How to clean out a fuel line on the car?

[Old Henry]

Is there a particular gauge of wire that anyone has used to run through the fuel line that is stiff enough to push through but flexible enough to bend around the bends?

[ford38v8]

Instead of tinkering with the old decrepit line, get a new one from Roy.

[325w]

Depending on line size an old speedo cable might be the trick.

[Step-down]

Compressed air ?

[Old Henry]

Originally Posted by ford38v8

Instead of tinkering with the old decrepit line, get a new one from Roy.

If it was my car to drive the rest of my life I wouldn't hesitate to do just that. But, I'm just trying to get this one driving reliably as quick, easy, and cheap as possible to sell it as fast as I can for the widow of my friend that owned it.

[Ralph Moore]

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A ten foot piece of pipe cleaner!

Seriously, I don't think your going to get a wire to go that distance with those kind of bends. Your best bet was mentioned, air. Try it both directions.

[oldford2]

Originally Posted by ford38v8

Instead of tinkering with the old decrepit line, get a new one from Roy.

Professor,
You are getting stubborn on this. You can go to NAPA and get 15' of copper line and fittings for less than $25. ( now come the arm chair engineers that will say copper will work harden and leak and your car will explode). In the time you have spent looking for the air leak and the time you have spent on the computer you could have the car on the road.
This is getting frustrating.
JMO
John
__________________

[waterboychuck]

Does the car run now? How is the fuel filter? Like the others I would blow the line out with air and replace the filter/s.

[prpmmp]

Originally Posted by oldford2

Professor,
You are getting stubborn on this. You can go to NAPA and get 15' of copper line and fittings for less than $25. ( now come the arm chair engineers that will say copper will work harden and flareleak and your car will explode). In the time you have spent looking for the air leak and the time you have spent on the computer you could have the car on the road.
This is getting frustrating.
JMO
John
__________________

Actually get

nickel copper line,DOT approved for brake lines,easy to bend and easy to do inverted flares. Great stuff(little expensive but worth it(no rust) Pete

[BILL WZOREK]

Originally Posted by Old Henry

If it was my car to drive the rest of my life I wouldn't hesitate to do just that. But, I'm just trying to get this one driving reliably as quick, easy, and cheap as possible to sell it as fast as I can for the widow of my friend that owned it.

Two words that should mean something / Spend the $$ and do it right !!

[countrysquire]

Weed eater line should work.

[zzlegend]

A friend just did this on a 55 ford seven days ago. Had two gallons of gas in the tank, removed the line from the fuel pump, put a rag around the air hose and blew into the tank. Nice steady stream appeared out of the line. Just a thought.

[Ross F-1]

I took my F-1's lines off and beat on them with a ball pein hammer for an hour. Even when they were off the truck no amount of air or solvent would do much but make a mess. Rusty stuff was still coming out. Threw them away and bought new coated steel brake line at NAPA. Never a problem since.

I think an out-of-town buyer would see it as a big selling point to be able to drive it home.

[40 Deluxe]

I used garage door cable. Worked great! It's flexible yet stiff enough to push through the line. If you have the line loose at the tank, when the cable comes out frazzle the end and work it back and forth as you pull it out. Flush carb cleaner down the line as you do this.

[Old Henry]

Originally Posted by 40 Deluxe

I used garage door cable. Worked great! It's flexible yet stiff enough to push through the line. If you have the line loose at the tank, when the cable comes out frazzle the end and work it back and forth as you pull it out. Flush carb cleaner down the line as you do this.

Originally Posted by countrysquire

Weed eater line should work.

Originally Posted by Step-down

Compressed air ?

Originally Posted by 325w

Depending on line size an old speedo cable might be the trick.

These are the helpful hints I was looking for. Not the condemnation for even trying to clean out the line instead of just replacing it. Funny how sometimes in response to a simple question about how to do something too many responses are like, "Why would you even want to do a stupid thing like that???" instead of just giving a helpful answer to the question.

Thanks guys.

[ford38v8]

Originally Posted by Old Henry

"Why would you even want to do a stupid thing like that???" Thanks guys.

Henry, I sincerely apologize for my thoughts and those of the others here. We clearly were speaking from our own experience rather than considering your methodology of seeking answers to agree with your decisions.

[V8COOPMAN]

Originally Posted by ford38v8

.....................considering your methodology of seeking answers to agree with your decisions.

Alan.......FINALLY, the ULTIMATE answer, after all these years of frustration for those with a little bit of real experience. DD

[51 MERC-CT]

I think I'm getting brain cramp I'm going to clean the dust off my car and possibly regain some of my lost sanity

[B-O-B]

Who is making the popcorn???

[Old Henry]

I decided to do one more 2 minute test of the flow through my gas line this morning before concluding that it was plugged and needed cleaned out or replaced. I put my tube on the engine end of the gas line and draped it out over the fender where I could see it. Then I put the end of my shop vacuum blowing air against the filler neck of the gas tank to pressurize the tank and push the gas through the line to see if it would. It did just fine. I had full flow of gas through the line. So, it doesn't need cleaned out nor replaced because of a blockage. I may yet conclude that it has an air leak and have to replace it because of that but I won't know that until I rebuild the fuel pump and am sure that it's working right.

So, you see, if I had just "thrown a new fuel line in" at this point because of a suspected blockage I would have wasted my money, and, even worse, endless torment groveling under the car laboring to replace it. As Henry Ford once said: "Hard knocks have a place and value, but hard thinking goes farther in less time."

Here is my "real life experience" (hard knocks, if you will) that converted me to accurately diagnosing a problem before prescribing a treatment:

Some years ago my car died coming back from a parade. Couldn't get it started for nothing. My son in law was traveling with me in his Suburban so he drug me home. I tried everything I could think of for a couple of months trying to get the engine to start and run. Nothing worked. It seemed like the compression was low so I concluded it may well need rebuilding. I found a reputable rebuilder recommended by many around the country and took it to him. But, I told him explicitly when I delivered the car: "I do not want to rebuild this engine unless it is absolutely necessary. Do everything you can think of to get it started and running before you decide to rebuild it." The next morning he called me and said, "We couldn't get the engine started so we've already got it out of the car and started rebuilding it." What was I to do? He was the one with the "experience". So, it took a couple more months and several thousand dollars for him to rebuild it. When I went to pick it up . . . it still wouldn't start!!! I had to tow it home. (The rebuilder didn't know why it wouldn't start. Duh!) It was then that I tried something I hadn't before. When the engine had died I had just put a new condenser in so never suspected that nor replaced it. Now I did, since that was the only thing I hadn't done. The engine started and ran just fine.

So, for lack of accurately diagnosing the problem that had a 10 minute and $10.00 solution, I was without the car for four months and out several thousand dollars needlessly. That, my friends, is why I no longer "just throw some new parts at the problem" but do, instead, the "hard thinking" that Henry Ford talked about to figure things out.

[zzlegend]

HUMMMMM,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,This sounds familiar

[51 MERC-CT]

Have you tried running a plastic line to a one or two gallon gas can outside the car to see if the air bubble phenomenon still exists ?

[Tinker]

Originally Posted by ford38v8

Instead of tinkering with the old decrepit line, get a new one from Roy.

Hey this tinker'er would just replace it....

[Old Henry]

Originally Posted by 51 MERC-CT

Have you tried running a plastic line to a one or two gallon gas can outside the car to see if the air bubble phenomenon still exists ?

I had considered this as was suggested by another but have not because the phenomenon only exists while driving the car or immediately thereafter while the car is still idling. I couldn't duplicate those circumstances by shutting off the engine, disconnecting the fuel line and, thereby, introducing air into the line, then trying to pump from a gas can. I'm still going to try it though. Can't hurt. May learn something.

I did notice when I was testing the vacuum with a gauge T'ed into the line yesterday that no air was coming up out of the metal line into the clear tube as I'd seen the day before. Still, the clear tube eventually filled up with air, the fuel quit flowing, and the engine died. That is more indication of a pump problem than fuel line air problem to me. Hopefully rebuilding the pump next week will cure all ills.

Thanks for the suggestion.

[Old Henry]

While I'm on my "Diagnose before you prescribe" soap box, here's another story:

Many more years ago when I was a car dealer I bought a really nice looking car for real cheap at the auto auction that wouldn't start. I towed it to a garage that specialized in that kind of car and told them to figure out why it wouldn't start and fix it. They called me shortly thereafter and said it needed a valve job for several hundred dollars. I couldn't believe that's why it wouldn't start but what did I know? I left it to those with the "experience" and gave them the go ahead for the valve job. A few days and several hundred dollars later I went to pick up the car. It still wouldn't start!!! I was pretty upset and let them know it. They took it back in the garage while I was waiting and figured out that the reason it wouldn't start was because the interlock switch in the gear shift was bad keeping it from starting. "So, how did you start it to work on it?" "We just started it under the hood shorting the solenoid." Lesson learned. Diagnose before you prescribe.

[51 MERC-CT]

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Originally Posted by Old Henry

Hopefully rebuilding the pump next week will cure all ills.

Just to relay my experience with a NAPA 8BA pump.
It was installed over a decade ago and has not had any problems that have been predicted by others if operated on ethanol fuels.

[V8COOPMAN]

Originally Posted by Old Henry

While I'm on my "Diagnose before you prescribe" soap box, here's another story:

Many more years ago when I was a car dealer I bought a really nice looking car for real cheap at the auto auction that wouldn't start. I towed it to a garage that specialized in that kind of car and told them to figure out why it wouldn't start and fix it. They called me shortly thereafter and said it needed a valve job for several hundred dollars. I couldn't believe that's why it wouldn't start but what did I know? I left it to those with the "experience" and gave them the go ahead for the valve job. A few days and several hundred dollars later I went to pick up the car. It still wouldn't start!!! I was pretty upset and let them know it. They took it back in the garage while I was waiting and figured out that the reason it wouldn't start was because the interlock switch in the gear shift was bad keeping it from starting. "So, how did you start it to work on it?" "We just started it under the hood shorting the solenoid." Lesson learned. Diagnose before you prescribe.

Sooooooo.............you're sayin' that you were SO mechanically-inclined, even back then, that you "bought" the idea that a valve job would correct a "no-crank" situation? Even your "life's experience" analogies don't ad up very well. DD

[Old Henry]

I try to follow the admonition of a great man known only as Paul who said:

"Prove all things; hold fast that which is good." (1 Thessalonians 5:21)

i.e. Listen to everyone. Consider carefully all suggestions. Don't accept or act upon any just because of the suggester's "experience" or "credentials". Test them and then implement only those that really work. Those with "experience" and "credentials" are not always right.

[JM 35 Sedan]

Originally Posted by zzlegend

HUMMMMM,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,This sounds familiar

Exactly what I was thinking.
So many of this members posts have started with the question of "how do I fix this problem", many good solutions are presented by other members, only to be ignored while some quick and dirty (read cheap) corrective action is taken instead. Then later a post is made on how this quick and dirty repair has lead to a complete catastrophic failure. Two engine failures, a universal joint failure, transmission, rear, etc., etc. I stopped posting on this members problem posts a long time ago because I found it was a waste of my time.

[zzlegend]

I fully understand John.

[Old Henry]

One is caused to wonder why those members who find this posters posts a total waste of time don't just go into their User CP settings and put him on their ignore list so that they won't be bothered by them any more as this poster has done for several other members whose posts became perpetually negative, critical, and offensive. May bring more peace to the overall community.

[JM 35 Sedan]

"May bring more peace to the overall community"


I seriously doubt that

[V8COOPMAN]

It's always too comical to ignore.......kind'a like watching Laurel and Hardy, but in real life. DD

[Old Henry]

I look at the title of this post and wonder, "How in the world did we get so far from the topic of cleaning out a fuel line?" So, I looked back and I think I started the detour with post #15 when I took offense at some of the suggestions that had been given and condemned them as I felt condemned. Looking back, I see that such was entirely uncalled for and I regret that I said what I did and apologize for highjacking the thread away to political and personal contention. I wish I could say that it will never happen again but I'm not that confident in my resolve to prevent it.

Sorry.

[VeryTangled]

Group Hug. Move on.

If I could I'd buy the car!

[prpmmp]

Originally Posted by Old Henry

I look at the title of this post and wonder, "How in the world did we get so far from the topic of cleaning out a fuel line?" So, I looked back and I think I started the detour with post #15 when I took offense at some of the suggestions that had been given and condemned them as I felt condemned. Looking back, I see that such was entirely uncalled for and I regret that I said what I did and apologize for highjacking the thread away to political and personal contention. I wish I could say that it will never happen again but I'm not that confident in my resolve to prevent it.

Sorry.

Old Henry you just keep being you!! I enjoy all your post and travels, and remember the only people that don't make mistakes are the ones that do nothing!! Pete

[johnh7]

Old Henry,

I like your posts both your trips and your trying to figure something out. Ignore those who's answers are not on point and are the more extreme, "jack up the radiator cap and drive a new car under it" type answers.

I liked the suggestion to use weed eater line. That was a great idea.

Anyway, keep up the posts.

[ford38v8]

Originally Posted by johnh7

Old Henry, ...I liked the suggestion to use weed eater line. That was a great idea....

No no, no. Use the weeds.


Henry, you're OK... Maybe.

[supereal]

The original line is copper lined steel. Increasing moisture in alcohol gas attacks void in the lining, resulting in rust. The correct line, with fittings, is less than twenty dollars at C&G. A new line is the only permanent fix. At our shop, we see lots of lines rusted nearly shut. The reason steel line is used is that copper will not withstand vibration or abrasion, and any leakage is a fire hazard.

[ford38v8]

Hey Bob, Good to see you up and full of vinegar again!

[JM 35 Sedan]

Originally Posted by ford38v8

Hey Bob, Good to see you up and full of vinegar again!

Yep, always good sound advice from Super!

[Ralph Moore]

This kinda reminds my of someone I knew, he had a pick up that would shudder at a certain speed. He checked the drive line, etc. and ws finally convinced it needed a transmission rebuild(automatic). Rebuilt tranny and $$$$ later, same problem. Someone suggested checking spark plugs, he hadn't done that, sure enough they were really bad.
$24.00 later and it ran great.
Never overlook the simple things.

[Royal Ryser]

This has been so much fun! I hope it keeps going.

[Bluebell]

So where did this start?
Is it as simple as the fuel pump sucking air at the site glass seal?

[Old Henry]

The story started here: https://www.fordbarn.com/forum/showthread.php?t=171201

Then went to here: https://www.fordbarn.com/forum/showthread.php?t=171851

Then here: https://www.fordbarn.com/forum/showthread.php?t=171979

Then this one you're on.

The story will continue . . .

[Tinker]

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So Craig. What did you find out? 3 threads running now. Just curious on how it turns out... Wonder if this is less about the car or the attention. Not my bag man.

Just a side note. New fuel lines might be a good selling point, even if it doesn't total turn out to be the biggest issue. Nice thing when handing a vehicle off to a buyer anyway.

Best of luck!

[Tinker]

But hey I might be on your ignore list!

[Old Henry]

I won't know more until I rebuild the fuel pump when the parts arrive in a few days. Hopefully that will solve the problem without any more fussing with anything.

When I decided to get my 47 back on the road 9 years ago I had to decide what approach I would take between customization and authenticity. I opted for original stock authenticity as much as possible. Part of that commitment was to not replace any part that was still working or could be made to work and, if it absolutely had to be replaced, replace it with NOS first and authentic new replacement part last. I started that engine that had sat for 31 years with all of the original spark plugs, belts, pulleys, pumps, generator, everything except the battery that hadn't lasted sitting 31 years. The video of that first start has had over a million views on YouTube. (Here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wY389S_KUjs) Others have other priorities and enjoy working and tinkering on their cars more than I do and replace parts pursuant to a different philosophy than I do. That's good for them and mine is good for me. Theirs makes them happy and mine makes me happy. I don't condemn them for the way they like to do things and hope none will condemn me because I like to do things differently.

Thus, I won't be replacing the fuel line in the 51 Custom unless absolutely necessary.

[Old Henry]

Originally Posted by Tinker

But hey I might be on your ignore list!

You are not. I have always enjoyed your posts and you have been a great help to me with many of your suggestions.

[Tinker]

Originally Posted by Old Henry

You are not. I have always enjoyed your posts and you have been a great help to me with many of your suggestions.

You'd be a first! Ha ha.

[Old Henry]

Originally Posted by Tinker

Wonder if this is less about the car or the attention. Not my bag man.

I'm just trying to solve a problem. That's all. Nothing more nor less.

[uncle max]

Originally Posted by Old Henry

I won't know more until I rebuild the fuel pump when the parts arrive in a few days. Hopefully that will solve the problem without any more fussing with anything.

When I decided to get my 47 back on the road 9 years ago I had to decide what approach I would take between customization and authenticity. I opted for original stock authenticity as much as possible. Part of that commitment was to not replace any part that was still working or could be made to work and, if it absolutely had to be replaced, replace it with NOS first and authentic new replacement part last. I started that engine that had sat for 31 years with all of the original spark plugs, belts, pulleys, pumps, generator, everything except the battery that hadn't lasted sitting 31 years. The video of that first start has had over a million views on YouTube. (Here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wY389S_KUjs) Others have other priorities and enjoy working and tinkering on their cars more than I do and replace parts pursuant to a different philosophy than I do. That's good for them and mine is good for me. Theirs makes them happy and mine makes me happy. I don't condemn them for the way they like to do things and hope none will condemn me because I like to do things differently.

Thus, I won't be replacing the fuel line in the 51 Custom unless absolutely necessary.

I have a KR Wilson fuel pump holding fixture that you're welcome to borrow if you're in SLC anytime soon. It's like having an extra pair of hands while working on them.

[Mike B]

Originally Posted by Old Henry

Others have other priorities and enjoy working and tinkering on their cars more than I do and replace parts pursuant to a different philosophy than I do. That's good for them and mine is good for me. Theirs makes them happy and mine makes me happy. I don't condemn them for the way they like to do things and hope none will condemn me because I like to do things differently.

Thus, I won't be replacing the fuel line in the 51 Custom unless absolutely necessary.

I admire your tenacity, but consider a plugged fuel line (as you were)...there's no way you could get it completely clear and clean...only hope would be replacement.

You'd be pushing crud into the tank, and flowing it back through.

Anyways, I'd take UM up on the offer...extra hands are nice

[Old Henry]

Originally Posted by Mike B

I admire your tenacity, but consider a plugged fuel line (as you were)...there's no way you could get it completely clear and clean...only hope would be replacement.

See post #20. The fuel line is not plugged nor restricted in any way as I had supposed when I started this thread. It may have air leaks but I won't know that until I rebuild the fuel pump and try it.

[Lanny]

I had a very slight leak in a fuel line. This was a NEW fuel line that
the previous owner had installed, and I could not find the small leak.
I reversed the hose on my shop vacuum cleaner so it blew air out,
and stuck the hose in my fuel filler. It didn't take long at all to see
exactly where the leak was, as a lite bit of gas started comming
out, just enough to show a definate leak.
The previous owner had drilled a very small hole in the floor under
the rear seat for a clamp to hold wires secure. As luck would have it,
he drilled the hole right into the new gas line, that went under that
part of the floor, and when I blew air into the tank, the gas seeped
out, so I found the leak.
When I took the small screw out, it leaked plenty then, mystery solved.











.

[Old Henry]

Originally Posted by Lanny

I had a very slight leak in a fuel line. This was a NEW fuel line that
the previous owner had installed, and I could not find the small leak.
I reversed the hose on my shop vacuum cleaner so it blew air out,
and stuck the hose in my fuel filler. It didn't take long at all to see
exactly where the leak was, as a lite bit of gas started comming
out, just enough to show a definate leak.
The previous owner had drilled a very small hole in the floor under
the rear seat for a clamp to hold wires secure. As luck would have it,
he drilled the hole right into the new gas line, that went under that
part of the floor, and when I blew air into the tank, the gas seeped
out, so I found the leak.
When I took the small screw out, it leaked plenty then, mystery solved.

Great idea! I did that very thing to test gas flow through my fuel line. (See post #20) I will do that again if I'm getting enough air in the line to bother the engine after I rebuild my fuel pump to confirm that there is, indeed, a leak. Whether or not I can find a leak, if there is too much air coming in. I will then replace the fuel line. I've had some great suggestions for doing that and will use them if and when I absolutely have to do that.

[Old Henry]

Drum roll . . . . Envelope please. . . . And the winners are: ford38v8, oldford2, Ross F-1, Tinker, and anyone else that suggested replacing the fuel line. I just did that and it solved the problem. But, I didn't do it until actually diagnosing that such was the problem by doing the winning diagnostic procedure that goes to: 51 MERC-CT for suggesting running the engine on a line from a gas can. I got a nice long piece of clear tubing, hooked it to the fuel pump, ran it through the firewall to a gas can inside the car, and drove it. Worked great and didn't stop or die no matter where I went, how far I went, or how long I drove. That clinched it for me that, even though I wasn't sure what was wrong with the old fuel line, I knew it was the problem. Had it replaced yesterday and works fine now.

Unfortunately, I have discovered another problem - the car is very susceptible to vapor lock. I'm not going to install an electric fuel pump on this car that I'm just trying to sell for the wife of my friend who died. I'm just going to park it in the shade whenever I can and hope I can find someone to blow into the gas tank filler pipe to get it started if it vapor locks.

[itslow]

Originally Posted by Old Henry

The story started here: https://www.fordbarn.com/forum/showthread.php?t=171201

Then went to here: https://www.fordbarn.com/forum/showthread.php?t=171851

Then here: https://www.fordbarn.com/forum/showthread.php?t=171979

Then this one you're on.

The story will continue . . .

This is a good example of why it's wise to start a thread and then continue it instead of creating multiple subsequent ones, or at least include a summary in the initial post of the symptoms and previous remedy attempts. It makes it very difficult to determine the back-story on the newer threads when there's no link back the the prior ones.

[trainguy]

VAPOR LOCK!!! O NO!!! lol