictu...ictureid=45166

Re: I’m sure it’s been asked but I need help with removing valves
 

The All Power valve tools are great. I wish someone would make them again. When all else fails, cut the springs and the valve stems. I have scars on both hands from engines that I have torn down. The K-D 918 tool is a good one; they also made on for 60hp engines.

Re: I’m sure it’s been asked but I need help with removing valves
 

How's the valve project going Mr bus guy ? we need a progress report !

Re: I’m sure it’s been asked but I need help with removing valves
 

I may or may not have busted out the plasma cutter. Haha. Not necessarily my proudest moment but with the rust on this block (inside the ports) and knowing I’ll be replacing all these parts anyway, I gave up. I still have two stuck even after cutting but I’ll get them out. Working on drilling the top of the valve off so I can knock the guides down. Not pretty but at least I’m close to getting this thing to the machine shop for the fun stuff.

Re: I’m sure it’s been asked but I need help with removing valves
 

When you get to the violence part, keep in mind the guide is split in two halves, so if you are pounding on the remains of the stem with some taper still on it, it would expand the guide making it tighter, or perhaps even break the block. I'd try a piece of pipe on the guide I think, and not the stem unless its only the straight portion left.

Re: I’m sure it’s been asked but I need help with removing valves
 

When you are ordering new parts, get the late flathead style valve conversion set. The one piece guides and straight stem valves will make assembly much easier, and less likely to let oil suck into the port.

Re: I’m sure it’s been asked but I need help with removing valves
 

I had one that was stuck, yup #8, so I stuck my pickle fork under the bottom & pounded away. When it came out it flew across the garage headed for where my 32 roadster was resting, the next bay over. I was praying wouldn't hit the car, quick, short prayer, but not in time. I didn't hear it hit but did find a grease spot, on my top 1/4 sail panel. PHEW that was a close one. Definitely will be more careful next time.

Re: I’m sure it’s been asked but I need help with removing valves
 

I have one of those All-Power Valve guider keeper removal bars. They are hard to find. It has a knurled end that grabs the tab on the keeper and rips it right out. It works on guides that are stuck so bad that the flathead valve bar won't budge them down. It destroys the keeper, but it gets them out. Then I use a bearing press plate under the valve head. As I tighten the nuts it pulls up on the valve until the guide pops loose. It works really well for getting the most stubborn guides loose. That way I'm not pounding on stuff.

Sorry I don't have a photo of the All-Power Tool in my computer, but I have a couple of the press plate popping a guide out that refused to budge. They all
came out with the valve bar except two that refused to move even after ripping the keepers out with the All-Power tool. I had this press plate hanging on the wall and I had a vision. It popped them out without hardly any effort.

Re: I’m sure it’s been asked but I need help with removing valves
 

By golly, thats a good idea !

Re: I’m sure it’s been asked but I need help with removing valves
 

I’m not proud. But it’s done. On the flip side I think I did no damage to the block going this route whereas if I hadn’t cut stuff, I think I woulda been prying on things so much it may have damaged things. Anyway, it is what it is and at least it’s done and I can take it to the machine shop this week.

The carnage.
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Re: I’m sure it’s been asked but I need help with removing valves
 

Good job ! Thats a real nice coupe you got, I saw it on the hamb. Post the pics for the guys here !

Re: I’m sure it’s been asked but I need help with removing valves
 

I have taken a piece of pipe cut to just fit under the valve with the spring compressed, valve all the way open. You will have to saw it length wise so it can go around the stem, tap the head of the valve with a 5 lbs, it should drive out the guide enough to remove it from the cam side. You'll have to take keepers and old spring out to get room. Hot from back yard mechanic!!

Re: I’m sure it’s been asked but I need help with removing valves
 

Is it time for a conversation about studs?

Re: I’m sure it’s been asked but I need help with removing valves
 

I’m dreading it! But I may buy that tool that’s been talked about here in the last week that heats the studs. Or I’ll get lucky and won’t need to remove them.

Re: I’m sure it’s been asked but I need help with removing valves
 

Haha. That was me who posted about the Bolt Buster. After using the oxy-acetylene torch on a number of flatheads when removing studs, I can't recommended the Bolt Buster highly enough.

It does the same thing, maybe better and its a lot quicker and safer.

Later, I'll also post my arsenal of valve tools. I have both All Power tools and the K-D tool posted here. If these tools can't get the guide out, it ain't coming out.