The Ford Barn

felix37 · 02-01-2014, 01:10 PM

I was just looking over my receipt from my local machine shop from the work they did on my flat head. I was very pleased with price and service I received. The business has been run by three generations and the owner (Bobby Roberts) is very knowledgable about Flat heads, probably why there is two or three on engine stands at any given time.
I thought I would post the various prices for the work they did to see how it compares across Barn land.

Block cleaned and bored 285.00

Crank turned .030/.030 90.00

Install can bearings. 35.00

Reface block. 85.00

Recondition rods. 96.00

Install new rod bushings 80.00

Remove 5 broken studs in
Block. Took 4.5 hours. 125.00

Install pistons on rods. 40.00

Grind valve seats. 70.00

8 rod bushings. 55.52

Total. 961.52

Karl Wolf · 02-01-2014, 01:24 PM

Your shop seems pretty reasonable... Except that the 5 studs @ 4.5 hours. That's a lot of time, other hand take a look at the hourly rate @ $125-
THAT'S cheap- $28/ hr.

I was $40/ hr. in the 1980's...

Karl

40cpe · 02-01-2014, 01:30 PM

I have nothing to compare, but the cost looks reasonable, maybe cheap.

How long was your block and rods in the shop?

felix37 · 02-01-2014, 01:46 PM

They, were there for a little over a month, but most of that time was waiting for parts that I provided. Egge sent me the wrong pistons and had to wait two weeks. They would not bore the block till they had pistons in hand. I also had to wait for floating bearings etc..
I'm sure our labor costs are a little lower in the south compared to other areas?

felix37 · 02-01-2014, 01:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Karl Wolf

Your shop seems pretty reasonable... Except that the 5 studs @ 4.5 hours. That's a lot of time, other hand take a look at the hourly rate @ $125-
THAT'S cheap- $28/ hr.

I was $40/ hr. in the 1980's...

Karl

Bobby told me my broken studs were some of the most difficult he ever dealt with.

66miles · 02-01-2014, 02:13 PM

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Sounds pretty good to me. I'm comparing apples with pears a bit though as I live in NZ where we suffer from a very small domestic market which is distant from suppliers. I had a flathead rebuilt by a shop in Auckland a few years ago, and I came out with very little change from $3000, although that included $1000 for new main and rod bearings alone. New pistons and rings were around $800 (if I can trust my memory). Seems like your shop has treated you OK!

Drbrown · 02-01-2014, 02:27 PM

Opinions please .... I realize it depends on where one lives, but is it generally as okay, better or worse to outright buy a rebuilt engine ? ( presumably from an outfit that has a good reputation and experience )

I'm in eastern upstate NY and don't know of a machine shop around this area that has any experience in rebuilding/working on flatheads .... maybe there's one hiding under the bushes. If I drove an hour or more south there might be one but would still have to have acceptable references. A few auto parts businesses here market them .... AdvancedAuto and perhaps Auto zone and NAPA ? Dan

rotorwrench · 02-01-2014, 02:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by felix37

Bobby told me my broken studs were some of the most difficult he ever dealt with.

FoMoCo made some very good quality studs and bolts for cylinder head hold down. You can really tell when you try to get them out after 50+ years or so. If they have electronic discharge machining equipment it doesn't take so long but those machines aren't cheap.

Shop rates have had to increase right along with everything else so that rates they are charging are not too far out of line for this day and age. Probably less than many others.

felix37 · 02-01-2014, 03:13 PM

I almost decided to have Bobby build my engine for an extra 400.00 bucks (that's his going rate for a flat head engine assembly) but I really wanted to learn to do this myself as most all the really good engine builders in my area are all up there in age. I'm 47 and hope to be messing with these things for many years to come, and I would like to pass this knowledge that I'm receiving down the line.
However, If Bobby would have assembled my engine, I would be driving it now! I have been doing my assembly very slowly! doing one step at a time and not moving to the next step till I'm absolutely satisfied.. Today I'm gaping my rings.

Ol' Ron · 02-01-2014, 03:49 PM

Some of these prices don't make any sense. How can you grind a crank .030 Under ( 150/200$ most places) and then charge 40 bucks to put the pistons on the rods. Then charge 70 dollars to grind the valves. I'll admit the total cost is low, that much worl around here would cost 1500.

oldford2 · 02-01-2014, 04:04 PM

Here is a good auto machine shop 30 miles from here in Schenectady, NY. Click below for their site and then click on the type of work to be performed and their prices will come up. These guys are good.
http://www.huntsmachine.com/labor.htm

John

34pickup · 02-01-2014, 05:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Drbrown

Opinions please .... I realize it depends on where one lives, but is it generally as okay, better or worse to outright buy a rebuilt engine ? ( presumably from an outfit that has a good reputation and experience )

I'm in eastern upstate NY and don't know of a machine shop around this area that has any experience in rebuilding/working on flatheads .... maybe there's one hiding under the bushes. If I drove an hour or more south there might be one but would still have to have acceptable references. A few auto parts businesses here market them .... AdvancedAuto and perhaps Auto zone and NAPA ? Dan

Be very skeptical about buying a "rebuilt" engine from Advanced or Autozone. I had a friend buy one of AUtozone's so called rebuilt engines. It never ran right. He decided to pull it apart to check it out himself. He found that the camshaft had the lobes welded up and then ground down by hand. This was a typical sbc so its not like you can't get a new cam for it fairly cheap. A few other really cheap ass things also that I forget were wrong with it. He decided to sue them when they refused to refund the purchase.

felix37 · 02-01-2014, 05:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ol' Ron

Some of these prices don't make any sense. How can you grind a crank .030 Under ( 150/200$ most places) and then charge 40 bucks to put the pistons on the rods. Then charge 70 dollars to grind the valves. I'll admit the total cost is low, that much worl around here would cost 1500.

not sure about what makes sense, but we have had two cranks turned this past month, one a Buick Nail head and one SBC both were still 90.00 each.
a few weeks ago he took .020 off my 81-t heads for 50.00

KiWinUS · 02-01-2014, 05:56 PM

Next week I will get prices for the same services from my great friend . I never know what he charges me for each procedure I just pay him what he tells me . Its too cheap I know.
The bottle of his choice (Wild Turkey 101) I am sure helps !!!!

Ross F-1 · 02-01-2014, 06:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ol' Ron

Some of these prices don't make any sense. How can you grind a crank .030 Under ( 150/200$ most places) and then charge 40 bucks to put the pistons on the rods. Then charge 70 dollars to grind the valves. I'll admit the total cost is low, that much worl around here would cost 1500.

The valve work cost caught my eye, too. Is that just the seats, and for adjustable lifters?

Cost is secondary to doing it right, nice if you got both!

Jeff/Illinois · 02-01-2014, 07:03 PM

Prices sound pretty reasonable and the work sounds good, by someone who knows what they are doing!

Anyone have any experience with Jasper rebuilt engines? Good, bad? For modern day cars?

Mart · 02-01-2014, 07:14 PM

I just dropped a couple of blocks to be bored and honed, the cost was the UK equivalent of $320 each. So your costs sound good to me.

Mart.

felix37 · 02-01-2014, 07:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ross F-1

The valve work cost caught my eye, too. Is that just the seats, and for adjustable lifters?

Cost is secondary to doing it right, nice if you got both!

yes, it is just to grind the valve seats.

sanborn · 02-01-2014, 07:36 PM

I just had my Merc worked on at a local shop------the prices are comparable to your prices. A lot depends on the location. And, pricing can vary on many things; for example, if a block is bored the "old fashioned way" by clamping the boring machine to an adjacent cylinder versus boring off the crank journals---there can be a major difference in price. Power honing versus the old manual honing is another area where the price is vastly different. Not many shops have "deck plates" for a flathead either.

hardtimes · 02-02-2014, 12:46 AM

Hey felix37,
Sounds like you have a good thing there ! I was wondering if your machinist 'balanced' the crank (charge$) after cutting is down ?
Wow, $125. for 4.5 hrs for four studs ! If he got them out without damage to threads, that seems very reasonable. Only took me a week to get four out (successfully). Let's see ...even at his low price I'd have to charge about 1K for those four

!

02-01-2014, 01:24 PM	#2
Karl Wolf Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Mill Valley,Ca. Posts: 1,509	Re: Machine shop costs and how they compare Your shop seems pretty reasonable... Except that the 5 studs @ 4.5 hours. That's a lot of time, other hand take a look at the hourly rate @ $125- THAT'S cheap- $28/ hr. I was $40/ hr. in the 1980's... Karl

02-01-2014, 01:30 PM	#3
40cpe Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Star, MS Posts: 4,025	Re: Machine shop costs and how they compare I have nothing to compare, but the cost looks reasonable, maybe cheap. How long was your block and rods in the shop?

02-01-2014, 01:46 PM	#4
felix37 Senior Member Join Date: Oct 2010 Location: Chattanooga, TN Posts: 1,093	Re: Machine shop costs and how they compare They, were there for a little over a month, but most of that time was waiting for parts that I provided. Egge sent me the wrong pistons and had to wait two weeks. They would not bore the block till they had pistons in hand. I also had to wait for floating bearings etc.. I'm sure our labor costs are a little lower in the south compared to other areas?

02-01-2014, 02:13 PM	#6
66miles Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2013 Location: Wellsford - NZ 0900 Posts: 214	Re: Machine shop costs and how they compare Sponsored Links (Register now to hide all advertisements) Sounds pretty good to me. I'm comparing apples with pears a bit though as I live in NZ where we suffer from a very small domestic market which is distant from suppliers. I had a flathead rebuilt by a shop in Auckland a few years ago, and I came out with very little change from $3000, although that included $1000 for new main and rod bearings alone. New pistons and rings were around $800 (if I can trust my memory). Seems like your shop has treated you OK!

02-01-2014, 02:27 PM	#7
Drbrown Senior Member Join Date: Oct 2013 Location: Glens Falls NY Posts: 1,267	Re: Machine shop costs and how they compare Opinions please .... I realize it depends on where one lives, but is it generally as okay, better or worse to outright buy a rebuilt engine ? ( presumably from an outfit that has a good reputation and experience ) I'm in eastern upstate NY and don't know of a machine shop around this area that has any experience in rebuilding/working on flatheads .... maybe there's one hiding under the bushes. If I drove an hour or more south there might be one but would still have to have acceptable references. A few auto parts businesses here market them .... AdvancedAuto and perhaps Auto zone and NAPA ? Dan

02-01-2014, 03:13 PM	#9
felix37 Senior Member Join Date: Oct 2010 Location: Chattanooga, TN Posts: 1,093	Re: Machine shop costs and how they compare I almost decided to have Bobby build my engine for an extra 400.00 bucks (that's his going rate for a flat head engine assembly) but I really wanted to learn to do this myself as most all the really good engine builders in my area are all up there in age. I'm 47 and hope to be messing with these things for many years to come, and I would like to pass this knowledge that I'm receiving down the line. However, If Bobby would have assembled my engine, I would be driving it now! I have been doing my assembly very slowly! doing one step at a time and not moving to the next step till I'm absolutely satisfied.. Today I'm gaping my rings.

02-01-2014, 03:49 PM	#10
Ol' Ron Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Chester Vt Posts: 8,879	Re: Machine shop costs and how they compare Some of these prices don't make any sense. How can you grind a crank .030 Under ( 150/200$ most places) and then charge 40 bucks to put the pistons on the rods. Then charge 70 dollars to grind the valves. I'll admit the total cost is low, that much worl around here would cost 1500.

02-01-2014, 04:04 PM	#11
oldford2 Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: pittsfield, MA Posts: 2,086	Re: Machine shop costs and how they compare Here is a good auto machine shop 30 miles from here in Schenectady, NY. Click below for their site and then click on the type of work to be performed and their prices will come up. These guys are good. http://www.huntsmachine.com/labor.htm John

02-01-2014, 05:56 PM	#14
KiWinUS Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Charlotte NC KiWi-L100 available here Posts: 2,968	Re: Machine shop costs and how they compare Next week I will get prices for the same services from my great friend . I never know what he charges me for each procedure I just pay him what he tells me . Its too cheap I know. The bottle of his choice (Wild Turkey 101) I am sure helps !!!!

02-01-2014, 07:03 PM	#16
Jeff/Illinois Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Posts: 2,792	Re: Machine shop costs and how they compare Prices sound pretty reasonable and the work sounds good, by someone who knows what they are doing! Anyone have any experience with Jasper rebuilt engines? Good, bad? For modern day cars?

02-01-2014, 07:14 PM	#17
Mart Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Solihull, England. Posts: 8,764	Re: Machine shop costs and how they compare I just dropped a couple of blocks to be bored and honed, the cost was the UK equivalent of $320 each. So your costs sound good to me. Mart.

02-01-2014, 07:36 PM	#19
sanborn Senior Member Join Date: Jul 2010 Location: Shelbyville TN Posts: 174	Re: Machine shop costs and how they compare I just had my Merc worked on at a local shop------the prices are comparable to your prices. A lot depends on the location. And, pricing can vary on many things; for example, if a block is bored the "old fashioned way" by clamping the boring machine to an adjacent cylinder versus boring off the crank journals---there can be a major difference in price. Power honing versus the old manual honing is another area where the price is vastly different. Not many shops have "deck plates" for a flathead either.

02-02-2014, 12:46 AM	#20
hardtimes Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: South California Posts: 6,188	Re: Machine shop costs and how they compare Hey felix37, Sounds like you have a good thing there ! I was wondering if your machinist 'balanced' the crank (charge$) after cutting is down ? Wow, $125. for 4.5 hrs for four studs ! If he got them out without damage to threads, that seems very reasonable. Only took me a week to get four out (successfully). Let's see ...even at his low price I'd have to charge about 1K for those four!