?? Class Action law suit ??

[mtflat]

Thanks Mike - I'm one that thinks there's too much litigation already. The only beneficiaries of class-action suits are the attorney's. And for all the litigation costs, the oil companies would have to jack up prices to cover them.

Would be adding to the problem. Supply and demand - use less, spend less.

[uncle max]

Q: What happens to attorneys who take Viagra?
A: They get taller.

[Scott H]

People don't hate attorneys...they hate the other guy's attorney!

[46ford]

Originally Posted by Scott H

Good luck trying to eat 'feed corn'
Its not what you think it is.

Oh I know what it is all right (note my location) It's almost knee high already BTW

[Robert Dip]

Does gasoline really cost more than in the old days??
Back in the mid 60's, a gallon of gas cost what....60 cents a gallon ( this is just a guess ) and today it costs $4.00 / gallon.....if I do the math 60 / 400 = 6.66 times the cost. If we made $90.00 / week back then as opposed to $600.00 / week today, that equates to 6.66 times the cost. Same thing ?? So, I am always mistified by the idea that gas costs so much more today. Maybe someone can correct me on this.

Robert

[Vic Piano]

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Originally Posted by Robert Dip

Does gasoline really cost more than in the old days??
Back in the mid 60's, a gallon of gas cost what....60 cents a gallon ( this is just a guess ) and today it costs $4.00 / gallon.....if I do the math 60 / 400 = 6.66 times the cost. If we made $90.00 / week back then as opposed to $600.00 / week today, that equates to 6.66 times the cost. Same thing ?? So, I am always mistified by the idea that gas costs so much more today. Maybe someone can correct me on this.

Robert

On Long Island, New York, in 1965, gas cost .37 cents a gallon, I worked at a grocery store while in High School in '65 and was paid minimum wage, $1.00 per hour (gross), my (net) take home pay was around $20.00 a week... To drive my '48 Tudor for a week from home to school, to work, etc.,(aprox. 80 miles) cost close to $7.00 and that didn't leave much extra to buy needed Ford parts and take a date to the Drive-In and Dinner... That’s why I had a large “Bud” beer can on a string hanging from the rearview mirror, everyone who got in the car put their pocket change in the beer can and we used it for gas money and sometimes beer…

[Mike51Merc]

Originally Posted by Robert Dip

Does gasoline really cost more than in the old days??
Back in the mid 60's, a gallon of gas cost what....60 cents a gallon ( this is just a guess ) and today it costs $4.00 / gallon.....if I do the math 60 / 400 = 6.66 times the cost. If we made $90.00 / week back then as opposed to $600.00 / week today, that equates to 6.66 times the cost. Same thing ?? So, I am always mistified by the idea that gas costs so much more today. Maybe someone can correct me on this.

Robert

Gas was .35/Gallon
A nice new car was $3,500
A nice new house was $35,000

Gas is $3.50/Gallon
A nice new car is $35,000
A nice new house is $350,000

Everything is relative.

[dude]

Don't know why you people don't understand, the Goverment is working for the people. The more we can give them the BETTER they can help us. By the way that was a joke...

[rotorwrench]

There are automobiles being manufactured in other countries as well as the US today that can attain fuel usage (miles per gallon) quantities in excess of the vehicles manufactured "for the US market" but they are not allowed to be marketed in the USA. You would think it would be due to the EPA and it is partly so. The other reason is taxation. The government needs the money from the fuel taxes in order to keep up the infrastructure of highways & road systems. Compressed natural gas could be used to power most vehicles but there is no taxation on this type of fuel set up yet so the government acts like it doesn't exist. There were plug in only electric vehicles made in Japan that were not allowed to be marketed in the USA. They will only allow the hybrid gas/electric vehicles. Some would argue that no one wants a plug in electric car. I sure don't know anyone that owns one unless you count antique electric cars and home built ones. I hope someone out there can prove me wrong.

When we run out of everything but coal, there is a good chance that the EPA would have long ago inacted laws that prohibit the use of coal as a fuel because it is a polutant producer that can not be sufficiently cleaned for the environment. This would be a fare amount of time in the future since we still have methane hydrates to use up after the oil & natural gas are gone.

Farmers have never gotten parity in this country like they demand in Europe. The middle men who control the commodity exchange of produce are the ones who pay the lobbyists. The farmers are just trying to eek out a living as best they can with ever increasing fuel prices and reducing levels of ground water for irrigation. Irrigation is an overhead that is rapidly diminishing due to dropping water tables and higher fuel & maintenance costs. There may not be much irrigation left in 20-years. We need farmers a lot more than they need us. They could keep on putting food on their tables after everyone else starved to death as long as the planet will sustain plant growth.

[G.M.]

Robert you have to go back a little further with your calculations. In the late 40s when I was a hot rod teenager it was 5 gallons for a dollar. In 1964 fuel oil was .08 per gallon. I had an 8,000 gallon fuel tank at the new factory I just built and put a pump on the loading platform. I drove a 190 D Mercedes that got 35 miles to the gallon. do a calculation on that. Now I have a Duramax diesel and just filled it yesterday at a cost of $180.00. what are you going to do?? I hope I don't run out of money. I'm on this spend down program so the money lasts as long as me. The last check which is made out to the undertaker has been calculated to bounce. So sue me. G.M.

[Mike51Merc]

Rotorwrench wrote "Compressed natural gas could be used to power most vehicles but there is no taxation on this type of fuel set up yet so the government acts like it doesn't exist."

Not so. There is an "alternative fuels tax" which is a road use tax on anything used to power an automobile. Technically, even guys who are doing vegetable oil fuel are subject to the tax.

As for CNG, the problem is distribution. You cannot reasonably liquify natural gas and transport it by truck. Neither can you accumulate it in big tank farms and store it. To use it as a motor fuel, it has to be compressed to extremely high pressure in order to get enough in a tank for a reasonable range between fill ups. Vehicles that run on CNG have special depots for refueling and the vehicles have to have blast shields installed in the event of a crash.

[rotorwrench]

The alternative fuels tax applies to producers which pass it on to the consumer. If some entrepreneur developed a system for home use that wouldn't blow up or break the bank, the tax man would have a hard time collecting. Not all homes are plumbed for gas but a percentage are in areas where gas is available. LNG is used more for shipping large quantities. Folks in Cleveland found out what happens if an LNG tank leaks back in 1944. The government has been scared of the stuff ever since.

[Mike51Merc]

Originally Posted by rotorwrench

The alternative fuels tax applies to producers which pass it on to the consumer. If some entrepreneur developed a system for home use that wouldn't blow up or break the bank, the tax man would have a hard time collecting. Not all homes are plumbed for gas but a percentage are in areas where gas is available. LNG is used more for shipping large quantities. Folks in Cleveland found out what happens if an LNG tank leaks back in 1944. The government has been scared of the stuff ever since.

Here's a direct quote of the Pennsylvania law. Your state may vary, but I doubt it.
Alternative Fuels Tax


Alternative fuels used to propel vehicles on public highways are subject to the alternative fuels tax. Alternative fuels include natural gas, compressed natural gas, liquid propane gas, liquified petroleum gas, alcohols, gasoline-alcohol mixtures containing at least 85 percent alcohol by volume, hydrogen, hythane, electricity and any other fuel not taxable as liquid fuels or fuels.

Each alternative fuel is converted to a gasoline gallon equivalent. The basis of this conversion is statutorily set at 114,500 Btu. The tax rate applied to the gasoline gallon equivalent equals the current liquid fuels tax and oil company franchise tax applicable to one gallon of gasoline.

Alternative fuels dealer-users must remit this tax. Reports and payments are due by the 20th day of each month for fuel sold or used in the preceding month. The Department of Revenue may permit dealer-users to report the tax due for reporting periods greater than one month, up to an annual basis, provided the tax is prepaid on an estimated basis.

As you can see, the dealer and the users are jointly liable.

[Fordors]

Hmmm, using heating oil in your diesel Mercedes just to avoid the .07 Penn. tax and .04 Fed tax; that's pretty classy. I'm a factory owner, why should I pay tax to support the roads I drive on? Let the blue collar stiffs worry about it!

[russcc]

As Senator Bob Dole from the corn belt said, when confronted with the facts about enthanol in fuel, he responded with, "I know, but we have to take care of the farmers". Poltics is the root cause, the solution is more of Henry Ford's ingenuity in action. Back to old Fords.

[deuce_roadster]

Having just been sued by someone who made claims they never intended to try to prove because they were just scamming my insurance company knowing they would settle out of court (thus never having to prove thier outrageous claims) to avoid trial costs. I have ZERO respect for lawyers. The ONLY reason an honest person ever needs a lawyer is ANOTHER LAWYER or the fear of one, when you get right down to it.

Bringing up the idea of a class action lawsuit reinforces my thoughts.
Shakespeare was right-look up his quote from Henry VI about lawyers!

Yeah, lets get back to FORDS!

[Mike51Merc]

Originally Posted by deuce_roadster

Having just been sued by someone who made claims they never intended to try to prove because they were just scamming my insurance company knowing they would settle out of court (thus never having to prove thier outrageous claims) to avoid trial costs. I have ZERO respect for lawyers. The ONLY reason an honest person ever needs a lawyer is ANOTHER LAWYER or the fear of one, when you get right down to it.

Bringing up the idea of a class action lawsuit reinforces my thoughts.
Shakespeare was right-look up his quote from Henry VI about lawyers!

Yeah, lets get back to FORDS!

If you REALLY look up Shakespeare's quote, you'll see that killing all the lawyers was the first step in a plot to take over the country.

[Scott H]

Originally Posted by Mike51Merc

If you REALLY look up Shakespeare's quote, you'll see that killing all the lawyers was the first step in a plot to take over the country.

Well DUh! That's because all the politicians are lawyers! To get rid of all the politicians you HAVE to kill all the lawyers!

I thought we were gonna get back to talking about old Fords

[G.M.]

Fordors, Back in 64 gas tax wasn't to much of a factor in the price of diesel fuel which was exactly the same as heating oil. My main savings was buying a full trailer load of fuel and the fact I had a years supply and could buy fuel at market opportunity. The side purpose was the conveinence of the pump right where I could fill up at any time. At 35 MPG and 150 miles per week equals 4 gallons, big time tax evasion?? G.M.

[bobscogin]

Two dimes will still buy a gallon of gas if they're silver. It's the paper dollar that's become worthless.

Bob