French flathead info/questions

[johndee138]

I just purchased a low hours French Flathead and have some questions about a number of particulars involved with putting this motor in my 36.
I have read the Tardel booklet on the subject and any ( sometimes confusing) info online.
What water pumps will work?
Flywheel/ clutch changes/mods needed?
full flow oil system preferred?
Special stud with O rings for the headbolt and the sources for same?
Can I hog off the governor boss on the back of the motor without total disassembly as long as I block off the passages well and clean up real good post hogging?
Will 59AB heads work and are they the ideal candidates or is there a better choice out there.
This is a complete motor, the heads are off for inspection(looks good too!)
Any ideas about a PCV setup?
I will be running an early 4bbl Rochester carb set up for me by Charlie Schwendler on an Offy intake.
My main concerns are reliability and economy,

All you experts out there, feel free to chime in please, I know there are many ways to do this, I just want to do it once.

[rotorwrench]

Check this site out. Over on the left column near the bottom, there is info about the French SUMB army truck motors along with loads of other information. http://www.btc-bci.com/~billben/flathead.htm

Ford's presence in France goes farther back than those motors but most folks are referring the the late one that is a half breed between the 8BA and the 59A designs.

It's best to find the corresponding USA built parts like the oil pan, water pumps, manifold, etc... This way you can get most things to fit up better and that are easier to find parts for. I think there are some metric thread fasteners involved but not many and can be changed out. The info should be in that article.

[Mart]

I have a bit of french flatty experience I will add my input in blue.

Originally Posted by johndee138

I just purchased a low hours French Flathead and have some questions about a number of particulars involved with putting this motor in my 36.
I have read the Tardel booklet on the subject and any ( sometimes confusing) info online.
What water pumps will work? If you can tolerate the forward location of the fan belt you want 8ba truck style with the wide groove pulley. these have the pulleys at the same offset so you can use a single belt.
Flywheel/ clutch changes/mods needed?Yeah. You want to use a 59A type oil pan, flywheel, clutch assy and starter as a matched set.
full flow oil system preferred? Don't bother me, I use either a bypass filter or nothing.
Special stud with O rings for the headbolt and the sources for same? I use the existing stud. I put a chamfer on the bottom of the head at that location to accommodate an o ring
Can I hog off the governor boss on the back of the motor without total disassembly as long as I block off the passages well and clean up real good post hogging? You are on yourn own with that one, how confident are you that no material will remain in the oil passages?
Will 59AB heads work and are they the ideal candidates or is there a better choice out there. Yeah, there are bypass ports at the front of the head surface that should be plugged. I use 8BA type heads on mine.
This is a complete motor, the heads are off for inspection(looks good too!)
Any ideas about a PCV setup? Yeah, I plumbed a pcv under the thickstun inlet on my roadster.
I will be running an early 4bbl Rochester carb set up for me by Charlie Schwendler on an Offy intake.
My main concerns are reliability and economy,

All you experts out there, feel free to chime in please, I know there are many ways to do this, I just want to do it once.

Further: The French pistons have a pointy dome. they can clash with the flatter domes in the non-French heads. This can be corrected by machining if fussy or by filing and grinding if not fussy (me).
The French front pulley can be machined down leaving a single sheave that aligns with the water pumps.
You can fit a 59A type cam and run a distributer at the front like a 59A. If you do you have to clearance the cap slightly to clear the front pulley.


Hope this helps.

Mart.

[Brian]

One more thing that hasn't been touched [I think] the French motor does not have the holes drilled for the engine radius rods; the two holes, one each side down bottom area of bell housing.
And, you will need to remove that governor housing to fit this block into a 36, because it will not clear firewall.

[FlatJan]

What Mart said, plus:
i did use a 59ab pan and starter but kept french clutch and flywheel for starting. Works ok but this is heavy stuff as it is a 11" clutch.
I didn´t find domed pistons in my engine (2. over rebuilt in 1996) and had no clearence issue with navarro heads. But they did this engines for 40+years so check what you got..
Water pumps i used 8BA-widebelt-truck-style from speedy bill.

If you need the O-Ring, the type/size is mentioned in Verns "How to Rebuild and Modify Ford Flathead V-8 Engines" in one of the french sections. Unfortunately i don´t have the book with me right now otherwise i could tell you.
It is only on the stud, not on the other bolts.

If you unscrew any stud use a lot of penetrating oil and time before otherwise they will shear off and leave you with a lot of nasty work.
Now ask me how i know that

Use sealent when putting them back.


@ Mart,
can you show some pics of your PCV-Installation? is it the Royal Kustoms setup?
Did you plug it between the gallery-hole that goes down from the valley to the crankcase and the inlet ?

thanks Jan

[HotRodmicky]

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Jan , Mart did a write up somewhere , but i dont no where....maybe mart can post the link
Nice setup .
Its even cooler that Mart did go over 100mph in Pendine with the car/engine .
So did i , but i have a bigger engine and that shows it takes much more to be fast
Congrats Mart
Back to topic
Michael

[HotRodmicky]

Jan , Mart did a write up somewhere , but i dont no where....maybe mart can post the link
Nice setup .
Its even cooler that Mart did go over 100mph in Pendine with the car/engine .
So did i , but i have a bigger engine and that shows it takes much more to be fast
Congrats Mart
Back to topic
Michael

[FlatJan]

Hey Micha,

ok i´ll look it up - see u in FI?

Jan

[Mart]

My pcv setup was a one-off. It relies on the design of the Thickstun inlet, and also it heavily relies on the exhaust crossover passages being blanked off.

It was not the Royal kustoms setup - just what I made myself. I have some pics, I'll see if I can post up a thread and link top it from here.

Thanks Micha, I appreciate the comment re the 100mph run. I know I went as fast as I could with my motor. I could see you went slightly faster - very well done. Yours is a bigger car so I can appreciate your motor must be pumping out considerably more hp. We'll have to hook up for a chat next time.

Mart.

Edit: Here's a link to the thread - I put it on the hamb as the picture hosting is a bit better there.
https://www.jalopyjournal.com/forum/...#post-12166945
M.

[miwi]

I'm runing a 239 French block in my F1. I'm using the Aluminium pan of the French together with flywheel and clutch.
I didn't change the position of the dip stick as Jens Munk recommend it.
In my F1 is enough room. I didn't have the big govoner boss from the 255 cui French blocks. On the 239 it is smaller. But it still interferes with the accelerator linkage Therefore I change the accelerator linkage to wire linkage with Lokar pedal.
The PCV is from Royal Kustoms and it works well (see Pictures).I use a 59Ab single intake together with a Stromberg 97.
As Mart said Bypass oil cleaner or nothing. I have the by pass oil cleaner installed at the Firewall.
I didnt used the truck WPU, I used german truck pumps. The have a smaller belt but I run the bigger belt on it. It work and I have a spare one with me.
The Piston have a flat dome. I'm using Edelbrock 59AB heads on it.
I can highly recommend Bubba's electronical distributor's. It work great. If you are using the alumium front cover you have to Keep in mind that the shaft length of the French Distributor is different compared to the 8BA. Also the clamping of the French Distributor is different that to the 8BA.